Hey artguy, have you considered getting the intake manifolds ported and polished and getting a ported TB? The exhaust manifold from M2 that comes with the turbos is allready ported, right? There ARE a few more mods you can still do to the engine to get more more HP out of it.

I'm just thinking of ways that you might be able to possibly get maybe 450rwhp out of the M2 twins.

 

alright i might look a little stupid here, but what is the "big list". dont castrate me all at once guys. haha.

paul

artguy: i personally am very happy with the fact that you have followed up with the posting of the outcome of those turbos. thanks a lot. . . and keep it up. it makes me feel stupid for going single. haha.

 

It is an email mailing list that still exists. Most people nowadays don't like it because you get tons of emails a day and looks rather bland as opposed to viewing everything on an organized forum.

 

ahhhhhh yes. . . kind of like the datalogit forum. i get emails from that all the time. i never turned it off cause i might see some info that i need.

thanks,
paul(his eyes are opened now, and he sees everything, haha)

 

You never should have had them closed to begin with

 

How can the stock ic restrict flow? Do aftermarket cores manage airflow more efficiently? I always though the primary advantage was the temp drop, which often comes at the expense of a pressure drop. If the M2 flows better than the stock wouldn't that INCREASE boost, not drop it? You didn't say your boost increased after putting in the M2 so I'm wondering if what you're feeling is a result of the temp drop not increased airflow.

regardless, thanks for posting your impression/experience. I can't wait to see the dyno sheet.

 

If the stock IC from inlet to outlet has a 2 psi pressure drop, then the turbos have to make 14 psi for the engine to see 12. If your boost controller is setup correctly, then the M2 med which has only a .62 or whatever it is, then boost should still be the same 12 psi, but now the turbos only have to make 12.62 psi for the engine to see 12 psi and its doubly cooler intake charge air now. Turbos aren't having to work as hard to make 12 psi so its cooler coimng out of the turbos and then the IC is larger and cools the charge air even more. Just need to add some fuel to go with the cooler, denser air and more HP.

What was the spool up for the M2 units? In another thread, my 99 spec turbos make 12 psi by 2800 rpms in 3rd an 4th gear? How does the M2 unit compare? I know they'll be able to make more HP at higher boost than the 99's since you don't want to run the 99s higher than 15psi safely/reliably, just wondering how fast it spools up?

Tim

 

laugjesse2: the entire internals are replaced on the m2 set....they are replaced by garret gt30 ballistics....m2 sees a temp drop of 80 degrees ferenheit due to the larger wheels and the more efficient design of the garret internals. at 16lbs they are not overboosting like the stock set...

at 16 lbs of boost which is where im running these as soon as its tuned....the factory turbos would be near melt down due to the size of the wheels and the sleeve style bearing.

the m2 set has to work a lot less than the stock set when it comes to high boost....the garrets are initially designed to run 25lbs of boost for their original application. M2 firmly claims they will handle 16-20 lbs.

these turbos EFFICIENCY RANGE starts at 14lbs and actually have a sweet spot toward 16lbs and higher.

at 12lbs those turbos are barely moving...at 12 lbs on the stock set they are over boosting....garret designed their set for high boost and mazda designed their set for 10 lbs. simple as that.

14lbs of boost on the m2 set has way more flow than 14lbs on the stock set. the m2 set is not working hard at 14lbs...the factory set is stressed to the max at 14lbs.

the factory wheels barely move with your fingers if you try to spin them....i could spin the m2 set with my mouth blowing over them if i blew hard...a touch sends them spinning.

the manifold heat is still there....but it is less than the stock set....80 degrees less...the stocks set..even the 99s are working way too hard at anything above 14lbs simply because they were designed to run 10-13 lbs max and not 20 like the garrets.

its also not just a new wheel and bearing on there...the housings (snails) have been machined out for greater flow and to fit the entire new garret cartriges.


hope this answers your questions.

i will dyno tune as soon as i find a dyno to do it. my option may be to go haltech and sell the pfc...i dont know what else to do.

.....yes the m2 set eliminated my low end lag problem caused by my streetport. they did what i wanted them to which is they gave me my fun back. ask goracer..he runs non seq high boost on his car and he knows how responsive my turbos are. his car is a beauty...but hes not running the m2's. the car has a lot more torque feel low end...i wish i had dyno sheets to show you...im sorry that i cant find a tuner to help me here in so cal...soon i hope. ive been looking...my only option may be to take it to a fantastic domestic tuner and hope for the best. i definitely will not ever deal with xs.

i do not have my exhaust manifold ported...it is possible to do so but what happens is that it becomes too thin and will crack more easily...i want reliability too....i had cracking problems with the stock set previously....i spent too much money on the car to deal with that again. high boost and thin manifolds..no fun in fixin that lol.

full boost on these things happens just before 2800rpms .... FULL BOOST....if i run 15 lbs its there...if i run 14lbs its there...

what other mods would you suggest flybye??


jason

 

These thing sound potentially great. I've noticed that, with basically all the bolt-ons and a streetport, if i lose a street race its generally in the initial 1-car jump that alot of big-bore cars like Z06s have, especially if i don't hit the rev-range just right ... after that we're dead even at least.

Hard to believe you can't find someone to lambda-tun it. Couldn't you just drive to M2? Or will they not work w/ the PFC?

I'm dying for real numbers on these, could be the solution i'm looking for.

 

Well, you allready mention you didn't want to port the exhaust manifold. I was also wondering if you had ported & polished the lower & upper intake manifolds ported, and if you have a ported TB. Even something like removing the double throttle butterflies will help in airflow. Well, at least I felt a differance I'm not sure how the M2 turbos come, but coating them might also make a differance as well. I mean, if ya got the cash, I'd polish (the internals) and then jethot coat: turbos, Y-pipe, upper and lower intake manifoldWhen I got my upper intake manifold coated, it made a massive differance. I mean, I can really tell, and so did my friend, how much faster the engine produced power.

One of my buddies that had a full custom single kit built for him, well, the builder even told him "If you get the DP coated, full boost can come on almost 500rpms faster.

 

Have them slap an M2 badge on the rear, some M2 stickers on the sides and comp you a M2 radiator!

All hail M2 Perfomance power!

 

ANOTHER NEW THING....

saw a set of m2 turbos today..stage 2....good for 450 hp....instead of 400....they are more expensive...by a grand....too much for me...but i saw the wheels and they were friggen huge compared to stock...they literally spun with a light breath...made me jealous actually...they were the next size up gt30s from what i understood...they were out of the smaller wheels and the guy got a free upgrade without even knowing it. perty nice.

supposedly they are near the maximum size for getting power out of that manifold...I will be very curious as to how his car performs.

j


j