afgmoto1978

iTrader: (6)

Nooooo

muibubbles

iTrader: (36)

i went through a lot of engines in the rx8, none which were my fault.
1 defected motor from factory
2 crappy rebuild-leaked coolant
3 crappy rebuild- poor compression
4 finally a good rebuild

all by the same company which they warenteed, unfortunately paying my mechanic to pull and install an engine 3 times was not fun.

thats a stupid statement. who doesnt want thier car to be perfect or meet their standards when they put endless hours, blood, sweat and tears into their car...

because i learned everything i know on this car. if you dont ask you will never learn. not all my threads are engine related.

Most fd owners have broken fd's because everyone wants it to meet a certain standard before they take it out, hence why people get caught up in build threads for years. its the endless pursuit of having the perfect Fd.

and if you are implying that to me, none of the engines were my fault. and off the top of my head i cant think of anything that i personally fcked up......

to some extent. since your content with how you have your car sure that would be true. for others who mod their car you have to do the necessary upgrades to handle the power. hence u would upgrade something even if it is working.

maybe im just taking this as defensive but you make it sound like things that have gone wrong in my car are all my fault and its poorly built because i did all the work.

for all those other people commenting
i already have RA seals and aem water meth, this car by all means was/is not a budget build.


+1 although i baby it more than i should lol its just too loud, need to go back to 3" lol

REVIT93RX7

I honestly cannot say anything bad about my FD. I bought it in Sept of 1992 with 8 miles on it. Got a good deal because it was hail damaged. Very minor. I drove it as a DD until 2002. Made some changes then on the road till 2004. Finally a coolant seal failed at 87k miles. I have completely rebuilt the car, paint new motor etc. Tried to sell it twice, couldn't do it. The looks are amazing. So now i drive it twice a week and it's wonderful. Glad I never sold it!

DCrosby

I remember that / a hailstorm, I was sleeping that afternoon in my parents house, and all of a sudden this horrendous pounding on the roof, I thought the house was getting pulled out of the ground, I look outside, thinking I had left my car (1992 Eclipse) outside, and thankfully I had parked it in the garage, and it was Okay, but several neighbor's cars looked like golf *****... Ah my misspent youth in Florida...

Force13B

iTrader: (19)

The car still runs, drives, idles perfect. I need to compression check it but i'm not sure why my ECU kept losing connection to the laptop mid run.

afgmoto1978

iTrader: (6)

Good, I need you to pay up on the front splitter I'm making you soon.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

I was really commenting on your FD ownership, not the 8 as i never followed that. (i hardly go on 8club anymore etc).


Obviously everyone wants the perfect FD but things cant always go your way, all the time. Hey i want to have the perfect FD, who doesnt? My car has dings, the passenger side sits an inch higher than the driver side, i have an exhaust leak and my shifter console is falling apart. Those are minor things to fix sure but people usually find a reason to go all out when something goes wrong. I followed your threads and you went through alot with your car. Which is cool. I admire your dedication but i feel like, IMO, there could have been an easier route. I would have done it differently. As for my "minor" problems, i couldnt care less and when i get to fixing it, i will.

As of right now, i just drive the car because well, its working. FD owners should take advantage of running FD's.




Dont get me wrong, im not criticizing your thread making. Make all the threads in the world. I dont know sh*t about the FD really and i've owned it for almost 7 years. I learn as the problems occur to be honest. I love when people make threads because if its an interesting topic, i read and study the answers from the veterans and i dont have to make a thread myself when the problem for me happens etc.


Understandable which is why you'll get very mixed replies in this thread about the love/hate, because people have different approaches and routes for their FD.

Never said it was your fault, i think you're thinking im attacking you and im not. I just realized since you made a thread about this topic, it was finally a chance for me to ask cause i been wondering all this time.

I mentioned IRP and JPR because those are GREAT people, as i've heard because i never used them. But im saying with 7 engines? I would have gone to the very best after like the 2nd or even 3rd one. Otherwise, there is another problem lying if you keep going through engines like that.


Of course. But dude im not a noob to this forum, i been on this forum for mucho tiempo lol, i have read almost every thread you can think of lol. Meaning i have seen people change and replace parts aimlessly because they get bored, because they change their mind, because they want something different. I know because i was in that phase before. I went through like 4 shifters in less than a year cause i wanted the feel of it. During those 4 changes, i have ruined the shifter console and cracked most of the plastic clips our great interiors have because of this. Now i learned to just STOP and replace things as i go along. When i have alot of time and space, then i will say F it, and THEN go all out.

Again no, not saying its your fault. I just replied according to what i always wondering recently. It may seem like i was attacking you but i really wasnt. So sorry if it sounded like that.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

Or maybe thats why your report was kinda bad??

Honestly, its all opinion. LIke i said before, i been here a long time. I have seen the same circle of problems from stock FD's to extremely modified ones. FD's on the road now have a VAST range of types of drivers.

I drive my car the way i would drive any car. If i wanted a car i can mash on all day and not have a problem, i'd get a c6 z06.

I've driven the rx8. Its too slow. AWESOME interior and looks but too slow. I would get bored very easily. And like i said before, i have a daily driver so the time i dont drive the FD, just makes it more exciting for the time i do get to drive it. I think thats ths secret for a long lasting ownership lol

Btw, im still thinking of getting that s2k for a daily driver, probably after the winter.

Prometheus

iTrader: (2)

pay up on my oil coolers!

GMO-RX7

iTrader: (21)

Im gonna start like this: THE DAMN ENGINE MOUNTS GO THROUGH THE OIL PAN!! LOL (kinda) I bought my car in the fall of 2008, I had been searching near and far for an FD shell at the right price so I could build it up. My friend took me to an auto auction where I test drove an S2000 and I decided I liked it. I bought a 2005 S2000 with 23,000 miles on it and the engine seized up the first day i had it. After a lot of screwing around with the dealership I got my money back for the car. The dealership had a bad reputation and I regret ever dealing with them. I had been searching previously for an FD and then I find one for sale within 5 miles of where I lived and it had a reman engine with 10k on it. I had already driven a friend of mine's FD when I lived in Arizona earlier that summer and knew how awesome it was. I went and test drove the car and that was it, I knew I had to have it. I bought it the next day. I daily drove the car for a good while. I drove the car to Tampa Florida and back problem free. A little bit of drifting it and soon I was leaking oil from the pan... I was spending more on oil then I was on gas for a while! I find out the only way to fix it is to pull the engine or drop the cradle. I decided to pull the engine over the winter and reseal the pan. It didn't happen like that. I had fallen in love and learned alot about the car and what it was capable of by the time I was ready to put the engine back in. So I decided to install a new ported engine and single turbo. I had high hopes to be done by winter and enjoying the car this summer but being laid off of two jobs in the last year helped to change that. So here I am summer almost over and car still not finished but nearing completion, crossing my fingers everything goes right. Either way, this is the car for me and I hope to be an FD owner for life.

Howard Coleman

iTrader: (6)

given the subject, this thread could easily be the longest on the board

blown turbo'd rotaries...

no more rice said it best in post 2:

"These engines produce very high hp per cc"

here are the comparatives (again). and this is probably the 5th time i have posted them and some are getting bored but until everyone understands these numbers i will continue to post them...

stock FD 255 flywheel hp/159 cubic inches = 1.60 hp per cubic inch

corvette ZR1 supercharged, intercooled, etc 638 hp/376 cubic inches = 1.69 hp per cubic inch

Mercedes AMG SL65 twin turbos, intercooled etc 661 hp/365 cu inches = 1.81 hp per cubic

and who has a stock FD?

a little exhaust etc and we are making 350 REAR WHEEL hp or 402 flywheel hp/159 cubic inches is 2.53 hp per cubic inch!!!!!!

and a 350 rw FD is considered MODERATE as to hp levels!

NOT SO

combine the huge combustion chamber pressure and heat w a clearly more fragile interior architecture and you get the stories in this thread. the primary weak component is the apex seal and it does need some special love.

special love can be found here:

https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-specific-1993-2002-16/making-case-rotary-powered-fd-fix-806104/

a scant 5 years ago very very few people used AI to deal w the high CCP on the turbo'd motor. the result of course is a huge number of blown motors and V8 FDs. today, many FD owners have added AI and the result has been less biz for engine builders.

given the high hp per displacement (2.6 liters) and fragile apex seals everything does need to be built right. i will say that i am often shocked as i disassemble incoming motors. many have items in backwards, are poorly ported etc etc. there are alot of people out there evidently that really either take a casual approach to build quality or just are ignorant. and there are numerous people doing good work.

the key is it is crucial you find the right person to work with. if you don't you will be re-continuing the search process or giving up.

i have a customer currently that has gone thru a long string of motors, the last two came from a major outfit and are overported (on the close) by a half an inch. after failing twice (eating the leading edge of the side seal) he was told it must be the "tune!" unfortunately his excellent condition irons are complete junk. BTW, i will not disclose the name of the builder because i do not have DIRECT knowledge of this, i only have my client's comments. if he wishes to disclose that's his business.

i absolutely marvel at my client's RESOLVE, after so many broken motors, to stick w the rotary. 'makes me feel like the guy on the cable channel who comes in and fixes the screwed up houses...

so there's the need to fixture the motor properly (meaning employing proper systems for the motor), build quality and tune.

after doing road tuning on my car for a number of years i switched to dyno tuning in 04 and found it to be miles ahead of what i had been doing. just like engine building there is a vast difference in quality of output. i was lucky to find my guy, Luke Stubbs at Beyond Redline. we have worked together on my setup generally doing 2 sessions a year since 04 with each session being probably 6 hours and 25-35 4th gear 2-8000 rpm pulls.

when dynoing, approach it like you are preparing for the Indy 500. preparation is EVERYTHING for a dyno session. your map sensor and FPR hoses should be double tiewrapped etc. most dyno sessions are spent chasing problems rather than tuning.

deliver your car w instrumentation.. you need a loggable EGT, a loggable fuel pressure along w all the other normal stuff. instrumentation pays big dividends in avoiding blown motors and generating a better tune.

if you do your homework your turbo'd rotary will deliver both the performance you seek and reliability.

then you won't be posting in this thread.

howard

gracer7-rx7

iTrader: (16)

Most FD owners and FC owners have broken cars b/c the person "modding" them doesn't have a clue. Just read through some of the threads on here of the dumb hacks aka mods some people do...

Most of those same people don't or don't want to recognize their own mistakes or lack of understanding.


I have owned and driven rotaries since the early 90s after I graduated college and had a job (unlike some who go thou$and$ in debt to mod their car). All of them have been the most reliable cars I have ever owned - unlike the BMWs, VWs, Audis and other assorted enthusiast cars I've owned over the years. No heartbreak here. These cars are awesome.

Supernaut

iTrader: (83)

guiltyyyy

no_more_rice

Little question dyno tuning is more accurate, the biggest challenge seems to be keeping the engine cool. Do big fans in front of the IC really do anything? I guess some people ice the IC as well, which seems like cheating.

rx7rcer09

i had fuel issues drop in pressure, replaced the fuel filter which we all know is a bitch thought it was all good, took it to the shop for a street tune. still dropping pressure under load found out the aftermarket fuel pump was burnt up now i have a stocker in there and need an ignition amp. lol its never ending but atleast its an easy fix.

no_more_rice

Run iridium plugs and good coils and you won't need an amp < 400 rwhp, I have no issues whatsoever with ignition break-up all the way to redline. Also, chuck the stock fuel filter in the garbage can and get an Aeromotive. This goes back to my comment about robust supporting equipment for these motors - all the pieces have to be there, or it's horrific fail.

DCrosby

You do realize, or maybe by joining in 2009, maybe you don't but EVERY FD I've seen / Heard of has a lot of the same problems as everybody else, but also every FD I've seen has mind boggling issues, that nobody is quite sure what it is or how to fix it. Now you can come in here and say, well MY MECHANIC, is a god and knows everything, but I've seen some rotary gods just bang their heads on the steering wheel in amazement, on what could be wrong, we did everything, and then they suggest something like a ground kit, or a rebuild, or a vacuum hose rebuild. Which is like in the IT industry asking someone, did you re-boot the computer ? It's a cop out.

Either way all FD's have their own unique issues, and every owner is painfully aware of what they are, even if it's a burnt out bulb, and everybody tackles them in different ways...

-DC

no_more_rice

?

Not sure what you're referring to specifically, your rambling post didn't make much sense, and it wasn't addressed to you in the first place. I've owned an FD for 12 years, and I have a better idea of what works and what doesn't than most.

rx7rcer09

im going for well over 400 i need an amp lol. most of the FD's around here are 400+ so i cant be last in the pack

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

I just wanted to poke my head in and say that there's zero problems with the oem fuel filter, just relocate it so that it's tucked up out of the way between the fuel tank and rear subframe

Howard Coleman

iTrader: (6)

"there's zero problems with the oem fuel filter"

yup.

but since the filter is a maintainence item you still are left w the $4000 question which is: is it partially plugged.

sure your HIN gauge shows 43.5 psi static but what is your fuel pressure at 8000 and 15 psi boost... where it COUNTS.

'don't know do you.

a partially occluded filter is LETHAL.

spend $70 and get yourself a 100 psi digital pressure sensor.

remove the really neat but close to worthless little analog gauge screwed in to your FPR and screw in the pressure sensor. hook it up to your datalogit and log your fuel pressure... at 8000 rpm, at 15--20 psi boost. where you really need to know.

your data will be so accurate you can subtract your static pressure and you will have an extremely accurate boost reading.

just another essential item so you don't blow your motor. and think of all the money you will save because you won't be changing fuel filters w a calendar, rather when they need to be changed.

it never ends $$$

never

hc

DCrosby

Sorry I'll make myself more clear, Every Vehicle has it's own Quirks ! Having Owned 2 FD's I know this first hand, and you having been around FD's I think you'd realize this as well.

squealy

iTrader: (12)

I figured I'd chime in on this thread.... seems appropriate, since i'm finally now able to enjoy the car the way I intended when i bought it, and how i imagined when i was a 16 year old kid drooling over them...


Rotary love first started for me at 16 when i saw my first FD Rx7. I test drove my first one @ 19. It was a touring model, and I almost bought it right then, but realized it wasn't going to be a great car to get me through university

Fast forward 10 years...
I found my car in an eBay auction, and ended up buying it outside of the auction after it ended. Big mistake. It was a sale from a dealership in Arlington, Texas, and had it shipped north to my home in Barrie, Ontario, Canada. I was totally excited, and couldn't wait to see it roll off the truck. I didn't have plates or insurance yet, but i had to go for a boot, so i went for a rip up the street to fill it up with gas, and then home to park my new baby in the garage....

and it promptly barfed coolant all over my driveway.

It was sold as having a solid engine, I had a forum member check it out, start the car, warm it up, go for a quick rip, but the dealership had replaced the rad cap with a low pressure cap so it wouldn't build pressure.

I called the dealership the next day, and the store manager basically said "F*ck you, you bought it. What're you going to do? You're in Canada!"

So, I was left with a car that had cost about 17k to purchase, ship, and I couldn't even drive it. I could either cry about it, or man up and rebuild.
I had originally planned to go with a builder that most of the Toronto guys go with, but in the end, I decided to have the engine built by BSC Motorsports. His shop is about 15 minutes from my house, and he had done work for the majority of the rotary guys in the Barrie area. He also tunes the engines he builds, so I wouldn't have to wait for a tuner to be available, and pay a crapload more money.
I finally got the car on the road, jumped through the ministry of transportation's hoops, and enjoyed it for the first summer just as a driver. Last summer, I started autocrossing it. My local club is one of the best ones in the region for organizing events, and had a blast last year. Now, I'm finally autocrossing on r-comps, and doing lapping days at Mosport.

It was a long road, but totally worth it. Would I do it again? probably. this thing is the most fun i've ever had in a car with my pants still on!

~Matt

no_more_rice

True, but I change it at conservative a 5k interval, regardless. Keeping an eye on AFRs under boost can tip you off that it's getting loaded up. I also prefer to run a 10 micron filter element as opposed to 100 mircon or whatever the stocker is, to keep as much stuff as possible out of the injectors. Plus I like to inspect the element and see how much crap has collected on it, you can't do that with the stocker.

Good idea, I might just do that, I just don't like too many gauges cluttering my interior, it starts to look like a riced out Civic

Howard Coleman

iTrader: (6)

"just don't like too many gauges cluttering"

i am with you on that. i have no gauge for my fuel pressure, egts or EMP. i read them off my laptop and the logs.

hc