saxyman990

After 2 months of owning my car, I finally got around to installing a downpipe (with a hell of a lot of help from suganuma). I just got it in there last night, so I'm feeling pretty happy, and I decided that I should share my story with the forum. If nothing else, this post should provide you with a complete waste of 2 minutes of your life (but hopefully, it will provide some entertainment value as well).

It all started when I bought the car....

I noticed that the high end power was lagging a bit. I figured I had a boost leak of some type. No big deal, I'll eventually get around to a hose job, and it would fix the problem. A couple of weeks ago, I took the car out with Suganuma (Nic), and we checked out the boost pattern. It was boosting 10-5-5. Not good. Evidently, I was getting NO transition whatsoever. I checked out the vacuum lines, and noticed that one going into my CRV was collapsed. I spliced in a new line, and away I went... First run was great, but after that, something went wrong again, and I was back to no transition. This time, the boost was just dying off after 4.5k RPM. Because of this, Nic and I deduced that the pre-cat could possibly be clogged. I already had purchased a downpipe, so this gave me a reason to finally tear into my car.... what a pain in the a--

We started on Sunday. All the intake stuff came off without a hitch, the operation was going quite smoothly at this point. I even noticed a vacuum line that had blown off of the check valve on the pressure tank. Bingo! my transition problem is probably solved! On with the downpipe...

The pre-cat didn't come off quite so easy. 3 of the nuts and studs on the turbo housing came off with minimal tugging. The fourth was a different story.... In the process of pulling that nut off, we stripped about 5 threads off the end of the stud. No biggie, the stud has to get replaced anyway... too bad the stud didn't want to come out of the damn turbo. So after a while, we decided to use a tap and die, and re-thread the stud. Then figure out a way to wedge the new downpipe on. It worked, but was a long, painstaking process.

Next problem: the freaking stud on the cat was seized as well. Again, while taking off the nut, we stripped about 5 threads off the end of the stud. Oh well, we'll do the same thing, we thought. We sat there for about an hour or two trying to wedge, and hammer, and torque, and anything else we could think of, in an attempt to get the DP on the cat studs. No luck. Then we realized the stud was bent. Crap. So yesterday, I got around to using a cut-off wheel to saw off the end of the stud, and then I just drilled it out. Took a good hour or two to drill it out, and ruined about 3 of my bits in the process. I don't think my drill is working right anymore either.... those damn studs are HARD!

Finally was able to put a new bolt through the cat and DP, and bolted everything down. Everything went back together just fine. Haven't really had a chance to drive it, to make sure that I fixed the boost problem, or to see how it feels with a new pipe in there (had too much work to do last night). The little bit that I did drive it (just cruising back home), I noticed that the vacuum was much better, and throttle response was amazingly better!! I can't wait to get out there and really give this thing a test drive.

Anyway, what was supposed to be a couple-hour project, turned into a three-day affair, where we spent no less than 12 total hours (was only working on it for about 3-4 hours per day). Oh well, I'm happy that the DP is finally on there (hopefully my car is too). No longer can I say my car is totaly "stock."

Sorry this post was so long, but hopefully, you enjoyed my story. If not, then I'm sorry you wasted your time reading it. Maybe it'll help some of you out who are having problems doing the same thing.

Oh yeah, I have some great pictures that I took with my friends digi-cam. If I get a chance (and you guys are interested), maybe I'll post some of those up here in the next few days.


Rob

JONSKI

You'll just appreciate it more.

Leprechaun

I've heard about the nightmare DPs before. And some people's install of a DP is a cakewalk. Just one of those things.

And yeah, post the pics, everyone likes to see those...

Toadman

Did you soak all bolts and studs overnight with Nuts Off or WD-40 like you were supposed to?

es

My main cat didn't have any studs. Just nut & bolts. I have seen main cats with studs however, & have wondered if my cat was replaced at some point or what.

Also, PB Blaster is the way to unstick nuts. Spray them all down the night before & go at it!

2-Rotor

I have read it and it worries me because i have to install a downpipe very soon as well. Hopefully i will have some luck on my side.

2-Rotor

Damn Pre-cat i have seen them when they are off the car its like all cast iron and its friggin huge. It weighs a lot too.

Dragueur

thats what I am scared of when i put mines in....

saxyman990

jonski - hell yeah man, I appreciate it more and more everytime I think about it


For all those that wondered, yes, I did soak everything in liquid wrench before I began. I know, its not quite as good as PB blaster, but it still works. I seriously used about 3/4 of the can on those 6 studs. I can't really imagine soaking them much more than that. Honestly, you should have seen these damn bolts (there's no way that PB blaster would have worked either).

When Nic was trying to get the Nut off the stud on the cat, he had to lay on his back, put his feet on the cat, and use a huge torque wrench as a breaker bar. He was lifting his entire body off the ground while trying to get it off. I think he broke his torque wrench too. I may have to buy him a new one....


I'm so glad to get that friggin mini-nuclear reactor off my car. I'm still working on those pics, too.

saxyman990

Oh yeah, and for those that I have totally freaked out with my story, I have this to say: Don't sweat it. I think my case is one of the extremes. If it happens to you, then don't worry. just take your time and get it done. The worst you can do is break something (like the multitude of studs that I broke). In which case, all you need to do is fix or replace it. Its really not that big of a deal, and the pay offs are definately worth it. Plus, you get some really good experience with taking stuff off your car. But in all honesty, you mostlikely won't break anything anyway, so don't get worried.

The key is taking your time, and not getting frustrated. If you have any questions, just ask

Rotarius

My DP took me about 30 minutes to install including removing the factory unit. The top front stud didnt came out but the downpipe i bought(3"SS) had no problem going in. I guess Lady luck was on my side.

Snook

iTrader: (12)

I enjoyed that post....
I have a mild steel downpipe thats been in there for a few years (previous owner thought of the mild steel idea)
I might however add a mild steel midpipe also because it's the only 3" pipe that I've been able to find from friends or around the house and I don't feel like buying one right now.
Im estimating in about 5 years I'll have to replace both of those again and do the installation like you.

I agree the most imprtant thing is to have a good attitude and not get frustrated because not everyone is a natural born mechanic.

Snook

neevosh

I jus removed my downpipe when I pulled my engine last weekend. The retard who previously installed it broke one of the studs and didn't bother replacing it. So it was held on by three bolts. And they weren't even tightened down very much. It took no effort to get them off.

rotorbrain

isnt it though!!!!! i sprayed that stuff on my exhaust about 15 mins prior and they came off like they were internally lubed or something. haha.

paul

JONSKI

It's actually PB B'laster. Hell if I know what the apostrophe is for, however. Of course, this product came from a time period where advertisers would say things like, "It's seven-tastic!"

VFactor24

saxyman i had a similar experience. The only problem with my instalation was that the two nuts on the cat were seized. I think not having any power tools makes a big difference, because i was trying to do everything with just a normal rachet set. A job that i thought was gonna take two hours ended up taking like 8.

P'cola FD

Holy crap, I know exactly what you mean! My precat was pretty easy, but when I put in my catback, the stud on the cat broke. We (a mechanic friend and I) tried drilling it out with a pneumatic drill and top dollar MAC bits, but it burnt up three bits. Those studs are freakin hard! After 45 minutes we just said **** it, and broke out the oxyacetylene torch. Cut through the stud in about 30 seconds. The hole was a little bigger than neccissary, but it still bolted up fine It wasn't a couple weeks later that the midpipe went in.

saxyman990

Well, to be honest, I'm glad I'm not the only one with DP problems. Makes me feel a little better that we all have similar "war stories" when it comes to owning an FD. I guess thats one of the things that gives the car so much character. Besides, it makes for great conversation over a couple of beers.

saxyman990

Okay, here's the update: i finally was able to take it for a drive yesterday afternoon, good news and bad news. The good news is that I actually felt the transition this time. Holy Crap!!! That's just totally awesome. You should have seen the grin on my face when I finally felt some power in the upper RPM band.

The bad news is I'm still not getting all the power I should up top. I'll give you guys the details so maybe you can help me out. I've been searching on the forum, but there's like 10-million posts regarding boost issues, so it may take a while to find something. If you have an idea what this is let me know.

-Idle is at around 600
-Vacuum at idle is about 11-12 inches.
Boost pattern is 11-6-8 (I know, these are the most fun boost patterns to solve, but at least its a lot better than my previous pattern of 10-5-5. Those extra pounds of boost add a butt load of power).
-The biggest problem is a slow transition. Transition seems to happen at about 5k, boost drops from 11 on the primary to about 6. Then it creeps back up to about 8 before I approach redline. Its not instantaneous like it should be.

if you got any ideas, PLEASE hook a brother up. I'm really guessing that is probably a dead vacuum line somewhere. I haven't done a hose job yet. I probably won't have time to do one for another month or so either.

laters, Rob

wstrohm

Saxyman,

Deja vu... and I have to do a vacuum hose job too, just after my wonderful experience failing emissions testing stock, failing again w/Bonez cat/dp after fighting precat removal problems, finally passing w/new stock cat/Bonez dp. So then I measure idle vacuum and it's 14 in. @ 700 rpm, 15" @ 1000 rpm. Yours is really worse, though. Maybe because your idle speed is so low. "Terminal vacuum hose disease," is what I've read it is called. So now I've spent $543 on 50 ft of Viton 1/8" ID, 1/8" wall-thickness hose plus 15 ft of 1/4" ID, 1/8" thick hose. Now all I have to do is convince my wife to give up her '94 for the two weeks it will no doubt take to do the hose replacement (IF I can find some decent metal hose clamps).

----- Bill

mp5

iTrader: (3)

It took me 12 hours putting my downpipe on,I started friday evening thinking i,ll be done get a few beers later and off to the dino tomorrow, sorted..............just do it with a freind,a lift so you dont have to lie on concrete and under no circumstances do it when its freezing outside!!

VFactor24

saxyman i not only have war stories i have war scars

RX7Elmo

11-12in/hg of vaccuum is a very low number. I would think there is a vaccum leak somewhere or your motor isn't running as strong as it should be. You should see at least 15-16in/hg to confirm a decent motor.

If you have not done the hose job, this might be a good time as you can maybe even find that bad vacuum leak.

Regarding your boost. One problem could be one of those many hoses. Another is it would be a good idea to check the precontrol line and see if there is a pill in there and if it's stock. If the pill is too small, it could do what you are describing.

Danny