drivelikejehu

im definately going with the BNR Stage 3's so i dont wanna hear anything about going single instead...

I was wondering if anyone had ever run the BNR's in place of the stock turbos, but without upgrading ANYTHING. i want stock everything, run 10psi, just replace the stock turbos with the BNR's.

Also, has anyone ever completed a BNR Stage 3 replica on their own with the same parts and having the turbos machined accordingly?

This may seem completely pointless to some of you, so ill explain my reasoning. First, my turbos are on their way out, so they need replacing anyway. The reason for not going all out right off the bat is because i still don't know EXACTLY what i want in reguards to IC setup (i.e. stock location, v-mount, or front mount), ECU, fueling, intake, and exhuast (i.e. hi flow cat, mid-pipe, or resonated mid-pipe).

I want to take it slow, but i want to start with the turbos, and build around them, and as i upgrade the entire system in the correct order i can slowly increase my boost and power. I also feel this is the safest way to do things, and if a problem occurs at any stage of the conversion, i will know where something went wrong.

the closest thing i found to what im asking is here.
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-specific-1993-2002-16/bnr-stage-3s-steve-kan-tune-99-spec-body-components-efini-wing-more-556235/

Improved FD

the BNRs push quite a bit more flow than stock, I doubt even a Pettit ECU is going to cut it (maybe, but dangerous)

don't try to build your own, Bryan is the man

drivelikejehu

alright im fine with buying them, i was just curious if it had been done.

alright, so lets say stock ECU isnt gonna cut it, would i be able to run the BNR's alone if i went ahead and got a Power FC? will they just fit directly into stock location as a 'replacement'? im going to need the Power FC anyway so i dont mind getting that now.

oh yeah my sig says 100% stock but i recently installed a downpipe, i would never start upgrading with the pre-cat in there lol.

Improved FD

Power FC, big injectors, upgraded fuel pump....BDC or Steve Kan tuning

and a bigger IC is also essentially a mandatory upgrade imo, the stocker will heat soak almost immediately (increasing the risk of detonation)

you might be better off just getting a set of the '99s, you're getting into alot of $$$ here

drivelikejehu

well eventually i want to fully upgrade everything, and try and get my numbers up there.... just not right now. i wanna take it slow. running the BNR's at stock 10psi, why would i need to increase my fuel or the IC right away?

im not disagreeing, i just dont fully understand why. i know the stock IC is a bottle neck, but if im not pushing anyone pressure through it than i am right now....? i just cant wrap my mind around it thats all

i dont track the car, i only drive it on the roads, and do some spirited driving on the weekends occationally.

Improved FD

from the stock ECU? absolutely. or you will run lean....the stock ECU cannot compensate for significant increases in air flow through the engine

but you are pushing alot more hot air and the IC is already taxed to the limit with the flow output of the stock turbos (that's an understatement)

drivelikejehu

this is what i dont understand. the BNR's CAN flow more, i got that, but if they are getting their air from the same location as the stockers (stock air box), and putting it through the same tubing as the stockers to the engine (so we are not incleasing volume anywhere), then 10psi should be 10psi weather its coming from the stock turbos or from the BNR tubros right? and if we have the same volume of air, why does the engine need to compensate for any air?

and as for heat, the BNR's should have to work less to reach 10psi then the stock turbos... unless the BNR's just run hotter or something.

it seemed so simple at first... hahaha

Improved FD

more air is drawn through the stock airbox by the larger compressor wheels of the BNRs

you are correct in saying increased flow should result in increased pressure, but the bottom line is the FD does not have a mass air flow sensor, so you don't know what the flow is at any given pressure, you're guessing....guessing is dangerous (and expensive) with these cars

the relative difference in air temp from stock turbos to BNRs at 10 psi isn't going to change that much (i.e. it's still superheated air)

drivelikejehu

ok that makes much better sense to me, thanks! if i were guessing i would have bought these things a long time ago.

so i guess my overall question has been answered in a way? i cant just swap the BNR's without upgrading the entire system, which makes sense now. im not going to just upgrade pieces of it and half-*** it, if im gonna do it i wanna do it right and just do everything.

FDse7en

iTrader: (3)

i ran a set of stage 3's on my car with a front mount, supra pump, and a pettit ecu at 8 or 9 psi for a few months with no problems..

axr6

I think that you SHOULD be able to swap the BNRs for the stock turbos and run 10 psi boost safely. The stock ECU runs very rich and have been proven to provide enough fuel for a significant amount of modificatons.

My recommednations would be to spend some money for a piece of mind; less then $300 will get you an AEM UEGO air-fuel ratio sensor/gauge combo and with that you can continously monitor your air fuel ratio, making sure that you won't run short on fuel. The stock fuel setup is good for close to 300 RWHP and with the BNR turbo change at 10 psi you will not be very close to that. You will need midpipe, IC and catback to get up to that range.

Also, since you are ordering the BNR I assume that you know that you will need an extended length Y-pipe as the stock one does not fit the BNRs.

Albert

Northern7

iTrader: (1)

Look up mazdabation and pm him, he is doing a very similar set up and has already installed BNR stage 3's. In fact there is a huge thread from just the other day you may want to look at.

drivelikejehu

hmmm. more input on the subject, good stuff.

so really the only thing that could be problematic is the fuel issue, and the heat/IC issue. I think to be safe entirely, i would get the PowerFC if i decided to swap the stock turbos for the BNR's for the time being, but would i most defiantely be below 300hp to keep the stock fuel pump happy?

drivelikejehu

i looked very hard into his setup and it is in fact similar, but he did upgrade his fuel system, ignition, and is running a PowerFC. so its not entirely stock but yeah its probably the closest thing im going to find on the forums.

i AM going to upgrade ALL of the necessary items eventually, but i would like to do things in stages, so for example i dont spend a bunch of cash on a stock mount IC and all the piping, then a month later decide that a v-mount would be better for my application... or another reason is that i dont want to buy 10 grand in parts, put everything together, and have major problems. i will have no idea where to start especially since i plan to keep the BNR twins sequential.

rexset

I know that Cameron At Pettit Racing can build a ECU for that turbos , with everything stock , the only problem is that you are going to not be able to increase the boost more than 10psi.

I make a single turbo running at 10psi with everything stock and that ECU , that work perfect for me for 6 month until my bro crush the car.

drivelikejehu

i am 100% fine with only runnign 10psi until the necessary parts are upgraded

im only talking about running the car like this for a few months tops, but i dont want to lose the driveability of it

axr6

How do you know exactly what boost do you run right now? Have you installed a boost gauge? Since you replaced the pre-cat with a downpipe that alone may have increased your boost over the stock 10 psi.

I understand that you wish to keep things stock for now but, you have already made some mods (donwpipe and BNRs on order) so it is only prudent that you "know" exactly what you have. A boost gauge and a wideband would be most helpful. You probably will not need a PFC right at this time and probably will be fine with the stock fuel pump and ECU map until you start adding some more mods.

Albert

drivelikejehu

i temporarily checked my boost with a regular pressure gauge and a hose running through the hood and through the window... worked lol.

rynberg

Unless there is something wrong with your car, there will be ZERO problem installing the BNRs with the stock ecu (at 10 psi).

drivelikejehu

thanks!

im still kinda scetchy about it though, and i think i wanna get the PowerFC first. and all the other monitoring devices.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

As previously mentioned, you will have to send your stock Y-pipe to Bryan along with a good (minimal cracking on manifold side) set of core stock twins.

Just so you know what you're getting, check this link if you haven't seen it already:

http://www.bnrturbos.com/3rdGen.htm

socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

Was this before or after you scammed a member for 400 bucks. You changed your SN but YOU STILL OWN 400 BUCK *******!!!! **** YOU SCAMMER....https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=557976

PASS THE WORD.

GustavOllufsen

hm..anyways.

increase in flow will only increase in pressure if the turbines are spinning at the same speed. if the stock turbos are spinning at lets say 100,000 rpm and so are the bnr's then yes there will be mroe pressure because more air is being moved. you cant move more air into the intake without increasing manifold pressure. the bnrs will work less hard to make the same psi, they will be going slower because if they spun as fast as the stockers they woul dbe putting out alot more air, thus psi, but the wastegate sees that and ofcourse will open to regulated both boost and mass airflow. it wont just ADD mroe airflow because that would add boost, which the boost controller takes care of, obviously.

you can swap them out for the stockers and run what you are running now without a problem. after you do some mods..ecu, exhaust,intake, IC/piping, fuel/ignition etc. and crank up the boost to the bnr's higher efficiency range which is most likely in about 15 psi, then you'll start to notice you imprint left in the seat everytime you get out

Improved FD

no, those were Stage 2s that you ripped me off on (false advertising)

Bryan verified that fact

Improved FD

ditto....that guy is a scammer