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i returned to the Texas Mile this March. i had hoped to do my 200+ mph but was semi sidelined by some sort of elec interference problem. most probable culprit was my beloved Magnecor plug wires which were onboard in 2013 at the Mile. i will shortly find the problem of course and expect to be back in October.
i was able to limp through the lights at 157 on my second and last run. i needed to complete a run just under 160 to get my unlimited license. so the box got checked.
of course i learned a few things which is the reason for the post.
prior to the Mile i had been doing 3rd gear pulls. one of the last was to 8158, 24 psi around 640 rwhp (G40-1150).
the air coming out the compressor before the intercooler was 287 F. my IAT was 84 F. the graph shows the Comp temps and IATs start rising w boost onset, then as AI enters the IATs flatten and the Comp temps continue to rise. i am running 50/50 water meth at 630 CC/min.
temperatures were generated with thermocouples rather than "fast"/glacially slow thermistors so they are dead accurate. and they are nice numbers being over 600 with no drama.
temperatures from the Texas Mile were significantly warmer.
heat cumulates in a big way as you go thru the gears.
third gear temps were 396 out of the compressor. IATs were 170, rather than 84, into the motor. i was at way less than full throttle as i just had to do 160. peak numbers for fourth were 424 and 184 and fifth was 448 and 200. i will be doubling my AI for October.
while you might be thinking your not going to be running the Texas Mile, the same dynamics certainly are present on a road course.
i think my current ProMeth 630 cc nozzle is just right for everything but Texas. you might have a similar situation if you track your car a few times a year...
the new Pro Meth nozzle is the answer.
ONE (new design) nozzle that has incredible range.
you select your base flow rate and stipulate 2 additional atomizers. they are plus 50% and plus 100%.
all stainless steel, no plastic fantastic. state of the art.
my fuel was VP X85L. according to VP 85% ethanol and 15% 110 leaded racegas.
while the typical "E85" delivers close to complete knock protection, 200 at the Mile requires 575+ rwhp for 30 seconds. meth is a powerful tool to drop IATs. i was way light on it as i didn't appreciate the cumulating effect of going thru the gears... and i didn't even get into 6th. 200 is 7000 in 6th w my Magnum F setup and 4.1 gears. plus the TPS was around 50% to do the 157. October is going to be a bigger challenge for my IAT. the simple solution is more meth.
looking at the numbers:
105 F at the air filter
448 F out of the compressor
a really good intercooler can remove 65% of the rise
448 minus 105 = 343 rise X .65 = 223F
448 - 223 = 225
my IAT was 200 so my AI removed another 25 F from the charge air... i suspect that towards the end of my run that the IC was a bit heat soaked as i normally find my W/M removes around 60 F from the charge air...
this is fairly modest but welcome. i was running a 50/50 WM mix due to the regulations. since my AI container/fuel cell is considered to be in my cockpit as it is located in the spare tire recess the AI mix must be non-flammable. for October i will either properly partition off the cell so i can run 100% meth or i will double the 50/50. probably do the partition as i will be wanting around 1500 CC of meth to bring my IATs down to ambient.
even with 200 F IAT i had not a hint of knock but sure don't like seeing 200.
Last edited by Howard Coleman; Apr 16, 2025 at 07:46 AM.
"would it be worth running an air/water intercooler? Especially with ice in the tank?"
air/water w ice would work significantly better for the Mile. i prefer air/air as air/water involves a lot of additional items in the engine compartment and i am a Minimalist as to what's under the hood. the system is also fairly complex. and finally i can drop my IATs another 100 degrees w around a thousand CC of additional methanol.
i have 2 reasons for doing the MIle. the first is to prove that a DUAL PURPOSE FD can do 200 in the Mile. this goes along w my belief that the FD can be a Supercar w the right mods.
the second reason of course is to go fast.
i just don't see a water intercooler as a daily driver mod. of course that is a totally subjective conclusion on my part... oh well.
"the effect the ethanol has on cooling the IAT"
one effect re ethanol or methanol is that by virtue of their knock resistance they place the motor further from detonation. detonation is always existent but normally in minute quantities.
if the motor isn't significantly knocking the cooling effect lies primarily w their respective BTU content.
gasoline has around 116,090 BTUs per gallon... gas 90% ethanol 10% 112,114
ethanol 76,330 E85 80,767 (E 83%, 2% non fuel, 15% gasoline)
methanol 56,800
simplistically if you choose to run E85 V gasoline at the same AFR correcting for the fractional mix based on additional liquid content re to gas ethanol cooling should be 39% better.
meth would be 97%.
explains why 2 rotors at 2100 pounds run in the sixes at as much as 225 mph on meth as base fuel.
i'll be happy w meth as just my AI rather than base fuel.
In addition to more AI, I would love to see data on how much a properly ducted V mount would assist in cooling over your current configuration. The SMIC works but the pinch point at the radiator and frame leaves it less than optimal. I wish there was an easy radiator swap that increases the gap for the Cool charge duct. I don't like how the duct reduces in cross area and the way it doesn't extend down to scoop the air. Is there enough positive air pressure at the front to force air up into the duct or does most of the passing air create some low-pressure areas at the duct opening. The duct also flares out towards the passenger side.
If your intake is separated from engine bay well, fogger nozzles and a tank of nitrogen or CO2 for the intercooler may be of assistance too. I think a mile is too long on load to rely on thermal inertia of ice having sat on an air to air core and it just acts as a blockage in the top end. Total loss gas expansion is probably easier. You could run a bit of nitrous each way if you were really keen but you would probably want to introduce more water and fuel to protect the internals with much nitrous.
I like the idea of an air-to-water setup, most of the Bonneville/ landspeed cars I've seen are doing it that way. They spend more time at full throttle than a standing mile car. You could temporarily run a larger water tank with ice for the mile events, and swap to either a smaller tank or a heat exchanger for dual-purpose use.
I forget if you've tried pre-turbo injection, I think I've heard mostly good things about it using modern injection nozzles.
I've heard of one person trying nitrous injection for engine cooling on a landspeed car (piston engine) that already made good power but ran too hot, he said it didn't work well. Spraying water or CO2 on the intercooler might help. Making less heat should help too, if you're using part throttle to manage speed or tire slip you could be turning the boost down and generating less heat instead. If the ECU gives an easy way to manipulate the boost target with an in-cabin **** or switch, try the first few runs at low boost for less stress on the engine.
Last edited by scotty305; Apr 18, 2025 at 01:57 AM.
I like the idea of an air-to-water setup, most of the Bonneville/ landspeed cars I've seen are doing it that way. They spend more time at full throttle than a standing mile car. You could temporarily run a larger water tank with ice for the mile events, and swap to either a smaller tank or a heat exchanger for dual-purpose use.
I forget if you've tried pre-turbo injection, I think I've heard mostly good things about it using modern injection nozzles.
I've heard of one person trying nitrous injection for engine cooling on a landspeed car (piston engine) that already made good power but ran too hot, he said it didn't work well. Spraying water or CO2 on the intercooler might help. Making less heat should help too, if you're using part throttle to manage speed or tire slip you could be turning the boost down and generating less heat instead. If the ECU gives an easy way to manipulate the boost target with an in-cabin **** or switch, try the first few runs at low boost for less stress on the engine.
The cooling effect of spraying water or co2 is going to be pretty minor compared to 160+ MPH wind, no?
I do wonder if putting ice in the meth tank would make a difference, though… hahaha.
i will just raise the meth... at one point, around 15 years ago, i was doing around 3000 cc of meth. i am going to talk w Rodney at Pro Meth and get it sorted..
for a dual purpose car, (ice) water to air might not be the most practical thing.
here are a couple of pics of the RB Bonneville FC; water tank
under the hood, its much better, water to air has a packaging advantage, you can stick it anywhere, doesn't need airflow, isn't as big, etc
since we are in the future, Howard is making more power, with way better reliability.
