325-350 Rwhp
06-02-08, 12:59 PM
#51
94 Single Turbo FD
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^^^yes there probably are, but who are they, not your average fd owner, they have all monitoring systems,(wide band egt, fuel pressure etc ,etc)and ability to tune and make corrections, probably also using race fuel and AI. Definetly not using stock ports and stock turbos, lol
these motors would surely have been rebuilt with upgraded bearings, rotors, ports, balanced, pinned etc, they just use the mazda apex seals. i wouldnt say that any of these people running these power levels are looking to get the longevity out of the motor that the average owner wants either.
i am done with this thread, not gonna discuss horsepower with a bunch of F&F 18yr olds that were in diapers when the fd fist came out.just mod your car the right way, and when it blows ups and it will, get some porting done, then maybe you'll be making 350rhwp
these motors would surely have been rebuilt with upgraded bearings, rotors, ports, balanced, pinned etc, they just use the mazda apex seals. i wouldnt say that any of these people running these power levels are looking to get the longevity out of the motor that the average owner wants either.
i am done with this thread, not gonna discuss horsepower with a bunch of F&F 18yr olds that were in diapers when the fd fist came out.just mod your car the right way, and when it blows ups and it will, get some porting done, then maybe you'll be making 350rhwp
06-02-08, 04:47 PM
#52
hmm, so let me guess, your one of the guys that has an fd with basic bolt ons, power fc, fuel pump and a few bolts on and go around bragging that u are making 350rwhp?
a free flowing exhaust and open intake cannot be properly utilized with the stock sized ports, they are the restricted piece of the puzzle, cranking up the boost a few extra pounds will help but, its still not gonna give u 350rwhp, and is dangerous using stock internals. so i think its u who doesnt know what he is talking about. all these guys making 350 on stock twins and stock ports, where are your dyno sheets to prove this?
a free flowing exhaust and open intake cannot be properly utilized with the stock sized ports, they are the restricted piece of the puzzle, cranking up the boost a few extra pounds will help but, its still not gonna give u 350rwhp, and is dangerous using stock internals. so i think its u who doesnt know what he is talking about. all these guys making 350 on stock twins and stock ports, where are your dyno sheets to prove this?
One guy who we all know and that was like in 2003 and another dude whom im sure they are trying deeply in finding to prove you wrong. lol
Some people here are funny.
06-02-08, 05:01 PM
#53
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hmm, so let me guess, your one of the guys that has an fd with basic bolt ons, power fc, fuel pump and a few bolts on and go around bragging that u are making 350rwhp?
a free flowing exhaust and open intake cannot be properly utilized with the stock sized ports, they are the restricted piece of the puzzle, cranking up the boost a few extra pounds will help but, its still not gonna give u 350rwhp, and is dangerous using stock internals. so i think its u who doesnt know what he is talking about. all these guys making 350 on stock twins and stock ports, where are your dyno sheets to prove this?
a free flowing exhaust and open intake cannot be properly utilized with the stock sized ports, they are the restricted piece of the puzzle, cranking up the boost a few extra pounds will help but, its still not gonna give u 350rwhp, and is dangerous using stock internals. so i think its u who doesnt know what he is talking about. all these guys making 350 on stock twins and stock ports, where are your dyno sheets to prove this?
Nothing personal smitter, but you're an idiot.
The ports do restrict airflow, but not to the point where it will hold you below 350whp. If anything, the exhaust manifold for the twins is the main point of restriction (even with a decent streetport the exhaust side will be restricted).
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Dyno numbers don't matter THAT MUCH. The dyno is a tool to help a tuner do his/her thing in a safe controlled environment. The fact that you get a printout at the end is just a bonus.
You must not really understand this since you are running around telling people they don't know ****, and demanding dyno sheets. I am running 380whp (as it would be measured in America) on stock internals, and stock ports. I don't bother to run around bragging about that though, at the end of the day it's just a number.
06-02-08, 05:44 PM
#54
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
hmm, so let me guess, your one of the guys that has an fd with basic bolt ons, power fc, fuel pump and a few bolts on and go around bragging that u are making 350rwhp?
a free flowing exhaust and open intake cannot be properly utilized with the stock sized ports, they are the restricted piece of the puzzle, cranking up the boost a few extra pounds will help but, its still not gonna give u 350rwhp, and is dangerous using stock internals. so i think its u who doesnt know what he is talking about. all these guys making 350 on stock twins and stock ports, where are your dyno sheets to prove this?
a free flowing exhaust and open intake cannot be properly utilized with the stock sized ports, they are the restricted piece of the puzzle, cranking up the boost a few extra pounds will help but, its still not gonna give u 350rwhp, and is dangerous using stock internals. so i think its u who doesnt know what he is talking about. all these guys making 350 on stock twins and stock ports, where are your dyno sheets to prove this?
oh and about the dangerous part. well i have been making roughly this power for about 5 yrs now....car never sees low boost....******* never.
sounds like your the F&F boy racer not us.
06-02-08, 09:01 PM
#58
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Nothing personal smitter, but you're an idiot.
The ports do restrict airflow, but not to the point where it will hold you below 350whp. If anything, the exhaust manifold for the twins is the main point of restriction (even with a decent streetport the exhaust side will be restricted).
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Dyno numbers don't matter THAT MUCH. The dyno is a tool to help a tuner do his/her thing in a safe controlled environment. The fact that you get a printout at the end is just a bonus.
You must not really understand this since you are running around telling people they don't know ****, and demanding dyno sheets. I am running 380whp (as it would be measured in America) on stock internals, and stock ports. I don't bother to run around bragging about that though, at the end of the day it's just a number.
The ports do restrict airflow, but not to the point where it will hold you below 350whp. If anything, the exhaust manifold for the twins is the main point of restriction (even with a decent streetport the exhaust side will be restricted).
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Dyno numbers don't matter THAT MUCH. The dyno is a tool to help a tuner do his/her thing in a safe controlled environment. The fact that you get a printout at the end is just a bonus.
You must not really understand this since you are running around telling people they don't know ****, and demanding dyno sheets. I am running 380whp (as it would be measured in America) on stock internals, and stock ports. I don't bother to run around bragging about that though, at the end of the day it's just a number.
06-02-08, 09:04 PM
#59
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hmm dyno chart.....maybe i will take a picture and post it special delivery for you. or you can ask the 10 other people there wathcing as it was a dyno day, goodfellas was one of them. i hate dynos....i think they lie. so i have a dozen 118mph trap speeds for you as well. oh yeah some 119mph ones too. oh yeah it was 359 to be exact.
oh and about the dangerous part. well i have been making roughly this power for about 5 yrs now....car never sees low boost....******* never.
sounds like your the F&F boy racer not us.
oh and about the dangerous part. well i have been making roughly this power for about 5 yrs now....car never sees low boost....******* never.
sounds like your the F&F boy racer not us.
06-02-08, 10:21 PM
#60
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325 rwhp @ 1.1 bar with bnr twins? it says this right in your sig. your not even making 350rwhp with unsafe boost levels for pump gas and your running upgraded turbos. how is someone gonna make 350rwhp with stock turbos @ less then 1 bar??? your an idiot (no offense)
325whp on a Dyno Dynamics Dyno.. It is an Australian dyno which shows numbers 18% lower than a Dynojet, and 15% lower than a Dynopack dyno (I could have them mixed up, but I know it's 15%-18% LESS than the dyno's used in the states) which are the two types of dyno's used predominantly in the US.
Here, I'll spell it out for you: 325x.18= 58.5, and 325+58.5= 383.5whp. Therefore it is safe to say that, if my car was dyno'd in the states it would return with 383whp. BEFORE I put on my BNR's I had my PFC tuned at the same shop which did the BNR install for a better tune, and as a before/after comparison. My stock HT12's (with a lazy primary turbo) made 280whp @ .8 bar. Lets do that little bit of math again: 280x.18=50.4, 50.4+280=330.4 whp. So... at .8 bar my (dying) stock twins were putting out 330whp, do you still want to say that a healthy pair of stock twins can't make 350whp, with mine making 330 on their last leg? I've got dyno sheets for all of these in the UK btw (in VA on vacation atm).
This is NOT me talking about somebody I know who mentioned something that one of his friends did... It's stuff that I have actually done to my car, and I have dyno sheets as proof. Try to prove me wrong, just because you can't do it doesn't mean it can't be done.
In the end I could really give a damn if you believe me or not, bottom line is that those numbers are perfectly attainable with the correct supporting mods. And 1.1bar is NOT unsafe with BNR's, how the hell do you figure that??? I've got PLENTY of fuel on the top end and will be installing A/I in about a weeks time, at which point I'll probably tweak the timing and boost level even more.
Thanks for playing.
06-03-08, 02:52 AM
#61
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there are dynos that measure differently in the united states aswell einstein.
a mustang dyno typically reads 15-18% less then a dyno jet, so lets use your same numbers and take an average, thats the only fair way to determine what a car is making for horsepower when 2 different kind of dynos have varying readings:
your bnrs on a mustang dyno = 325rwhp and your bnrs on a dynojet =383.5 rwhp. add the 2 figures together then divide by 2 = 354rwhp @ 1.1 bar on the upgraded bnrs. 1.1 bar is not too much boost for those turbos, i never said that, go back and read it again. 1.1 bar however is to much boost to run safely on any turbo with u.s. pump gas. so naturally running stock twins with less boost is gonna yeild much less then the 350rwhp plauteu your bnrs are currently making @ 1.1 bar (16lbs)
i never said a set of stock twins cant make 350rwhp, again your mis-quoting me, i said stock twins cannot make 350rwhp on stock ports, how many times do i have to say it.
your are right about one thing though, that is me not believing u. thx for playing aswell, but u lose
a mustang dyno typically reads 15-18% less then a dyno jet, so lets use your same numbers and take an average, thats the only fair way to determine what a car is making for horsepower when 2 different kind of dynos have varying readings:
your bnrs on a mustang dyno = 325rwhp and your bnrs on a dynojet =383.5 rwhp. add the 2 figures together then divide by 2 = 354rwhp @ 1.1 bar on the upgraded bnrs. 1.1 bar is not too much boost for those turbos, i never said that, go back and read it again. 1.1 bar however is to much boost to run safely on any turbo with u.s. pump gas. so naturally running stock twins with less boost is gonna yeild much less then the 350rwhp plauteu your bnrs are currently making @ 1.1 bar (16lbs)
i never said a set of stock twins cant make 350rwhp, again your mis-quoting me, i said stock twins cannot make 350rwhp on stock ports, how many times do i have to say it.
your are right about one thing though, that is me not believing u. thx for playing aswell, but u lose
Last edited by Smitter; 06-03-08 at 02:58 AM.
06-03-08, 04:20 AM
#62
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Corrections/editing made in bold..
Really? 'cause here I was thinking that it was a difference in dyno manufacturer which produced the different readings, not the country where the pull takes place. Though, admittedly, elevation would play a large part in different readings.
Oh, and "as well" is two words, not one...
Typically or consistently? 18% loss means 18% loss, not 18% loss rounded with the base reading... Sorry, but it seems to me like you're just trying to pull something out of your *** to back yourself up on an incorrect comment you've made.
1.1bar is too much for ANY turbo on pump fuel??? You're kidding right? Have you ever heard of water/methanol injection and/or other means of cooling efficiency??
Gas is gas brother, regardless of whether it's pumped in the US or in Europe. The only difference is the value it's rated in (98 RON = 94 Octane) and the additives... the quality of gas stays relatively the same.
Less boost = less horsepower... really? Thanks for educating us noobs here... Octane level determines chances of pre-detonation at different engine temps, last I checked port sizing has nothing to do with the internal temps inside the rotor housing...
Except that I'm running stock internals and stock ports... And (as measured by your average dyno in America) I made 330whp on my original HT12's, which were on their last leg, the only thing stopping me from going further was my stock fuel system. Porting the exhaust side of the engine is only as efficient as the manifold being used. Since the exhaust manifold is still a large point of restriction wrt twins you will really only be getting gains on the intake side.
Please, somebody else, correct me if I am wrong in saying that to take complete advantage of enlarging the ports you need to be running a single with a less restrictive exhaust manifold.
Seriously, why are you arguing this?? You're sitting here telling people something is NOT POSSIBLE despite the fact that it has been done before (and will be done again). You're demanding proof that it is possible w/o bringing to the table any proof that it isn't possible. I'm here telling you that it is possible and I've done it, and you're grabbing at straws to try to say I'm wrong. Where's your proof? Honestly, opinions only go so far w/o some actual data to back them up... I'm interested to see what you've got as far as supporting evidence.
Oh, and "as well" is two words, not one...
Gas is gas brother, regardless of whether it's pumped in the US or in Europe. The only difference is the value it's rated in (98 RON = 94 Octane) and the additives... the quality of gas stays relatively the same.
Less boost = less horsepower... really? Thanks for educating us noobs here... Octane level determines chances of pre-detonation at different engine temps, last I checked port sizing has nothing to do with the internal temps inside the rotor housing...
Please, somebody else, correct me if I am wrong in saying that to take complete advantage of enlarging the ports you need to be running a single with a less restrictive exhaust manifold.
Seriously, why are you arguing this?? You're sitting here telling people something is NOT POSSIBLE despite the fact that it has been done before (and will be done again). You're demanding proof that it is possible w/o bringing to the table any proof that it isn't possible. I'm here telling you that it is possible and I've done it, and you're grabbing at straws to try to say I'm wrong. Where's your proof? Honestly, opinions only go so far w/o some actual data to back them up... I'm interested to see what you've got as far as supporting evidence.
06-03-08, 06:58 AM
#63
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this discussion about dynos is familiar....
I'm in europe and at least on my country there aren't any of thouse dynos that you guys use (to my knowladge anyways). We use VAMAGs moustly. theres a couple of Rotronix (or similar name, can't recall) and our dynos always show bigger numbers comparing to the same setup on the USA on a dyno-jet/whatever.
Example: My dyno was 300whp @ 0.8 bar with: Downpipe, RB cat-back, PFC and intake. on 95 octane btw. don't know AFR, but it was damn ritch....
I'm in europe and at least on my country there aren't any of thouse dynos that you guys use (to my knowladge anyways). We use VAMAGs moustly. theres a couple of Rotronix (or similar name, can't recall) and our dynos always show bigger numbers comparing to the same setup on the USA on a dyno-jet/whatever.
Example: My dyno was 300whp @ 0.8 bar with: Downpipe, RB cat-back, PFC and intake. on 95 octane btw. don't know AFR, but it was damn ritch....
06-03-08, 07:02 AM
#64
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oh, and regarding the 1.1bar is too mutch for any turbo:
EVO 8's do 1.5bar stock and new from the dealership here. I was told that it was to compensate for the extra cats they have to be equiped to pass smog.
EVO 8's do 1.5bar stock and new from the dealership here. I was told that it was to compensate for the extra cats they have to be equiped to pass smog.
06-03-08, 07:43 AM
#65
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
i been around for 10 yrs....people in the north east know my car and know me. you are a troll. 350rwhp is common knowledge. there is no pt in argueing with you. **** you can make more then 350! i really cant take this forum anymore. when i was a newbie i listened more then i posted. in fact the first few yrs i simply lurked. what is wrong with todays youth.
Last edited by matty; 06-03-08 at 07:53 AM.
06-03-08, 10:08 AM
#67
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
i think he was using those numbers in an effort to make a case against dynos in that they can be wrong.
here you go:
it is def possible but I wouldnt really worry about dyno numbers for example there is a guy on here that dynoed 342 rwhp and ran 11.00 which is not possible if you do the math with a 2700 pound car. So this can work both ways more or less than you actually have.
I would just follow everyones tips on mods and see how happy you are with the power it provides for you.
I would just follow everyones tips on mods and see how happy you are with the power it provides for you.
06-03-08, 01:03 PM
#68
FREAK ALL OUT!!!
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When I said that I was saying that the dyno numbers cant be taken to seriously because if you do the math it is impossible for a 342 rwhp car to run that fast of a quartermile. Hey guess what you can see him run his low 11 second quarter mile right now just click on the link and you will find his dyno and his runs. Now you know him to man awesome huh?
http://czfitnessproducts.com/tom94RX-7/
06-03-08, 01:12 PM
#69
06-03-08, 03:30 PM
#72
Ok read this very slowly cause you seem to have a hard time understanding things.
When I said that I was saying that the dyno numbers cant be taken to seriously because if you do the math it is impossible for a 342 rwhp car to run that fast of a quartermile. Hey guess what you can see him run his low 11 second quarter mile right now just click on the link and you will find his dyno and his runs. Now you know him to man awesome huh?
http://czfitnessproducts.com/tom94RX-7/
When I said that I was saying that the dyno numbers cant be taken to seriously because if you do the math it is impossible for a 342 rwhp car to run that fast of a quartermile. Hey guess what you can see him run his low 11 second quarter mile right now just click on the link and you will find his dyno and his runs. Now you know him to man awesome huh?
http://czfitnessproducts.com/tom94RX-7/
Nice video btw. Like i said earlier. Its VERY UNLIKELY but not impossible as only TWO proven FD's has shown what that other guy was saying hp vs 1/4 time.
06-03-08, 05:56 PM
#73
Apparently its YOU who dont understand. And i was even quoting your own words and asking you a question from it and you still didnt get it. O well, i tried.
Nice video btw. Like i said earlier. Its VERY UNLIKELY but not impossible as only TWO proven FD's has shown what that other guy was saying hp vs 1/4 time.
Nice video btw. Like i said earlier. Its VERY UNLIKELY but not impossible as only TWO proven FD's has shown what that other guy was saying hp vs 1/4 time.
im pretty sure the guy in the video is running 19psi
06-03-08, 06:07 PM
#74
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Apparently its YOU who dont understand. And i was even quoting your own words and asking you a question from it and you still didnt get it. O well, i tried.
Nice video btw. Like i said earlier. Its VERY UNLIKELY but not impossible as only TWO proven FD's has shown what that other guy was saying hp vs 1/4 time.
Nice video btw. Like i said earlier. Its VERY UNLIKELY but not impossible as only TWO proven FD's has shown what that other guy was saying hp vs 1/4 time.