Aspect28

iTrader: (3)

Hey Fellow RX-7 Owners, (I hope)

I have a 2nd gen, of course, 1990 S5 rx7.
I recently received a problem with my wipers and washer motors.
Now I have searched alot to find more info/diy threads so please don't bash on me that I should do so.
So the real problem is that, My wipers won't stop, regardless of position the **** is on, (Off, INT, I, II, Mist) it keeps going. Now although I noticed it goes slower when I put it to "I".

I didn't have this problem before and also my washer doesn't work like it use to.

I've take it apart and noticed someone tore off the plastic piece in-order to get to the 3rd Relay.

Before my wipers wouldn't turn off, my sprayer button would make the wipers go but nothing shoots out.

I purchased an S4 Wiper Switch and that didn't help much, as only "I" worked. Also when I turn it off, it doesn't return to rest position, so I gotta time it when I turn it off.

(Using the S4 switch for now, I still have my older one.)

And if it makes a difference, I don't have a rear wiper.

Now, I'm looking at a few options,
1. Buy new relay, de-solder, all that.
2. Bring it to a mechanic shop and let them do the diagnosing?

I'm sure there are more options, can someone help me out?

Thanks,
Kevin

AGreen

iTrader: (11)

Contact Pele. I think he rebuilds these.
You could try replacing the relays, but you're better off letting someone with experience do it. It's a real pain in the ***.

HAILERS2

It's the wiper switch/relay. Don't wast money having someone diagnose it. It's NEVER the motor. Just my opinion.

nycgps

iTrader: (4)

Buy a new relay, de-solder, re-solder. done

Sounds simple, but I seen a lot of "**** ups". and guess what, I throw those core away and keep the core charge.

You can try to fix it on your own. otherwise gimme a pm.

jjcobm

iTrader: (18)

I just repaired one of these. Parts are around $18 shipped. If you are not experienced in de-soldering, do not attempt as you will screw the board up. The O.E. solder is a pain to remove.

EnjoiPugs

How about soldering the new relay to the other side of the board? Any opinions on this method? I too am looking to fix an s4 wiper switch.

Pele

iTrader: (28)

There is no space on the other side of the board. Also, the relay you get would have to be an exact mirror image of the relay that's already there... All known replacement parts are identical, not an exact mirror image.

Aspect28

iTrader: (3)

That sounded like a good solution, though, the plastic white piece needed to go back on to prevent dust? any debris? i don't know.

So I guess I gotta find someone who can De-Solder... and purchase a relay at a radio shack? or some electronics store?

Aspect28

iTrader: (3)

well, did some more searching and found that Icemark wrote this on a thread.

"Okay guys.

One speed (med) indicates that you have a bad relay #1

No med speed, but intermittent and high works fine, means a bad relay #2 (as long as you have not worked on the switch yet).


S4 GXL/Turbo switch shown, S5 switches simular

Not stopping, indicates something bad with the motor.

Stopping but not returning to the down position when the switch is turned off, indicates a bad trace or bad relay #2... but if you just worked on the switch and replaced relay #1, chances are 99% that you have a bad trace.

Rear wiper not working or no intermittent, indicates a bad relay #3.

Relay #1 and #3 are the same part number and interchangable, however relay #2 is a differnt type of relay.

Convertibles and coupes without a rear wiper will not have a relay #3. "


Now... mine did not stop with the original wiper switch, but I swapped in an S4 switch and it only works on 1 speed and doesn't return to rest position after off. So does this still mean my wiper motor is bad?

Pele

iTrader: (28)

^

No...

There are two relays for the front wiper and one additional one for rear wiper equipped cars...

One is a small relay. It is responsible for the auto-park feature that will bring the blades to the bottom of the glass. INTermittent delay relies on this feature as it will pulse the motor up and then the auto-park feature will bring it down to the bottom.

If this relay fails, the wipers will NOT return to the bottom of the glass when you turn the switch off... However, all other features should remain operational.


The second relay is for High/Low speed selection. HOWEVER, keep in mind that auto-park and intermittent will use high speed to move the wipers. Hence if this relay fails, you will not only lose high speed but intermittent AND auto-park. This is the #1 failure in wiper switches.

The third relay in rear wiper equipped vehicles is simply another auto-park relay for the rear wipers. It usually does not fail for a two main reasons... The rear wiper is less often used than the fronts and the rear wiper does not consume as much power as the fronts. It has a smaller motor and only one blade to move versus the two blades and rack under the cowl. Its mechanism is also not subject to the weather...


Now, the relays fail because they are of a TWO PIECE design... That is, they are a regular open relay with a plastic cap over them. You can both feel and see a little groove between the base of the relay and the cap. Occasionally, I find oil and/or water in this groove showing that environmental (Moisture, humidity, etc.) has gotten inside the relay. This contamination will corrode the contacts inside the relay causing them to not pass as much power. (Due to increased resistance in the circuit.)

Also, originally the relays in the switch were standard copper contacts. They were rated for 5 amps I think... This is about what the wiper motor takes when starting up, so already from the factory, you're right on the limit... Add the reduced power capacity due to the corrosion and you have a perfect recipe for failure. I have seen numerous relays pulled from FC wiper switches where the clear plastic cap has become warped and discolored from the heat produced by failed contacts.

The new, updated relays as spec'ed out by Icemark's writeup are sealed... That is they assemble the relay and have a layer of adhesive to completely seal up the relay. No moisture can enter and destroy the contacts.

The contacts are also of a silver allow according to the spec sheet. They are rated to 8 amps, so they have more current carrying capability.

If I can find some of the old relays that are good examples of failure and a good macro camera, then I will post up some pictures of the failures... I usually send the old relays back to the customer so that they can see the damage first hand.

S5 Matt

Bringing this thread back to life, what relays did you use to replace the old ones? Any part numbers, brand or literally anything would be helpful.
I've currently got the PCB board out and have been searching the internet for 2 days trying to decipher what it is I need.
Thankyou in advance.

Hot_Dog

I rebuilt my wiper switch last summer. Here's a list of components used on my S5 switch with rear wiper. The first relay listed are the two smaller ones on top and bottom of PCB. The second relay listed is larger center relay. I believe it is for the rear wiper. This relay replaces the stock relay, which is NLA from Omron. This relay is taller than the stock relay and will require some trimming of plastic on the switch. You should also replace the seven electrolytic capacitors as listed below. E-caps typically have a limited lifetime of about 5-7 years before their performance starts degrading. The resistors and Zener diodes probably don't need replacing but I listed them for your reference. I have no specs for the Zener diodes. I bought these components from Mouser Electronics. Most are listed on Mouser's site as long lead time items. You might want to try another source such as Digi-Key. Hope this helps.

Mouser# 653-G6C-2114P-DC12
Mfg# G6C-2114P-US-DC12
Omron General Purpose Relays
US HTS:8536410020 ECCN:EAR99 COO:JP
(Qty. 2 - $9.45)
Long lead time reported on this product.

Mouser# 653-G5LE-14-DC12
Mfg# G5LE-14-DC12
Omron General Purpose Relays
US HTS:8536410020 ECCN:EAR99 COO:MY
(Qty. 1 - $2.29)
Long lead time reported on this product.

Electrolytic Capacitors:
647-UVZ1C470MDD
UVZ1C470MDD
16volts 47uF
Qty. 4 - 47 uF, 16V (C1, C3, C5, C8)

667-EEU-HD1C101
EEU-HD1C101
100uF 16volts
Qty. 3 - 100 uF, 16V (C2, C6. C7)
Long lead time reported on this product.

Resistors:
Qty. 2 - 560 ohm +/- 5% (Green-Blue-Brown-Gold) (R22, R9)
Zener Diodes:
Qty. 2 - Zener Diodes (ZD1, ZD2) - I have not info on the Zeners.

Nosferatu

First ...thankyou for adding this info.

That second relay you listed seems to be backordered or nla everywhere...newark listed a substitute

Multicomp Pro MC25113
seems to have the same specs as the one you have listed (Omron G5LE-14-DC12) ...anybody use this as a substitute ?