2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992) 1986-1992 Discussion including performance modifications and technical support sections.

The what have I gotten my self into thread.

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Old Dec 15, 2014 | 07:56 AM
  #26  
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Just re-read the part about the compression test. Its correct to have the check valve removed, and you also need to make sure you have a good charge on the battery. The fact that all 3 pulses were even is promising. Have you had a chance to run the test again with the throttle pedal down?
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Old Dec 16, 2014 | 10:19 AM
  #27  
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I did run it again. This time I didn't have a helper with me so I bought a remote starter and made the floor mat hold the throttle open. I saw 70psi and 60psi. Not a giant increase but some. When I get done with finals and tow the car to my parents I'll run the check again with my dad just to make sure the vaccum of the engine didnt pull the throttle closed when I checked it last.
On Friday I plan on towing the rx7 on a uhaul dolly. What way do I put it on the dolly? Back it on or nose on? I think I'll have trouble with the rear being to low cause I have cut springs so I'm thinking back it on?
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Old Dec 16, 2014 | 10:36 AM
  #28  
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Rear wheels off the ground is best.

When you do that second test, pour in a teaspoon of oil into the chamber before testing. Use the bottom plug hole for pouring in.
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Old Dec 16, 2014 | 01:58 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by pfsantos
Rear wheels off the ground is best.

When you do that second test, pour in a teaspoon of oil into the chamber before testing. Use the bottom plug hole for pouring in.
A turkey Baster makes that much easier.
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Old Dec 16, 2014 | 02:54 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by jjwalker
A turkey Baster makes that much easier.
Wait for it...
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Old Dec 16, 2014 | 03:00 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by clokker
Wait for it...
I was thinking the same thing when i posted that.
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Old Dec 16, 2014 | 10:44 PM
  #32  
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No I didn't put any oil in the housings, I didn't have any turkey basters handy. Haha
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Old Dec 17, 2014 | 02:56 PM
  #33  
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Anything in the kitchen is fair game for using on the car. And ovens for powder coating.

If your kitchen isn't well supplied, time to stock up on things that double for use in the garage.
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Old Dec 17, 2014 | 04:41 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by pfsantos
Anything in the kitchen is fair game for using on the car. And ovens for powder coating.

If your kitchen isn't well supplied, time to stock up on things that double for use in the garage.
Been there done that... Mom didn't like it when I stole stuff out of the kitchen back in highschool. I need to run by the good will and go through the kitchen supplies.

Also I've been curious about Vmount set ups. One thing I've noticed is that lots of people usually go with an aftermarket hood. Is it a necessity to go to an aftermarket hood with vents? Also is it possible to keep your A/C condenser and oil cooler in the stock location?

I have my last final tomorrow night so after that I'm going to start work on the rx7 probably next week. Is there anything that would be good to buy before I try to swap the kegs? Any gaskets that I definitely won't be able to reuse? Is there anything I should change in the engine bay that's easy while the engine is out? My clutch feels good but it seams like its dragging a bit. When I first start the car letting out the clutch while its not in gear will draw down the revs and try to kill the engine until it warms up. Is this just an adjustment issue or should I replace it when I do the engine.
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Old Dec 17, 2014 | 06:19 PM
  #35  
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It's all well and good to configure the cores so they get airflow but unless you efficiently extract that air, the whole thing is pointless.
So yeah, I'd consider some sort of hood venting to be mandatory with a v-mount setup.

If fiscally possible, assume you'll replace ALL the gaskets and hoses.
You can make the future you happy by doing this when the intake is all apart:
-Remove all the studs and block sand the flanges
-Chase all the threaded holes/studs
-Before installing the new gaskets, smear both sides with a thin coat of grease.
This not only helps seal but will probably allow the gasket to release intact next time.

Take a look at the waterport on the back of the pump housing- the one that feeds the BAC and thermowax- as they like to clog up.

EVERYTHING is easier in the engine bay with the engine out...the list of things you could do is endless.
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Old Dec 17, 2014 | 08:14 PM
  #36  
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Okay so what gaskets should I get? I'd like to just use all of my s5 stuff on my s4 keg but I've read that I cannot use the s5 intake on the s4 keg? Is this true?
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Old Dec 18, 2014 | 08:23 AM
  #37  
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As general rule, any parts you take apart, replace gasket. Worth repeating, what clokker said about making sure the gasket mating surfaces are clean of old gasket bits, and nice and clean. edit: Removing the studs is almost a must for a good job, and it'll make cleaning MUCH easier. Cover the holes first so **** doesn't go in (including hardware), then when clean, blow out before removing. When cleaning, use a razor blade on a handle, gasket scraper or other proper, safe way. Don't gouge the soft aluminum. Very easy to do.

I've never heard of applying grease (be sure it won't mess up the gasket), but I usually apply a very thin smear of gasket maker on each side of the parts before putting on the gasket.

Once again, if you wanna keep it simple, keep S4 stuff on the engine. Some things on the S5 intake are controlled via diff. solenoids, activated by the S5 ECU.
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Old Dec 18, 2014 | 12:37 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by scott84
Been there done that... Mom didn't like it when I stole stuff out of the kitchen back in highschool. I need to run by the good will and go through the kitchen supplies.

Also I've been curious about Vmount set ups. One thing I've noticed is that lots of people usually go with an aftermarket hood. Is it a necessity to go to an aftermarket hood with vents? Also is it possible to keep your A/C condenser and oil cooler in the stock location?

I have my last final tomorrow night so after that I'm going to start work on the rx7 probably next week. Is there anything that would be good to buy before I try to swap the kegs? Any gaskets that I definitely won't be able to reuse? Is there anything I should change in the engine bay that's easy while the engine is out? My clutch feels good but it seams like its dragging a bit. When I first start the car letting out the clutch while its not in gear will draw down the revs and try to kill the engine until it warms up. Is this just an adjustment issue or should I replace it when I do the engine.
You can adjust and fix your clutch issue at the clutch pedal. There are jam nuts and you just loosen those and retract the rod back a bit.
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Old Dec 21, 2014 | 12:00 PM
  #39  
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Well I drove the car the 250 miles to my home town where I'm going to do the the engine swap. Everything went well, no problems. I'm going to yank the motor out after Christmas over at a friends that has all of the tools and heat!

I was going to get a fuel pump for Christmas. I was looking at the walbro 255 lph FD pump, a aeromotive stealth 340, and then I also saw a walbro 400 lph which doesn't look like a direct replacement. I was leaning towards the Stealth 340 because it is a direct replacement and it gives me room to grow. I wanted to build my fuel system up to be bullet proof and so I'd never run into detonation again. How does the stealth hold up does any body run one? Do I need to run a FPR or will be factory one on the rail work?
Thanks!
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Old Dec 21, 2014 | 12:23 PM
  #40  
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Please don't start swapping things around all at once. Approach these problems by making single changes. For example, don't swap the injectors and fuel pump and rebuild the engine and turbo all at once. Changing one thing at a time will make trouble shooting much easier and faster. I'd start with the engine. Get a flashlight and look into that rear exhaust port. Rotate the engine slowly and check the apex seals. Make sure all 3 are there and they spring smoothly in the apex seal slots when you press on them with a finger. Doing this will give you an idea about what's wrong in that rear housing. Next, remove the flywheel and rear iron and inspect the housing and rear plate for wear. You have an undocumented engine which is pretty scary because you have no idea about the quality of the parts the last guy used in the rebuild. They wear could be out of spec or close to the max limits of the tolerances. You're going to need a straight edge and feeler gauges. Pineapple racing produced a series of very detailed rebuild procedures. You might want to watch them for reference.

After rebuilding just the rear section of the engine (or the whole thing), start it up and make sure the rebuild is solid. Remove that fuel cut defender (black box that says FBCD) by the passenger fender. Remove any device that raises boost above stock levels. The turbo should have a vacuum line from the compressor straight to the waste gate.

Inspect the turbo with a dial indicator and verify the play is out of spec. Jim and Gerry at the GPOP shop would be happy to answer your turbo questions and provide the necessary parts/service. They do great work.

Then buy/rent/borrow a wide band 02 sensor and monitor the air fuel ratio. Pay attention to the a/f ratio during boost.

If everything checks out and you want more power start researching your options. Your primary focus right now should be making the car run like stock.

Happy holidays and good luck!
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Old Dec 21, 2014 | 01:29 PM
  #41  
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You make a valid point, its easy to get over excited and get ahead of my self. I did a visual expectation of my s4 engine. I rotated the rotors around the housing and looked at all of the apex seals and didn't see any chips or cracks but I did not look in the housings with a flash light or push in the seals to check the springs. I had planned on rigging some way to do a poor mans compression check on the engine. I was going to try to rig up a starter or maybe try to turn it over with air tools but I'm hesitant to turn the engine over by the fly wheel nut. When I turned the engine over by had I could hear the compression of the engine. This engine had papers with it at one point in time, but I don't have them. I know its been run after the rebuild but I don't know how long. I have a baggie that came with engine that had some bolts in it that was from Atkins rotary. So I bet the rebuild kit came from them. I do have a wide band gauge in the car.

Originally Posted by PvillKnight7
Please don't start swapping things around all at once. Approach these problems by making single changes. For example, don't swap the injectors and fuel pump and rebuild the engine and turbo all at once. Changing one thing at a time will make trouble shooting much easier and faster. I'd start with the engine. Get a flashlight and look into that rear exhaust port. Rotate the engine slowly and check the apex seals. Make sure all 3 are there and they spring smoothly in the apex seal slots when you press on them with a finger. Doing this will give you an idea about what's wrong in that rear housing. Next, remove the flywheel and rear iron and inspect the housing and rear plate for wear. You have an undocumented engine which is pretty scary because you have no idea about the quality of the parts the last guy used in the rebuild. They wear could be out of spec or close to the max limits of the tolerances. You're going to need a straight edge and feeler gauges. Pineapple racing produced a series of very detailed rebuild procedures. You might want to watch them for reference.

After rebuilding just the rear section of the engine (or the whole thing), start it up and make sure the rebuild is solid. Remove that fuel cut defender (black box that says FBCD) by the passenger fender. Remove any device that raises boost above stock levels. The turbo should have a vacuum line from the compressor straight to the waste gate.

Inspect the turbo with a dial indicator and verify the play is out of spec. Jim and Gerry at the GPOP shop would be happy to answer your turbo questions and provide the necessary parts/service. They do great work.

Then buy/rent/borrow a wide band 02 sensor and monitor the air fuel ratio. Pay attention to the a/f ratio during boost.

If everything checks out and you want more power start researching your options. Your primary focus right now should be making the car run like stock.

Happy holidays and good luck!
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Old Dec 21, 2014 | 03:51 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by scott84
You make a valid point, its easy to get over excited and get ahead of my self. I did a visual expectation of my s4 engine. I rotated the rotors around the housing and looked at all of the apex seals and didn't see any chips or cracks but I did not look in the housings with a flash light or push in the seals to check the springs. I had planned on rigging some way to do a poor mans compression check on the engine. I was going to try to rig up a starter or maybe try to turn it over with air tools but I'm hesitant to turn the engine over by the fly wheel nut. When I turned the engine over by had I could hear the compression of the engine. This engine had papers with it at one point in time, but I don't have them. I know its been run after the rebuild but I don't know how long. I have a baggie that came with engine that had some bolts in it that was from Atkins rotary. So I bet the rebuild kit came from them. I do have a wide band gauge in the car.
That's good you already have a way to monitor the fuel.

You really need to open up the engine and find the issue in the rear housing. The difference in compression between the front and rear could be due to one or a combination of issues. It could be that one of the round corner seals is sticking and isn't moving up and down. It should be obvious when you press on them and they don't return. Same for the side seals. They need to move smoothly in the slots. It's also possible the port job was performed incorrectly and caused damage to the side seals. The housings could be flaking or scratched. You won't know until you take a peek inside.

The rear plate can be removed without causing separation of the other plates and housings. You need to fabricate plates to bolt on where the exhaust manifold and intake manifold attach. You can also attach the oil pan so it'f offset towards the front of the engine. I forgot what I put on the spark plug side but I've bolted something to that side too to keep the engine together.
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Old Dec 21, 2014 | 05:02 PM
  #43  
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I think I know what happened to the s5 engine, I was stupid and I didn't know what had been done to my car. The car has a "walbro pump" from what the PO said. Do they make a smaller one than the 255? Idk I bet its a 255 looking back on it. It has a turbo back exhaust and a cork sport intake along with the FCD. The car really needs a RTEK and bigger secondaries. After reading a thread about the FCD I think I had boost creep and I was hitting 15+ psi on the stock fuel system causing the detonation. The Last poor mans compression check I did was with a cold engine because that will lead to the most compression. I did squirt oil into the housings. I saw 90 psi on the front and 70 on the rear. The S5 engine was built with a Atkins rotary kit and and has RA apex seals. No porting was done.

Once I get the engine out of the car I will do some inspection on the engine.

Originally Posted by PvillKnight7
That's good you already have a way to monitor the fuel.

You really need to open up the engine and find the issue in the rear housing. The difference in compression between the front and rear could be due to one or a combination of issues. It could be that one of the round corner seals is sticking and isn't moving up and down. It should be obvious when you press on them and they don't return. Same for the side seals. They need to move smoothly in the slots. It's also possible the port job was performed incorrectly and caused damage to the side seals. The housings could be flaking or scratched. You won't know until you take a peek inside.

The rear plate can be removed without causing separation of the other plates and housings. You need to fabricate plates to bolt on where the exhaust manifold and intake manifold attach. You can also attach the oil pan so it'f offset towards the front of the engine. I forgot what I put on the spark plug side but I've bolted something to that side too to keep the engine together.
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Old Dec 22, 2014 | 06:50 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by scott84
I think I know what happened to the s5 engine, I was stupid and I didn't know what had been done to my car. The car has a "walbro pump" from what the PO said. Do they make a smaller one than the 255? Idk I bet its a 255 looking back on it. It has a turbo back exhaust and a cork sport intake along with the FCD. The car really needs a RTEK and bigger secondaries. After reading a thread about the FCD I think I had boost creep and I was hitting 15+ psi on the stock fuel system causing the detonation. The Last poor mans compression check I did was with a cold engine because that will lead to the most compression. I did squirt oil into the housings. I saw 90 psi on the front and 70 on the rear. The S5 engine was built with a Atkins rotary kit and and has RA apex seals. No porting was done.

Once I get the engine out of the car I will do some inspection on the engine.
It doesn't sounds like it was your fault unless the previous owner specifically told you "Hey, don't boost this car because the setup isn't solid and the engine will fail. I'm selling you an unfinished setup".

Checking out the fuel pump is pretty simple. You need to energize the pump with 12VDC and use a timer to time how long it takes to fill a container of known volume. I've used milk jugs. Looking back on my notes, a pump capable of 255lb/hr will fill a gallon in 80 seconds.

To be really sure how much power the pump can support, repeat the flow test while supplying the fuel pressure regulator vacuum reference port with 10 psi, 15 psi, or the max amount of boost you expect to see.

A RTEK and bigger secondaries sounds solid if the pump can supply the fuel.
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Old Dec 28, 2014 | 02:26 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by PvillKnight7
It doesn't sounds like it was your fault unless the previous owner specifically told you "Hey, don't boost this car because the setup isn't solid and the engine will fail. I'm selling you an unfinished setup".

Checking out the fuel pump is pretty simple. You need to energize the pump with 12VDC and use a timer to time how long it takes to fill a container of known volume. I've used milk jugs. Looking back on my notes, a pump capable of 255lb/hr will fill a gallon in 80 seconds.

To be really sure how much power the pump can support, repeat the flow test while supplying the fuel pressure regulator vacuum reference port with 10 psi, 15 psi, or the max amount of boost you expect to see.

A RTEK and bigger secondaries sounds solid if the pump can supply the fuel.
Great info! I'm planning on starting to pull the engine in the car tomorrow.
So while the engine is out I plan on rebuilding the turbo and Porting the waste-gate. I've done some searching around read through a bunch of different threads but I haven't seen any definitive waste gate porting threads. Are there any guides out there?

I'd like to put the car basically back to stock for now until I have a good running car to build up. Will porting the wastegate help enough with boost creep on my car that has a corksport intake and turbo back exhaust with no cats?

After I get the other engine in the car and running should I run the FCD or should I run it over with the car and throw it off a cliff? As of right now when the fuel cut defender is unhooked the car boosts to almost 10 psi and then cuts out, is this the reason why the FCD was installed? When the car Cuts out is that bad for the engine?Also I have a BOV to put on the car will installing it and setting it to about 8-9 psi be a good idea?

I guess more or less what I'm asking is what do I need to do to get my car running right after I get the S4 engine swapped in?

Thanks All!

The what have I gotten my self into thread.-fgpjam0.jpg
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