Taurus E-fan or Mercury Villager E-fan
10-26-12, 12:04 PM
#1
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Taurus E-fan or Mercury Villager E-fan
Heyoh guys, I've decided to do an electric fan conversion because the clutch fan along with the stock shrowd is such a pain to put in and take out with my koyo radiator.
I've been reading up on people's opinions on either using the Ford Taurus E-fan or the Mercury Villary E-fan (92-95), but there's a ton of controversy as to which to choose. The Ford Taurus swap seems to be more popular, but from what i've researched, there's a high amp draw as well as it not completely fitting on the koyo. cfm is 2300 on low and 4500 cfm on high. On the flip side, the mercury villager seems to fit perfectly-- i'm just not sure if the cfm is as good as the taurus.
I also am thinking of just wiring it up with an on/off switch rather than dealing with a thermoswitch. thoughts on that?
Any input would be nice to help make my decision, thanks in advance!
I've been reading up on people's opinions on either using the Ford Taurus E-fan or the Mercury Villary E-fan (92-95), but there's a ton of controversy as to which to choose. The Ford Taurus swap seems to be more popular, but from what i've researched, there's a high amp draw as well as it not completely fitting on the koyo. cfm is 2300 on low and 4500 cfm on high. On the flip side, the mercury villager seems to fit perfectly-- i'm just not sure if the cfm is as good as the taurus.
I also am thinking of just wiring it up with an on/off switch rather than dealing with a thermoswitch. thoughts on that?
Any input would be nice to help make my decision, thanks in advance!
10-26-12, 12:13 PM
#3
I would say no on having just a switch. I did that and my car almosts overheated on me a few times because I forgot to turn it on. I have also killed my battery by leaving it on.
for me the Villager fan was easier to find. Since it is also in a nissian quest. The Taurus fan is from a spefic year range and only with the bigger 3.8L. My friend and I just pulled both types from the junkyard earlier this week. He already Had a Taurus fan, I went with the villager it isn't installed yet.
for me the Villager fan was easier to find. Since it is also in a nissian quest. The Taurus fan is from a spefic year range and only with the bigger 3.8L. My friend and I just pulled both types from the junkyard earlier this week. He already Had a Taurus fan, I went with the villager it isn't installed yet.
10-26-12, 12:17 PM
#4
Jackhild 59 actually measured the amp draw at 15A on low and 20-something on high (IIRC).
That seems counterintuitive.
10-26-12, 01:10 PM
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The only benefit I see of using the switch would be the fact that i could cool the motor even after i shut the engine off-- that's one benefit of an e-fan over the clutch fan. The thermoswitch would be ideal so i wouldn't have to think about it, so i'll probably go that route. @clokker thanks for disproving some myths of the taurus. do you think i even need the high speed cfm of the taurus fan? @raksj04, I'm leaning towards the mercury villager efan because of it taking less power to run it--right?
10-26-12, 01:36 PM
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How To Properly Install An Electric Fan
You don't need a switch to keep the fan running after engine shutdown. AaronCake has written a lengthy install guide on his website of exactly how to wire it. Hope this helps you with your decision.
Justin
You don't need a switch to keep the fan running after engine shutdown. AaronCake has written a lengthy install guide on his website of exactly how to wire it. Hope this helps you with your decision.
Justin
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03-18-13, 09:47 AM
#11
I have been asked to install a j/y fan for a friend's FB with 13-B. According to this diagram, the villager radiator fan is 19x23.5 without the tabs. Can someone please confirm the thickness (see picture on the right)? I want to make sure that there is enough clearance between the e-fan motor and the engine's main/water pump pulley. thanks
03-18-13, 12:59 PM
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Siranko: The villager fan fits like a glove.,just minor trimming,take the tabs off the Shroud,make a couple s type brackets and you are good to go.I got one ON my car.took about 40 minutes to install.
Reply for OP:
You have to trust me on this one.Get a sensor to activate the fan.
I had mine hooked to a switch.
Car flooded so I shut the fan off to allow extra cranking.
Finally it fires up,Take off and go "whew,,got the car started"!,
..Why is the Car OVERHEATING??..
WOOPS!
It only takes ONE time and it will cost ya 2K..so get a 20 buck sensor.
Reply for OP:
You have to trust me on this one.Get a sensor to activate the fan.
I had mine hooked to a switch.
Car flooded so I shut the fan off to allow extra cranking.
Finally it fires up,Take off and go "whew,,got the car started"!,
..Why is the Car OVERHEATING??..
WOOPS!
It only takes ONE time and it will cost ya 2K..so get a 20 buck sensor.
Last edited by misterstyx69; 03-18-13 at 01:02 PM.
03-19-13, 05:16 PM
#13
Reply for OP:
You have to trust me on this one.Get a sensor to activate the fan.
I had mine hooked to a switch.
Car flooded so I shut the fan off to allow extra cranking.
Finally it fires up,Take off and go "whew,,got the car started"!,
..Why is the Car OVERHEATING??..
WOOPS!
It only takes ONE time and it will cost ya 2K..so get a 20 buck sensor.
You have to trust me on this one.Get a sensor to activate the fan.
I had mine hooked to a switch.
Car flooded so I shut the fan off to allow extra cranking.
Finally it fires up,Take off and go "whew,,got the car started"!,
..Why is the Car OVERHEATING??..
WOOPS!
It only takes ONE time and it will cost ya 2K..so get a 20 buck sensor.
03-19-13, 05:23 PM
#14
If I do ill use a switch to.turn it on at 195? I'm still considering using the stock fan.
How would you know if your fan is wired wrong and spinning the wrong way? Mine is supposedly from a Pontiac fiero.
03-19-13, 07:00 PM
#15
I got the efan on my car. I'm not sure where the wiring came from but I'm a bit uneasy about using it.
If I do ill use a switch to.turn it on at 195? I'm still considering using the stock fan.
How would you know if your fan is wired wrong and spinning the wrong way? Mine is supposedly from a Pontiac fiero.
If I do ill use a switch to.turn it on at 195? I'm still considering using the stock fan.
How would you know if your fan is wired wrong and spinning the wrong way? Mine is supposedly from a Pontiac fiero.
I used a Starion temp switch because it fits the OEM location on the back of my S5 turbo waterpump housing perfectly. I removed (IIRC) the thermoswitch that turned on the optional A/C fan and popped the Starion in. It's a direct bolt in and (again IIRC) has a 195 on switch.
You will know if the fan is reversed polarity because it will spin in the opposite direction. It will push air rather than pull air.
In my case I was lazy in checking the wiring on my fan. I simply took a spare battery and some jumper wires to find what I thought was low speed on the Taurus efan. The fan is a 3 wire fan, so I assumed that the other wire was then high speed. I am not using both high and low switches at the same time. I simply physically plug high in when I want to use it rather than low. All that being said, I swapped to what I thought was high. When the fan kicked on it pushed rather than pulled.
03-19-13, 07:18 PM
#16
Whether an efan is "better" is debatable and you can find all kinds of threads on that topic. I prefer the efan because getting OEM fan shroud off the radiator makes working on the front of the engine so much easier.
I used a Starion temp switch because it fits the OEM location on the back of my S5 turbo waterpump housing perfectly. I removed (IIRC) the thermoswitch that turned on the optional A/C fan and popped the Starion in. It's a direct bolt in and (again IIRC) has a 195 on switch.
You will know if the fan is reversed polarity because it will spin in the opposite direction. It will push air rather than pull air.
In my case I was lazy in checking the wiring on my fan. I simply took a spare battery and some jumper wires to find what I thought was low speed on the Taurus efan. The fan is a 3 wire fan, so I assumed that the other wire was then high speed. I am not using both high and low switches at the same time. I simply physically plug high in when I want to use it rather than low. All that being said, I swapped to what I thought was high. When the fan kicked on it pushed rather than pulled.
The guy that had my car hooked it up to run constantly, which isn't the right way to do it.
03-20-13, 06:37 AM
#18
I'm going to step in and correct some misinformation:
You need a thermoswitch, you WILL forget to turn on the fan without one.
The 2-speed Taurus fan is well known in every aftermarket for moving boatloads of air. It seems kind of silly to get anything that does less when they are common, cheap and do the job properly.
The downside to moving so much air is the HEAVY current draw and HEAVIER inrush current draw. This is why I recommend a 130A Taurus Alternator and doing both mods together. The following figures are courtesy of Eric on the Pirate4x4 Forum in the following link: Taurus Electric Fan ? - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
With a FD alternator, I found the Taurus fan to be a bit more than it could handle. Swap over to a Taurus Alt and problem solved. If you're thinking about using a stock S4 alternator, be sure to record a video of how hard the fan pulls the voltage down 
If you'd rather not invest $50 in a Volvo Fan controller (which is just two relays in a box), you can do what I did and use a Volkswagen relay panel. The schematic is the same, but there's a very useful benefit: Replaceable Relays. Part number is 8L0-941-822A and can be found under the dashboard on Mk4 Jettas, Golfs and B5 Passats along with their Audi counterparts. If you do go this route, be aware that you will need the panel's underside connectors and the proper tools to de-pin them.
Here is the circuit I designed to operate the Taurus Fan:
Please excuse the poor quality of this picture as the original would not upload correctly and Photobucket is being dumby.
My fan circuit is wired in the same manner as the Volvo one: power hits the High-speed SPDT relay first, then goes to the SPST Low-speed relay. While I was at it, I also pulled the A/C harness and reworked it to integrate into the panel as well. Last, I gave each thermoswitch a manual override switch wired in parallel.
On the VW panel, socket #1 (leftmost one, directly behind stud "75X" is the A/C Fan relay (turns fan on high when A/C is on). Moving rightward, Relay socket #2 is for Ignition-switched accessories. Might sound kinda dumb, but I found it really useful to have convenient stud terminals that receive power through a dedicated relay wired to the ignition switch. Next, in Relay Socket #3 is the Low-speed relay. Last, Socket #4 has the High-speed Relay, which outputs to the stud terminal marked "87F Diesel".
Stud 75X is power input for Relay #2, while the two "30" studs are for Ignition-switched devices. All of this goes through a 10A fuse in a clever holder that clips right onto the panel. Power for the fan comes in stud "30A" and out stud "87F Diesel" and a 50A Maxi fuse in a nifty fuse socket that clips onto the panel. Both of the fuse holders were either on the panel or its sister panel when I pulled them, so I used them.
What isn't shown in the diagram are the two clip-in sockets on the right end of the panel. Relay #5 is my A/C Main Relay (via the reworked stock A/C harness), and #6 is used specifically for Idle-up on my Haltech.
If you're lucky as I was, you'll find suitable relays in the panel too. The tricky bit is finding one that will survive the massive inrush current on High Speed. Thankfully, such will rarely be encountered thanks to the stepped operation of the circuit. Only way it would happen is by turning on the A/C before the car hits the Low-speed trigger temperature (195 degrees in the picture). Since I made this, my trigger temperature has been changed to 203.
Hope it helps
You need a thermoswitch, you WILL forget to turn on the fan without one.
The 2-speed Taurus fan is well known in every aftermarket for moving boatloads of air. It seems kind of silly to get anything that does less when they are common, cheap and do the job properly.
The downside to moving so much air is the HEAVY current draw and HEAVIER inrush current draw. This is why I recommend a 130A Taurus Alternator and doing both mods together. The following figures are courtesy of Eric on the Pirate4x4 Forum in the following link: Taurus Electric Fan ? - Pirate4x4.Com : 4x4 and Off-Road Forum
Low speed:
Inrush current ~ 30A
Steady state ~ 11A
High speed:
Inrush current ~ 75A
Steady State ~25A
Inrush current ~ 30A
Steady state ~ 11A
High speed:
Inrush current ~ 75A
Steady State ~25A
If you'd rather not invest $50 in a Volvo Fan controller (which is just two relays in a box), you can do what I did and use a Volkswagen relay panel. The schematic is the same, but there's a very useful benefit: Replaceable Relays. Part number is 8L0-941-822A and can be found under the dashboard on Mk4 Jettas, Golfs and B5 Passats along with their Audi counterparts. If you do go this route, be aware that you will need the panel's underside connectors and the proper tools to de-pin them.
Here is the circuit I designed to operate the Taurus Fan:
Please excuse the poor quality of this picture as the original would not upload correctly and Photobucket is being dumby.
My fan circuit is wired in the same manner as the Volvo one: power hits the High-speed SPDT relay first, then goes to the SPST Low-speed relay. While I was at it, I also pulled the A/C harness and reworked it to integrate into the panel as well. Last, I gave each thermoswitch a manual override switch wired in parallel.
On the VW panel, socket #1 (leftmost one, directly behind stud "75X" is the A/C Fan relay (turns fan on high when A/C is on). Moving rightward, Relay socket #2 is for Ignition-switched accessories. Might sound kinda dumb, but I found it really useful to have convenient stud terminals that receive power through a dedicated relay wired to the ignition switch. Next, in Relay Socket #3 is the Low-speed relay. Last, Socket #4 has the High-speed Relay, which outputs to the stud terminal marked "87F Diesel".
Stud 75X is power input for Relay #2, while the two "30" studs are for Ignition-switched devices. All of this goes through a 10A fuse in a clever holder that clips right onto the panel. Power for the fan comes in stud "30A" and out stud "87F Diesel" and a 50A Maxi fuse in a nifty fuse socket that clips onto the panel. Both of the fuse holders were either on the panel or its sister panel when I pulled them, so I used them.
What isn't shown in the diagram are the two clip-in sockets on the right end of the panel. Relay #5 is my A/C Main Relay (via the reworked stock A/C harness), and #6 is used specifically for Idle-up on my Haltech.
If you're lucky as I was, you'll find suitable relays in the panel too. The tricky bit is finding one that will survive the massive inrush current on High Speed. Thankfully, such will rarely be encountered thanks to the stepped operation of the circuit. Only way it would happen is by turning on the A/C before the car hits the Low-speed trigger temperature (195 degrees in the picture). Since I made this, my trigger temperature has been changed to 203.
Hope it helps
03-20-13, 07:30 AM
#19
Let me do the same:
The current draw figures you state fall pretty closely in line with those of Jackhild (see post #28 here) but the inrush number for high speed is very deceptive.
Your figure HAS to be from a test where the fan was started from a dead stop, a condition never seen in the normal application. The fan is already spinning when HIGH is invoked, the extra current needed is way below 75a (or even the 50a Jack measured under the same conditions).
I've been running the Taurus, and now, the even bigger/hungrier 18" Lincoln, fan for years now on a 30a fuse...never popped a fuse or melted any wiring.
The price comparison is also a bit disingenuous, the Volvo setup can be found at the junkyard just as easily as your Volkswagon setup (at a much lower cost than $50) and, assuming you harvest the wiring with the relays, is plug-n-play, no depinning/reconfiguring required.
If you had to buy your relay panel new, the price would be much higher than the Volvo kit new.
The entire setup I've been using for years now, including the fan assembly, cost less than $50 from the junkyard.
I do think your solution is very clever and certainly workable but don't see any particular advantages in cost, size or ease of installation compared to the Volvo circuit (which IMO has a distinct advantage being specifically designed to run a fan...).
The current draw figures you state fall pretty closely in line with those of Jackhild (see post #28 here) but the inrush number for high speed is very deceptive.
Your figure HAS to be from a test where the fan was started from a dead stop, a condition never seen in the normal application. The fan is already spinning when HIGH is invoked, the extra current needed is way below 75a (or even the 50a Jack measured under the same conditions).
I've been running the Taurus, and now, the even bigger/hungrier 18" Lincoln, fan for years now on a 30a fuse...never popped a fuse or melted any wiring.
The price comparison is also a bit disingenuous, the Volvo setup can be found at the junkyard just as easily as your Volkswagon setup (at a much lower cost than $50) and, assuming you harvest the wiring with the relays, is plug-n-play, no depinning/reconfiguring required.
If you had to buy your relay panel new, the price would be much higher than the Volvo kit new.
The entire setup I've been using for years now, including the fan assembly, cost less than $50 from the junkyard.
I do think your solution is very clever and certainly workable but don't see any particular advantages in cost, size or ease of installation compared to the Volvo circuit (which IMO has a distinct advantage being specifically designed to run a fan...).
03-20-13, 07:37 AM
#20
Let me do the same:
The current draw figures you state fall pretty closely in line with those of Jackhild (see post #28 here) but the inrush number for high speed is very deceptive.
Your figure HAS to be from a test where the fan was started from a dead stop, a condition never seen in the normal application. The fan is already spinning when HIGH is invoked, the extra current needed is way below 75a (or even the 50a Jack measured under the same conditions).
I've been running the Taurus, and now, the even bigger/hungrier 18" Lincoln, fan for years now on a 30a fuse...never popped a fuse or melted any wiring.
The price comparison is also a bit disingenuous, the Volvo setup can be found at the junkyard just as easily as your Volkswagon setup (at a much lower cost than $50) and, assuming you harvest the wiring with the relays, is plug-n-play, no depinning/reconfiguring required.
If you had to buy your relay panel new, the price would be much higher than the Volvo kit new.
The entire setup I've been using for years now, including the fan assembly, cost less than $50 from the junkyard.
I do think your solution is very clever and certainly workable but don't see any particular advantages in cost, size or ease of installation compared to the Volvo circuit (which IMO has a distinct advantage being specifically designed to run a fan...).
The current draw figures you state fall pretty closely in line with those of Jackhild (see post #28 here) but the inrush number for high speed is very deceptive.
Your figure HAS to be from a test where the fan was started from a dead stop, a condition never seen in the normal application. The fan is already spinning when HIGH is invoked, the extra current needed is way below 75a (or even the 50a Jack measured under the same conditions).
I've been running the Taurus, and now, the even bigger/hungrier 18" Lincoln, fan for years now on a 30a fuse...never popped a fuse or melted any wiring.
The price comparison is also a bit disingenuous, the Volvo setup can be found at the junkyard just as easily as your Volkswagon setup (at a much lower cost than $50) and, assuming you harvest the wiring with the relays, is plug-n-play, no depinning/reconfiguring required.
If you had to buy your relay panel new, the price would be much higher than the Volvo kit new.
The entire setup I've been using for years now, including the fan assembly, cost less than $50 from the junkyard.
I do think your solution is very clever and certainly workable but don't see any particular advantages in cost, size or ease of installation compared to the Volvo circuit (which IMO has a distinct advantage being specifically designed to run a fan...).
I've got a Pontiac fiero fan, how do those compare with the Taurus fan you're talking about.
03-20-13, 08:00 AM
#21
You can't own this 20+ year old car (or any old car, for that matter) without getting familiar/comfortable with the electrical system.
The fan system is no more complex than the horn circuit, which is about as basic as it gets in automotive wiring.
I have a Godspeed radiator which has the tanks on the sides rather than top/bottom, so my fan options may be different than yours.
I've used the Volvo fan (16" and by far the nicest shroud...it has air bypass flaps), the 17" Taurus and now, the 18" Lincoln.
They all worked fine.
I should note that my car(s) have been NA with no AC, so basically, the best possible scenario cooling-wise.
03-20-13, 08:18 AM
#22
I did not post anything about electrical draw, which is a major concern. If you are running a TMIC you are going to have trouble fitting a Taurus alternator under your TMIC. Here is another option, which is also debatable whether you'll want to do it or not.
A modded 2nd gen alternator from Ace Alternators 110 amps
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1988-Mazda-RX7-R-2-1-3L-Alternator-110Amps-/190535452290?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c5ccc4682&vxp=mtr
Problem with modded alternators is that they do not charge until you have the RPMs up to about 1k. For me it's worth it to simply hold RPMs a little higher at stop lights while the fan is on, than to have to figure out a work around for my TMIC and fitting an alternator under it. Others may chime in differently and that's understandable...there are concerns that come with a modded alternator.
A modded 2nd gen alternator from Ace Alternators 110 amps
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1988-Mazda-RX7-R-2-1-3L-Alternator-110Amps-/190535452290?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c5ccc4682&vxp=mtr
Problem with modded alternators is that they do not charge until you have the RPMs up to about 1k. For me it's worth it to simply hold RPMs a little higher at stop lights while the fan is on, than to have to figure out a work around for my TMIC and fitting an alternator under it. Others may chime in differently and that's understandable...there are concerns that come with a modded alternator.
03-20-13, 10:34 AM
#23
You need to get over that.
You can't own this 20+ year old car (or any old car, for that matter) without getting familiar/comfortable with the electrical system.
The fan system is no more complex than the horn circuit, which is about as basic as it gets in automotive wiring.
No clue, never used one.
I have a Godspeed radiator which has the tanks on the sides rather than top/bottom, so my fan options may be different than yours.
I've used the Volvo fan (16" and by far the nicest shroud...it has air bypass flaps), the 17" Taurus and now, the 18" Lincoln.
They all worked fine.
I should note that my car(s) have been NA with no AC, so basically, the best possible scenario cooling-wise.
You can't own this 20+ year old car (or any old car, for that matter) without getting familiar/comfortable with the electrical system.
The fan system is no more complex than the horn circuit, which is about as basic as it gets in automotive wiring.
No clue, never used one.
I have a Godspeed radiator which has the tanks on the sides rather than top/bottom, so my fan options may be different than yours.
I've used the Volvo fan (16" and by far the nicest shroud...it has air bypass flaps), the 17" Taurus and now, the 18" Lincoln.
They all worked fine.
I should note that my car(s) have been NA with no AC, so basically, the best possible scenario cooling-wise.
I'll need to flush my radiator , basically I'm starting from scratch with my rebuilt engine, trying to redo everything so I know its done right
The car was overheating before but because of bad bearings causing metal on metal contact (obviously excessive friction will cause heat), overheating the oil system etc.
Basically need to get all these parts you're talking about, and figure out where/how I'll hook up the thermal switch.
It might of been easy for you but seems like a project as much as porting my Turbo waste gate.
