HKSpoweredFC3S

Just for a brief idea of whats going.

'90 rx7 gxl/ with a jdm s5 t2 swap.

-n351 ecu...
-n350 maf...
(running 40lbs of fuel)
-ground wire is in the original spot
-good ignition
-motor has started about 6 times so far over a 1 year period...

(as of right now, we have to pinch the fuel line to (not very often at all) to get it to crank, once and IF it does start, we unpinch the line quickly to keep the motor running)

even though i am running a n/a ecu and realy rich...why doesnt it start??? any ideas???

all i know is, its started more than once...but when i tryed to give it throttle it apperently kept trying to flood itself out...

i dont understand why it wants to start sometimes, but almost everytime it dosnt...

i sit there and try to turn it over for almost 30 secs straight and all it does is want to start but it never does...

and then sometimes i get very lucky and it cranks on me...after awhile of trying to start it...

DC13B

do you use the de-flooding procedure when trying to crank?

HKSpoweredFC3S

yeah sometimes, but none of that works =/

i honestly just think im running so rich its just not sparking enough to fire the motor off, and sometimes im just getting lucky...but the only thing about that is, were closing the fuel line off to get it to start sometimes...so that dosnt make much sense to me why it still dosnt want to start... hmmm =/

as soon as i start making some money again, im just going to get a standalone...hopefully i can work all the kinks out with it.

lets see, a s5 turbo ii is suppose to run 32 lbs of fuel right?? stock.

HKSpoweredFC3S

but also what i ment from it flooding, its not flooding its just that when i try to apply throttle its just getting over flowed with fuel and its sputtering out on me.

HKSpoweredFC3S

oh yeah, when it does crank, let me try and explain it the best i can.

when i do get it cranked, it slowly starts up, like i have to keep holding the key on untill its fully running...

(okay, you know how lets say your driving a standard and you ALMOST stall it out in first gear??? well once you almost stall it out, you know how the is still running but it runs realy rough like it wants to die? but it just dosnt???

well thats how the car runs when i start it up...it runs realy rough like it almost stalled out.

RX7Tuner.

This thread will be easier to understand if you replace the word, "crank" with "start". Cranking means the engine is turning over by the starter motor in an attempt to start. If your engine doesn't crank, then nothing is moving.

Brian

HKSpoweredFC3S

...car wont start...but it has before...help me out.

RX7xFD3S

Any description on what type of sound its making?


I'm still confused on if its not cranking or starting. .___.

RX-Spec7

what size injectors are u using? 550? cuz im sure the n/a only uses 460s you might be maxing out the duty on them and they also might be the wrong resistance,also the n/a maf is going to mess you up as well. you really need the n370 stuff if you want it to work.

HKSpoweredFC3S

omg lol... okay listen haha..

*its a jdm s5 turbo ii motor...comes factory with high ind. 550s...

....useing a n350 maf and ecu...which will work for now.

okay...let me try to explain this better...

*the motor turns over fine and acts like it wants to fire off*

BUT....its running 40lbs a fuel and it should be 32...
which i know thats realy rich over stock...BUT

what i dont understand is, even if we pinch the fuel line off...it still dosent fire off...

BUT...it has before...I have had the car running maybe 5 times...

I am getting a standalone in due time...but that aside...

I mean, everything is hooked up right i know because ive had it running more than once...

*timing is right, accualy slightly advanced...ignition is right...everything is grounded okay...*

honestly...im pretty sure all i need is a standalone so i can work all the kinks out...like the fuel pressure and airflow...

I just want to know if anyone here knows anything i can do though? =]

because ive explained what we do and what goes on when i try to fire the car off...about the whole fuel line thing...

MaczPayne

iTrader: (5)

Have you checked for vacuum leaks?

Are the spark plugs fouled?

When my car was untuned, my spark plugs would foul out every 2-3 weeks, in which case my car would be hard if not impossible to start in the morning.

My vacuum connector for my boost gauge used to dry up and leak, causing my plugs to foul from the extra fuel, which then caused the same problem as above.

HKSpoweredFC3S

accually haha, my plugs foul alot.. =/

pretty sure my vacuum is fine...but ill still check it.

yeah, mine just about foul everytime i try and fire it off...

joeylyrech

iTrader: (11)

WHAT ABOUT COMPRESSION?you are saying that motor start up if you pinch the line right?when you pinch the line the fuel flow is a lot less so of course yo get a little fuel and the car starts but if you dont do it it wont start,well that sound like a compression problem,a motor with low compression needs a lot less fuel to start than a good motor,get a fuel cut of switch and i bet you that the car will start right of,now if your compression is good lower your fuel pressure get the dam right ecu,flow meter and map and give it a try buddy

HAILERS

It sounds a lot like a" one good rotor ". As in the other one isn't making compression.

I'd just pull both LEAD plugs out and have someone spin the engine with the starter. While feeling the pulses out one rotor and comparing that to the other rotor.

Last time I looked in a FSM, the fuel rail pressure during START is somewhere b/t 37-39 psi. Forty is close enough to not matter.

28-32 psi is at IDLE, not during Start.

But you might have meant you checked the pressure the day it did run/idle.

The ECU messes with timing until the water temp is hot. So you make sure the water temp is up prior to using a timing light.

I've no idea what is wrong.

HKSpoweredFC3S

i suppose i can clear some stuff up haha..

the motor has great compression. its def. not a compression issue. it sounds extreamly strong on each rotor.

mmk.. here is goes haha..

for my definitions

*starting* means = cranking the car untill it fires off and idles.
*cranking* means = trying to start the car.

Okay, as of right now, yes i still have a n/a ecu...and maf. but thats okay for just starting the car, it works. (i have a turbo map)

okay those few things said.

lets talk alittle about my fuel pressure =]

the reason i said 32lbs is because i heard from someone that the factory turbo pressure is 32.

well, you cleared that up for me when you said that its suppose to run 37-39 on the start up. (well mine run 40) so like you said, thats fine.

anyway. ive tryed cranking the car many of time. and only a few times it started. maybe 5 or 6 times.

my plugs are constantly getting fouled everytime i try and crank the car. usaly, once we take my plugs out, we clean them up and try to start the car again.

and once we do that, the car wants to start much easier and almost does, and a few times it does.

but anyway.

okay. let me try and explain what we do and what happens..

lets just say, okay, we take all my plugs out, clean them up, put them back in, check for any leaks and make sure everything is ready for an attemp to start it.

okay, while im trying to start the car, my bro pinchs off the fuel line and slowly starts to unpinch it to let more fuel to come in...we keep repeating this step untill the car revives the right amount of fuel to start the car...

once the car starts (if it does) we unpinch the fuel line to keep the car running.

like the first 2 or 3 times the car has ever started, it ran untill the i turned the key off...

BUT, when it was running, I couldnt give it but maybe 1/4th throttle otherwise it would want to die. It acted like it was being well over ran with fuel and wanted to drown itself out.

i could maybe get the revs to around 4k just enough to spool my turbo some and hear my bov.

now then, the other 2-3 times ive started the car after those few...

the car would idle decently but this time i couldnt give it any throttle what so ever or it would act up and do the same thing, act like it wanted to drown itself out..

now its at the point to where it wont even start...by the way, after all of this, i was smoking my ground wire after awhile...

oh yeah, when it did run okay when i was able to rev it to 4k...i was running it open dp...

now i have a test pipe and catback on it...i wonder if thats messing with it any???

but with all that aside, im simply seeing if anyone has any idea of whats going on before i save up and get a standalone??

prjct87rx7

iTrader: (7)

try installing a fuel cutoff switch it will take you 10 minutes??

joeylyrech

iTrader: (11)

That Is What I Said At The End Of My Post To Much Fuel

HAILERS

A difficult to start engine when the engine is cold Might be a symptom of a disconnected water thermo sensor on the back of the water pump houisng. Green, two prong sensor.

During START, the ECU does not use the AFM. It uses an internal fuel map the depends on the water thermo sensor output, the rpms under 500 and a signal from the Start circuit to the ECU.

If the water thermo sensor is disconnected the ECU defaults to a temp of approx 180* which in turn means the ECU will program not enough fuel during start, but once the engine is heated up to operating temps, the engine will start ok (water temp matches the default temp of 180*).

Some of what you write argues against that being the problem, some does. Once the engine started that water thermo sensor wouldn't be the problem. Don't go out and buy a new one. Just see if it's plug is on and remove the plug to see if the two terminals inside that plug are even with each other (one not pushed back).

Yeah, once started and a vacuum is being pulled on the FPR, the fuel pressure should drop to about 32psi. Book says approx 28psi at idle. Real life is closer to 32psi at idle.

ON a series four I once had a TPS problem. Has NOTHING to do with Starting, but once running, I stepped on the pedal with no results. No increase in engine speed. It turned out to be a stuck TPS plunger (internal to the TPS). Pulled the TPS plug off to get home. Soooooooooooooo, maybe pull the TPS plug off and see what happens? Will not effect the Starting, like I said, but maybe will effect things once started???

On those rare days when the engine started and idled, just how high was the idle speed? I mean after it had been idling for say twenty minutes or more?

HKSpoweredFC3S

I have a hks fcd, so thats been out of the way.

the idle speed was always good, it ran the 3k accelarated stage then droped to 1.5 and finnaly droped to its idles speed of around 900-1k

well honestly, im suprised it ran at all because i think im missing a sensor on my radiator...it looks like a very small ***. with 2 ***** on it...

and theres no place to put one even if i did have it...

HAILERS

The sensor on the radiator, I'm confused on. On a Series four there is a water temp Switch on the bottom left on the radiator that is Emissions related. I wasn't aware your series five had one of those (they don't).

Then again, I don't have a series five to look at. Maybe they do have a two prong sensor on the radiator.

Frankly I've forgotten why I asked about the idle speed. It was early in the 'morn when I wrote that.

joeylyrech

iTrader: (11)

is that the sensor that turns the AC FAN on?

HAILERS

Where exactly is this switch located on your series five radiator?

Riddick_941991

ok i know this is off topic but do you have a mass air flow meter?
its the metal box thats connected to the cold air box on a 13b.
because i had this same problem on my toyota pick up, my problem was i drove it threw a flood and it sucked up water which damaged the meter so i removed the meter and took it apart and cleaned the circuit bored inside with this cleaner i bought from radio shack.

HKSpoweredFC3S

i have the answer =D i got my car running finnaly!!

it was my TPS sensor haha =D it wasnt pluged in all the way because the connector on it is broke haha...i was reading in the troubleshooting in my manual and it was talking about the throttle position sensor, so i lifted up my intercooler and tryed putting in in real tight and now i can rev it to 7.5k =] it cranks everytime with no problem now.

BUUUTTTT, well im pretty sure i just need a turbo ecu because!!!

i have 3 other people that agreed with me, okay, the cold start stage on the ecu, last 10 secs correct???

well, as soon as i crank the car, you can count down when i do it but, i can rev the car as much and as freely as i want, but after 10 secs pass, it drops straight to idle even if i have it to the floor.

and once it drops to idle, i can rev it past 2k...but im sure a standalone will clear all of that up. =] what do yal think haha?

HKSpoweredFC3S

i ment i CANT rev it past 2k.