Batguano

I am replacing the oil bypass pellet. As part of the proceedure, I have to have someone hold the clutch in and also I have to prvent the engine fron turnig over while I put 80 ft/lbs on the shaft bolt to take the old one out.
HOW DO I LOCK THE ENGINE IN PLACE?

Any help is appreciated.

Wanked_FC

iTrader: (1)

Best way is to heat it up w/ a torch. Its got some hardcore thread locker on it from the factory. I've seen a few people just put it in 5th and ram up on the e-brake to lock the engine in place. But if you heat it, it'll come out easily. Some people have had to heat it for like 15 minutes. Its going to take some work.

PaulyDee

Another way of doing it is a bit renegade but it works.

Get a breaker with a long pipe over it. Then get some stuff (rags, pillows, whatever) and cover the drivers side fender. Lay the pipe on the covered fender and then TAP the key to turn the engine over for a brief second. It should break the bolt loose. Then you can have you buddy stay on the clutch as you pull the thermal pellet out and install the plug.

garnersplc_2001

Just changed mine out and used the breaker bar trick. Worked great! I couldn't get 85 pounds of torque when I put it back in so I just drove it over to a local shop minus the fan and shroud and had them torque it back on with an air wrench....free.

w_hari

Why do you have to stay on the clutch to change the pellet???

Harry

Wanked_FC

iTrader: (1)

Supposedly it keeps the engine internals in place. I guess if you don't the torrington bearings can fall in and get crushed. I'm pulling that form memory, but its on Ted's site, FC3Spro.

garnersplc_2001

Yes, your right, the Torrington bearing is a thrust bearing, it distributes the force on the crank when you depress the clutch pedal. It will fall out of place fairly easily when the main pulley bolt is removed, especially if you happen to bump the pulley.
Triumphs will actually slow RPMs when the clutch pedal is depressed when their thrust bearings are worn. This puts lots of stress on the rods since the whole crank is moving and will cause the block to be vented by broken rod(s).

RylAssassin

It seems like leaving the engine in gear while doing this would be easier. So is that an effective way of getting that drive bolt off?
So then after the bolt is loose can you depress the pedal so that the tourington bearing doesent fall out?

ProjectRESuperG

I just jammed a crow bar from underneath. There's a cover on the bottom of the tranny, it's bolted down with two bolts. Un bolt that, and you will see the flywheel. I turned the engine to a place where I can jam a crow bar to hold it in place. Then proceeded to unbolt the main bolt on the crank. Took a lot of muscle, that thing is on there tight!

Anyways, you can try that. Oh, I also jammed a piece of piping from the seat to the clutch pedal, that held the clutch down while I was changing it.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Good info here:

http://www.mazdatrix.com/faq/pulley.htm

Batguano

Hey all you Guys, I appreciate the info. Aaron, that is a good link. Thanks.

pontious

Back from the dead, but I was just reading this post....

Anyway, I don't see HOW removing that oil pellet bypass bolt could cause the torrington bearing to come out. I look at the FSM and the diagrams and I just do not see how they could effect each other. I must be missing something.

Looking at the mazdatrix site they show the damage caused by letting the bearing drop, what would be the symptoms of this problem? It looks pretty bad from the pics but what does it do to the operation of the engine?

Thanks...

scathcart

The endplay of the crank shaft is heled together via a sandwhich of two of those torrington bearings between a thrust plate. When you hold a sandwhich vertical, and take pressure off the outsides, you lose your lunchmeat....
Only in this situation, the torringtion bearing, when given those couple mm of slack bewteen the sandwhich, just falls off the edge of the spacer and gets wedged against the thrustplate when it is torqued back together.

The symptoms are a higher-frictional loss of power from the engine (harder to turn engine by hand), larger metal content in the oil than normal, and zero endplay) on the engine (which is bad... very bad).

scathcart

Actually, it doesn't really "distribute" any force... automatic cars have no clutch to depress, and yet they still wouldn't run worth a damn without the torrington bearings...

Their main purpose is to limit crankshaft endplay. Endplay is the "humping" of the eccentric shaft back and forth, of which is required for engine lengevity. Endplay settings are between .0020-.0035", and are altered by changing the width of the spacer that goes between the two torrignton bearings and the thrust plate.

scathcart

VERY VERY bad idea. The oiling system flows oil through the eccentric shaft... driving the car with a bolt not torqued correctly could easily have caused the car to dump all of its oil onto the road and caused catastrohpic engine failure...

Not to mention the fact that the front bolt should be torqued exactly to factory specs in order to keep engine endplay within specifications, and most shops do not have the ridiculously-expensive digital air torque wrenches that would be required to set this torque setting accurately (no "local" shop would have this, I have only seen them used by VERY high-end shops). By simply using an impact gun, you would likely over-torque the front pulley and throw out any valid endplay settings, not to mention put higher stress on the front bolt and stretch it beyond normal limits....

AND the front pulley bolt should be fixed in place using Red (permanent) Loctitie thread locker, which sets in five minutes and cures in 24 hours. If you drove it to the shop with the thread locker already on, they would have destroyed in when they torqued the bolt for you. If you didn't put any on, then the risk of the front pulley bolt backing out is quite severe (I've seen it happen). If they took the bolt out again to put on the required loctite, then the torrignton bearing issue would still be at risk... and without giving the loctitie its curing time before bringing the engine up to temperature, any loctite is useless.

I would remedy all of this if I were you.

BTW... 85 ft lbs is only 42.5 lbs at the end of a breaker bar parallel to the ground... or 170 lbs at the end of a 6 inch ratchet at the parallel. How can you not reach 85 ft-lbs?

Sir Rupert Hobo

damnit....

locketine

remember putting it on is a whole lot easier than taking it off, just the fact that the engine doesn't try to turn with the bolt is enough in itself.

pontious

I see it now in the diagram. before I never noticed that that boult was holding all those pieces together. Now I am a little worried. When I took my oil bypass pellet first of all the boult was not in there very tight, I didn't have any of the problems everyone else seems to have getting it out. Second, I didn't not have the clutch pedal pressed in while removing it. Add my washers to the bypass pellet and put it back in and torqued it down. I have been driving the car for a few thousand miles now. That is why I was wondering what problems I would the bearing had dropped. I don't seem to have any noticable problems with the car at all. The only difference is that my oil pressure is higher now due to the pellet mod...


I am wonding if I just got luckey or what, or mayeb there is damage in there and it is more subtle than I would think it is...

pontious

This end play is the amount of play if I was to try and push and pull the pulley correct?

YearsOfDecay

Don't know about venting the block.........(thank god) but my TR-250 definately slowed when you pushed the clutch at idle..... never thought it was due to worn bearings... I thought it was something to do with that shitty british electrical system shorting out!!!!

pontious

So I just went out to try and move the main pulley in and out, I was not able to move it. I am not sure how much force is required anyway while the engine is installed. I assuem you guys have doen this with the engien installed and you can push and pull the front pulley?

I am a little worried now that something is messed up. Though I don't seem to have any problems with the engine at all. Maybe I shouldn't worry so much... hmm

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

You need to put a dial indicator on the front hub and pry it moderately with a bar to measure endplay. Should be from .0016 to .0035 if memory serves....

This endplay is VERY important. I have seen the results of an engine where this was not correct. Siezed solid, spun every bearing in the engine....

pontious

Ohh, I see, it is not something I do just pull by hand.

Since I have driven the car a couple thousand miles and it is still running, is that any indication that maybe I got REAL lucky? or is it possible that the damage is there, but maybe not as significant as you just described? I guess what I am gettign at is this: If I am not having problems that I can see, should I be very worried, or should i be out buying the parts to fix the problem no matter what, because there is little chance things are ok.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Change the oil...Lots of metal? If not, then you're probably OK.

But you should measure your endplay just to be sure.

pontious

I have done an oil change since (and I doind one this weekend) I didn't notice any last time, I will check extra close this time to make sure.

Thanks for your help.