speedholes

I've done a few minor repairs to my FC since I got it, but this time I'm stuck. I've been trying to remove the logicon to resolder it (because the air won't blow on the windshield). Specifically, I'm having trouble getting to that infamous plug inside the dash somewhere.

First I tried getting to it from above. The center cap came off fine, but I couldn't manage to get the center bolt off. There wasn't enough clearance between it and the windshield for my ratchet. Even using locking pliers on the socket by itself didn't work. (I kept at it for a while, even though the angle was killing my neck.)

Next I tried looking under the dash, above the accelerator, but I couldn't see anything moving when I moved the long black wire bundle on the logicon, or anything else that suggested itself.

Then I tried to take off the gauge cluster, but I couldn't finagle it all the way off after removing all five screws, or even after also removing the other two screws (for the switches) on the bottom of the cluster.

I really don't want to have to resolder the thing sitting inside the car. It's pretty hot and mosquito-ridden around here right now. And I don't have the experience to desolder the board from its connector; in fact, the clock/idiot light cluster fix (which went flawlessly) was the first time I've ever held a soldering iron. *blush*

I have the Haynes manual (which I have quickly grown to hate) and the FSM.

Any help you guys could give me would be greatly appreciated. I love this car, but I'm going to have to sell it if I can't get the air to blow on the windshield for winter. :-(

By the way, it's an '87 N/A.

WAYNE88N/A

You need Icemark- he's the logicon guru, I think

Zer0 Cylinder

the little piece of trim along the top of the dash has a bolt in it and 5 snap locks.....a 1/4" open end wrench will get the bolt out........evenetually (have fun =] )

then just pop it out.......and you should be able to feel the connector.

nyc_scorpio

iTrader: (1)

i find it easy when the top left vent is off, then go under the steering wheel with a light and you will see it, push it up so then you can get hold of it from the vent side, just unplug and redo again.

DEZERTE

it snakes up to behidn the idiot light, i removed mine when i pulled my dash out about 6" pulling dash = gay

speedholes

Okay, I tried the bolt again, and I finally got it off. I started trying to get the left half of the trim piece off, and promptly broke off a couple inch-long chunks of it. I'm going to try it again tomorrow in the daylight, pulling up on as many slots of it as I can grab, rather than prying it off from one end like I was doing (duh). I should have the results posted by tomorrow afternoon.

FWIW, three of my fingers were smashed when I was in a rollover in my friend's Grand Am not too long ago, and I'm still in bandages. Getting that bolt off was hard. :P

I'd still like to know why I couldn't get the gauge cluster off. Would I have to take the steering column off first? It sure didn't seem like that in the FSM, but maybe I was reading it wrong. Any ideas?

AcidShock

iTrader: (49)

It takes some weird moving and shaking to get the gauge cluster surround off with the wheel still in place. I cannot describe how I do it, I just keep moving it around until it will pull free. Definately if you want to go the easy route, take the steering wheel off.

speedholes

Oops. I left the page up and then posted without checking new replies.

scorpio: I was planning to look from outside the windshield straight down, but your idea sounds better.

dezerte: What part of the dash are you talking about pulling out? Just the idiot lights? Something under them?

DEZERTE

i pulled the WHOLE dash, u cant just take off a piece of it, i would not recommend pulling the dash if you dont have to. thats just how i got mine off.

RETed

Easiest way is to just disconnect the still connected wire bundle from the logicon itself.


-Ted

stockrex

but isn't the wire bunble soldered to the logicon board? or does it just plug into it?

zer0_to_6ixty

When I was getting my reverse indiglo gauges put on i ran across the same problem. I wanted to get at the Gauge pod easily and i wasn't looking forward to trying to get the steering wheel on and off. if you take out the five screws on the plastic dash cover you still can't take it off (at least i don't think so) and thats where i thought i would need to take off the steering wheel. but theres a plastic 2 piece panel on the steering column that you need to take off. below where the keyhole is, there are 3-4 bolts holding it on. it should snap apart into 2 pieces, and then there is enough room to take off the larger plastic dash piece.
Hope this helps

-Cyrus

nyc_scorpio

iTrader: (1)

wire bundle seems to be soldered, i dont reccomend you to pull it from there, might break it and be in a worse position. like i said, pull that top vent off. and from under the steering colum you will have a clear view if in the daylight. snake your hand up there and push it up threw the vents you just removed, get back up and pull it free the only pain in the *** is getting under the steering colum. good luck, sorry about the fingers, its going to be a bitch.


BTW you dont have to remove the steering wheel to get the guage cluster out, remove the panels that cover the steering wheel, pull the metel circle that goes over the key ignition switch. it is held by 2 screws and pop in clips, once you remove this covers. then lower the steering cloum as low as possible. remove the gauge bezel. you need to angle it so it will come off, remember, to dis. all the wires con. to lights, wipers, cruise control ect. after you got that out. the gauge cluster is held by 4 screws, once they come off you need to angle the cluster to the right, put your hand behind it to remove the cable that reads rpm. in the middle of all the little wires you will feel a little tab, push tab in and pull wire harness at the same time, this should let you pull it off, repeat for the second one, the last one , mph one has like a clip. you need to get the clip off b4 pulling free. i dont mean yank it off, it should slid bak into the cable and you should be scott free. i rec after you get is all out, pull hard on the mph cable to get some extra slack when you re-install

zer0_to_6ixty

nyc_scorpio said it better

speedholes

I decided to go back under the dash (earlier today before these last couple posts about the gauge cluster). This time I took off the vent cover, the vent tube attached to it, and the bigger vent tube attached to that (held in by one screw). I wiggled the logicon cable and finally saw the other end... all the way at the top of the dash, between the white casing (for the stuff in the center console) and a accordion-looking vent tube about 4" in diameter. I managed to disconnect the accordion-type joint in the tube, but I couldn't get either half of it to move out of the way. I gently tried to get the connector off using needle-nose pliers, but it was obvious that there was a tab on the top that I couldn't squeeze.

I guess I'll try and push the connector out the top with a coat hanger or something (tried fingers, just can't get close enough). If that doesn't work, then I'll go ahead and remove the gauge cluster.

Thanks for all the help. I'll post the results tomorrow evening.

RETed

No, the wire harness is plugged in.
Remove the small sub-box in the rear.
This should expose all 4 screws in the rear backing the front face plate.
Remove these 4 screws.
This should allow the front plate to come off.
The front cover controls are connects be several(?) wire bundles which can easily be unplugged.
In the middle of the rear section is the wire harness which is still connected.
There is a wiring plug (flat with like about 15 wires in it) that can be easily unplugged and snaked out the back.
You can leave this portion of the wiring harness in the car and take the separated logicon with you now.


-Ted

speedholes

Ted, I read your post as well as your page at http://fc3spro.com/TECH/PROBLEMS/EL/ACH/aclog.htm about removing the logicon, and I'm still not sure what you mean. I just went out and looked again to make sure, and the bundle of wires is most definitely soldered onto the circuit board. In fact, the circuit board has been dangling by only this wire bundle for days. None of the other parts (air mix motor, faceplate, white plastic box, or the other two wiring harnesses) are connected. Is it possible you're looking at an 89-91, or a logicon modified for easier maintenance?

If by "easily removed" you mean "easily desoldered," then I may as well leave it connected and just do all the soldering in the car, you know?

Anyway, I'm done trying to get at it from above or below. Time permitting, I'll be attempting the gauge cluster removal tomorrow.

RETed

Hmmm...there might be different versions of logicons available?
I was sure that last wire bundle could be easily detached from the logicon itself, but I'll check the extra ones I have laying around just to make sure.

Good luck!


-Ted

Icemark

I am wondering the same thing Ted... could you have confused the FC logicon with something else??? I have never ever seen one that you could unplug that harness from the circuit board.

They are all soldered in.

speedholes

Okay, I've removed the steering wheel surround pieces and the gauge cluster surround. I'm trying to pull the gauge cluster out, but it won't come all the way out. It feels like it's being stubborn because of whatever's connected to it.

I looked underneath it with a flashlight, saw a long black cable leading from the right side of the gauge cluster to the firewall, and I managed to shove my fingers in there and disconnect it from the cluster. But it still won't come out. I can't find (or see to find) anything it could still be attached to, but it feels like it's still attached to something on the left side. What do I do now?

Icemark

two plugs, and a cable go to the back of a manual tranny gauge cluster. If you can't unplug the two plugs, then reach straight back behind it, and clipped onto the ac duct will be a large 20+ pin plug. You will need to unplug that and the speedo cable, the gauges will then come out.

speedholes

The meter cluster is out -- and I found and disconnected the logicon plug! The logicon is now finally in my house. :-D

Doesn't seem like it will be too hard to feed the cable back in through the dash, and I hope it won't be too hard to reconnect the two big circular plugs and the speedo cable when I'm putting it all back in. If I do have any further problems, I'll post them in this thread.

You guys are amazing! Thanks!

Roen

iTrader: (2)

You don't really need to take out the gauge cluster at all, you can reach the clip from the bottom where all the pedals are. We successfully removed two logicons that way today.

RETed

You really don't need to resurrect a thread that's over 2 years old...


-Ted

Roen

iTrader: (2)

I realize it's 2 years old, but there didn't seem to be an opinion one way or another on how to remove the third harness, plus I felt that it would be nice if there was at least a mention of not having to take out your gauge cluster in order to get to the clip in at least one thread. Last time I searched, I didn't find anything one way or another on how to remove the third harness.