Apathy

Ok, sorry for starting a thread and never responding to any of your questions. I was a little busy yesterday. I am in college,pre-pharmacy, and finals are coming up. Now, I am not as dumb as you guys are trying to make me seem. When I start of in 1st gear I always use the clutch. However, when I had my Civic a couple of years ago, EX coupe w/ a JDM B20&tranny, I could power shift, shifting from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd without using the clutch, this seemed to be the fastest method of shifting in this car, rpms barely dropped and increased acceleration. I learned this from a guy named Ravi that races RSX's and other front-wheel drive cars at moroso speed park. Now I have two rx7s and I was wondering if there were any different shifting methods to use besides the norm. Obviously I am not an idiot and you can all call me a ricer if you want because I am sure that my old civic can leave many of your 7s in the dust, it was built up. I am not the type of person to go out and buy a civic and put a bodykit and exhaust on it and try and race people. Mines was a sleeper, didnt have a bodykit or fancy paint job, and I sold it for 8k so I could go to college.

Apathy

Also, to all the people saying that I probably watched too much F&F or 2F2F, you can go and suck something because I hate that friggin movie. It is a rip off from one of my favorite movies, the legend of speed. Thats the original racing movie with evolutions, imprezas, supras, and skys. also, I havent even played NFSU because I dont have anyn time. skewl is pretty demanding. between working on my car, my fiance, skewl, and wrestling, I dont have time for video games. you guys dont have to be so cynical--grow up.

BlaCkPlaGUE

no no no, your sposed to say "suck something hard", thats the key

Im not here to bash you, actually, I want to know how in the hell you shifted without using the clutch, how is this possible without grinding the gears?

MakoRacing[FC]

Why are you so defensive? Seek help, you need it.

bigtymer

its very possible. u get the car up to the right rpms and then it just goes into gear nicely. I was fiddling around last nite with my car and i shifted into 3rd and 4th without clutch i was pretty impressed with myself . Especially since I've only been driving standard for about a month. Get the rpms up pretty high and try it.

matt

Apathy

Because when I posted the other day, I barely got any straight answers... people saw civic, just assumed ricer, and went on bashing . Not everyone that likes imorts is a ricer. damn, rx7s are from mazda--japan so think about it. On another note, it is very possible to shift w/o grinding gears. like I said, a local racer in west palm beach, fl showed me how to power shift w/ no clutch in my old civic. you had to shift at a certain rpm and you had to slam it in very very fast. if you didnt do one of the other, you would grind. That is why I posted the other day. I wanted to know the right rpms to shift in a 7. for instance, at what rpm does a 7 have its peak torque, this would be a good thing to know for taking off at the line. and at what rpm does a 7 have its peak hp, this would be a good thing to know for shifting while racing after take off to get maximum acceleration. These are the responces that I was expecting to see the other day. instead I just got a hole bunch of bashing and criticism. if you cant give a solid answer and all you're gonna do is criticize people that actually do wanna learn then dont respond. I get tired of people bashing others.

XuperXero

it's highly possible, my transportation teacher used to be a full time racer at a Motorsport park nearby, and he told me that it's a quick way to shift as well as saving the life of the clutch. it's all about practise and timing, a good way to practise is double clutching where before you shift to the next gear, you shift to Neutral and then left off clutch and gas, and rev the engine a bit, then shift to the next. all shifting here to use clutch. that's how you can find the perfect spot. you do it until you can find the perfect rev for the next gear and shift without jerking. once you've mastered that, you just simply rev up until that perfect rev match and shift to next gear without clutch. it's a pretty advanced technique. my teacher does it on his manual civic everyday. i've been trying to convince him to teach me how to do it in his civic =P. (no he's not a ricer, he bought the civic for fuel economy due to the uprising of gas prices.)

slow87turbo

ive been able to do this a fue times in my car...but when youget it wrong its a terible feeling...try finding some one with about the same setup as you who has a dyno sheet to look and see about where peek tq and hp are. or you could do what i usually do at the track, when you shift you pull the car out of gear,hit the cluch with the tranny in between gears and only cluch to get into the next gear, only prob is you have to get load off the tranny for a sec to pull out of gear, but its a damn fast way to shift. ive had people at the drag strip ask if i had a auto,and they were suprized to see it was a manual. but to answer you question, yes it its posible, not allways pretty, but posible.

EJ

vicious525E

ya, iv mannaged it in my 88 crx, its hard as hell to get the rpms right, but its possable in any manual. the whole concept is that when the rpms are at a certain point with the car going a certain speed the trans and engine are spinning at the same rate. so when the gears come to gather there going the same speed so they wont grind. in my crx its like a 500 rpm drop between first and second, and then a 700 rpm drop between second and third. its all about timming really. unless your just ramming it into gear, which then, i would call you a ricer and say that you need to stop abusing your car.

you must learn to love the seven, she is an amazing thing.

and about the whole civic thing, no worries, i drive a crx and i'll be damned if theres anyone faster then me on the country roads around here.

TheSickness

i always like a hard clutch that i could just kick and yank the shifter. pretty much the same idea just a little easir on the tranny.

ScrappyDoo

iTrader: (7)

I've done this a few times when I couldn't afford a new clutch. I also did it when I was a tranny tech and a car with a burntout clutch needed to get into the shop. I did for about 3 months at one time to and from work. The problem is getting going, if you start the car in neutral there is no way of getting in to 1st. So at every stop light etc. I'd shut it off and start in first after making sure the car ahead had moved off enough.

Matching rpm's just take a little practice, if your applying gentle pressure to the lever while moving you will find a spot where it just falls into the respective gear. I can't recall the shift RPMs since it was many moons ago but the guy is definately not wrong.

He is wrong for calling it power shifting, which as I understand is the practice of ramming it into the gear at high RPM while stomping on the clutch for a split second or not at all.

fc313bt88

try pushing clutch in to get to next gear far less time and quicker thats how i shift when i race, double clutch is good but for me this was quicker

capn

double clutching is for tractors and mac trucks i dont see any advantages of it unless you have no syncros. because tractors and big big trucks dont have them so you have to double clutch.

but yes i think everyone in here has had one honda or "ricer" car. i think i make up for it now that i have a Cadillac instead and have a 7 too .

and as far as the clutchless operation, i wouldnt do it because i am too paranoid about somethings breaking. but yes it can be done just at the right RPM

rs_1101

anyone in here ever heard of dog gears? do they even make them for fc's?

btw.. a civic with a b20 is not ricey. i have a picture of the esprit ek hatch with the b20z, and a video of it wailing on an s2k. its not ricey.

vicious525E

hks dogmishion i do beleave
and i think thats the same thing as a sequential transhmishion
feel free to correct me if im wrong

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

it has to do with drive gear wieght, synchros and synchro and gear taper, all of which these transmission are not easily slammed into gear. most motorcycles can shift without a clutch but that doesn't mean they all were meant to be shifted without the clutch. dirt bikes and street bikes for example are designed to be able to shift without a clutch but a harley would not be designed for it but may be able to do it.

your honda may have been able to do it but not these without alot of modifications, all of which wouldn't be worth the effort.

the quickest method you are going to find in shifting is finding your own niche with your foot and your hand on the shifter..

rs_1101

k. dog gears are actually clutchless. idk if they use them in sequentials. maybe they do? it makes sense. the actual thread on the syncros itself is like straight. you can shift w/o clutch. must have for the track feind in your life!

anyhow on topic. rev matching is hard, and a great way to blow a transmission. doing it daily, i think you could however. once youve rev matched, apply a little bit of pressure on the shifter, and the synchros will almost suck it into gear. its kinda strange. ive gotten pretty good at the 1-2 shift. ive found that a precise timing of the clutch and gas allows the synchros to match perfectly for a shift that sounds like it came from a GT class racer. now if only my 2-3 shift were better. its hard to do so quickly, b/c you can easily misshift.. and my 3rd gear synchros are like.. not there anymore. i do actually double clutch into 3rd. theres really no point. im pretty quick, but its still slower than a straight shift. prolly look like an idiot.. champ the 2nd gear shift, but doubleclutch the 3rd gear shift like i missed it..

Cybaster

skewl...... =D

just kidding....

anyways i've heard of shifting without the clutch, but is it really that much more "effective"?

wouldn't using a better clutch, and rev match shifting be as "effective"?

BlaCkPlaGUE

Well if you knew the rpm sweetspots like some of the people here off by heart, then you'd save yourself some 1/4 mile time shifting directly into gear, none of this let off gas, clutch, shift, just shift.