DarkAngelKamui

Hey, i'm in need of some help on what to do next with my FC....

I recently bought a 1987 Mazda RX-7 Turbo II from a couple who claims they drove it everyday till up to a year ago when they left in in their driveway for a full year due to a pregnancy. When they returned to try and start it, nothing would turn on including the electronics. I figured i'd take it off their hands, since it sounded like a simple battery fix or so for a good looking car around 90K going for $600....

When I took it to a shop to get a diagnostic, the first thing they thought it was was the fuel filter. But after forcing fuel into the engine, it started up finally but only for a second or two before shutting down again, so they assumed it was an electrical problem. But after a month or so of tinkering with it they still couldn't find the problem with it. So they supposedly called this national hotline to try and ask their help, and they recently got back to me telling me that the engine was almost gone so i'd need a new one....

Now i'm a bit confused and don't think that the engine could be gone, so i'm looking for help from pros on this before I go and try to save up $3000 or so for a new engine. Any suggestions in this would be greatly appreciated. If it helps any, they say it wasn't caused by a vacuum leak, for the lines checked out as fine.

SevenGirl

Do your own compression test- plenty How-to's using search. -Can't go by the shop seeing as how they don't have a clue

1987RX7guy

iTrader: (3)

OMG its a girl!

Yeah man do your own compression test. Just get a standard tester and a friend to help you. All you do is hold the little valve down so it doesn't retain the pressure and measures the next bounces.

DarkAngelKamui

I forgot to throw in that they said that they had already completed a compression check as well, however they said it was a little low. They assumed it was just due to it sitting in a driveway for so long....

RylAssassin

where did you bring your car? You really should find a good quality rotary shop somewhere around your area. You need to find people that know what there doing. Or you can just spend some time in here and try to figure out what could be wrong with your car. Do a search there so much info in here

DarkAngelKamui

Yeah, i've been running around this site for weeks now but nothing really that hits home with my problem has been found. I'll keep searching though....

skydivr73

is there anyone else here besides me who can't stop thinking about the possibility of FLOODING here? Seems to me that it would be easy enough for someone to check it out....all of what you mentioned here could be from flooding....the lower compression(wet seals), the starting and stalling...someone PLEASE try to unflood this thing before pronouncing it dead! Also give us more info--

what were the compression test numbers? and were the bounces even or what?

what else was done to this car since you got it?

Here--think about this....why would you call a national hotline to figure out what was wrong with it? If you ever call a mechanic to ask them to diagnose something, they will tell you the same thing every time--I CANT ANSWER THAT WITHOUT SEEING THE CAR MYSELF....IT COULD BE SEVERAL THINGS....

FIRST--get that car outta there before they kill it--they obviously dont have a clue about rotaries....
THEN--try to unflood it--do a search in this forum for unflooding and follow the instructions.....is it a stick?? if it is, you could also try push-starting it to get the extra fuel out....

The big thing is the compression test numbers....if the compression is acceptable I would almost bet money on it being flooded. I got mine really cheap for the same reason haha and you might have the same thing.....

be sure and change the plugs too once it fires up...and if you just dont wanna bother, sell me the engine and tranny

DarkAngelKamui

Heh, I really wanted to try that out when I first took a look at it but I never did.... I'm planning to just see what their estimate for the engine is, then just get it out of there and try out some things on it myself before tossing it to someone else who could do something for cheaper..... I'll try and get the exact numbers tomorrow from the shop once I call them back, and as far as I know the only things extra that were done to the car was new radiator, windshield, and something else that I can't remember but i'm sure it was small....

Also, the name of the shop is A Anthony's Mobile Vehicle Service if it rings a bell to anyone.....
http://www.princegeorges.com/auto/anthonys.htm

skydivr73

dude--GET YOUR CAR OUT OF THERE!!

if you have to take your 7 somewhere take it ONLY to someone who works on rotaries....TRUST ME on this....If you don't you wil be asking for trouble, and you will waste a lot of time and money.

As for the compression check, what you are looking for is three even bounces on the guage. The numbers will be low on yours for two reasons....it's possibly flooded, and the comp test is supposed to be done with a warmed up engine. Get a comp tester, and do it yourself. All you do is connect the test hose to one of the spark plug holes, and have someone crank it over with the EGI fuse pulled from under the hood. the tester should have a little button on it--just hold that button in while doing the test. The needle should give you three even sweeps....watch for the number that the needle goes to, but the sweeps are the most important. You only need to check one of the holes in the front and one in the back, not all four. Write down what you get and let us know. Do this before you look at anything else! as long as you are getting the good even sweeps(hitting around the same number on every bounce) then your engine is probably fine.

DarkAngelKamui

Ok, i've gotten word from the shop that the compression was 35 (however, now after talking to my boy about the whole situation I think they're robbing me... lol) So i'm just gonna opt to get my 7 out of the damn shop tomorrow and deal with it from there. lol, any suggestions to what could be wrong are still appreciated though....

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

OK, it could be a lot of things, but since it sat, here are some suggestions:

1. Drain the fuel tank and clean it out. Any fuel that was sitting in there has turned to gunk. Must be removed. Flush the fuel lines and replace the filter. Be ready to replace the filter again as it will soon clog up.

2. Jumper the yellow connector at the passenger shock tower and turn the key to "run". Go to teh back of the car. Hear the fuel pump running? Yes? Good. No? Then you're never going to get fuel into the enigne. Measure for 12V at the pump to make sure you're getting voltage. If it still doesn't run (the pump), replace it.

3. The engine has sat, so it will be low on compression. Remove both lower spark plugs and put about an ounce of OIL into each chamber. Crank over by hand, then repeat. Put the plugs back in.

4. CHANGE ALL FLUIDS. Change spark plugs. Now try to start the car.

5. If it starts, then good. Go VERY easy on the engine for about a week. If not, then report back and let us know what it did.

Ideally, you would do a compression test after #3, but the oil could artificially raise compression, and the lack of oil previous to this step could lower it.

DarkAngelKamui

Ok, i'll give that a shot as soon as I get it back.... but just taking a poll, would my engine be shot or on it's way out if it starts for a few seconds and sounds great before crapping out? So far, i've got the shop saying yeah and Rotary Performace out in VA saying yeah... (I know nothing can be told without looking at the car, but still....)

AE_Racer

iTrader: (1)

just fyi...a new motor wont cost you $3k...you can get yours rebuilt for around $1500 or so, if that is, in fact the problem...

DarkAngelKamui

They were saying $3000 for the whole thing.... screw that... lol

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Starting and dying could be MANY things. I wouldn't assume a bad engine without a compression test (done PROPERLY).

DarkAngelKamui

Likewise, after doing tons of research in the archives....
I'm getting my FC out of there tomorrow, no doubt about that one.... lol, hopefully I can get it going myself without too much trouble and still have time to start on mods.....

(Note: I just realized that I only know that I owe $180 for towing to their place and for the diagnostic.... they have yet to give me a price for labor for all their dicking around, and it's been like a month now.... ~_~)

DarkAngelKamui

Well, got everything back for about $400 including towing.... (what a rip-off from the shop....) I'll start work on trying to get it started tomorrow..... Thanks all for the help, and i'll keep things posted if I have any more questions....

DarkAngelKamui

Well, spent my first day of work on the FC.... First thing done was to change the almost dead battery, then used the unflooding trick a few times and managed to get the engine to turn over but not for too long..... Got the trademark white smoke out of the exaust so I assume it is just flooded, and each time I tried it the RPMs got a little higher. So far it's only at about 2k....
Gonna try taking out the sparks tomorrow and cleaning them off if they're too drenched....

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

You will likely need to replace the plugs.

BLACK ROCKET

The dealer was gonna charge me $2K just to swap my motor I told them to &*( off and die and I swapped it myself.

clyde

Flooded sounds right. I left mine alone for well over 6 months, until last summer. It took me about a week to unflood it. The key was to have plenty of power at the battery. My DieHard 1000 amp battery, after 4 turns of the engine (off FI 30sec, on FI 30 sec) wasn't enough. I would recharge the battery that night, only to get it to turn once or twice the following day. It would make a strange blipping noise, while jumping the rpm, then die. It appeared that only the leading coil was firing, while using my timing light and also a CRT monitor. Did not suspect the fuel pump, since I could hear it prime, then make a swirl sound in the tank.

So, I bought a HD battery charger from SAMs club, the one on wheels. Put it on the battery, then finally got it started. It smoked forever, so I drained the oil, after about 3 minutes. After changing the oil, everything was fine. Trailing coils came alive. Now, I drive it as my commuter car-- 35miles one way.

In the past, I have flooded it, when moving it to work on another car, but not letting it idle enough. Usually, easy to start. As of Wednesday, it turned 244,444 miles.

clyde

Oh, each suscessful attempt, the rpms did get higher and higher. 'Til I saw the usual 3000 rpm start, then bump down to 1500 rpm.

skydivr73

better yet, if your car is a manual, push start it. You can get the engine spinning a lot more this way, which will send the extra gas into your exhaust, and you wont burn up a starter doing it. When mine flooded, I tried all the tricks, but push starting was the only thing that would spin it enough to get the gas out--on the 4th try it fired right up and has been running great ever since.

DarkAngelKamui

Yesterday, I tried removing the spark plugs to turn over the engine and clear out the chambers yesterday with a battery that I got the day before, and only tried twice.... after that, the battery was completely run down... Got a charger to pick it back up, though... (Also, nothing came out of the spark plug holes when I did this...)
The spark plugs weren't soaked much but they looked a bit worn, so I decided to replace them today..... but there's something I want to ask so see if it could be the cause of the problem.... When I took off the spark plug wires for all four and labeled them, I noticed that they were in this order..... One L and T on top, one L and T on the bottom.... but i've read in the Hayes manual and on rx7.com that it really should be T T, L L... (or the two spark plugs with blue bands on top, and the other two on the bottom)...
Could this have been a reason for it not turning over, or could it have caused a serious problem otherwise?

TII7

Thats right. The lower plugs are the Leading and Upper are Trailing. Make sure you have the wires set up correctly and give her another shot. Theres another thread on this that may interest you to take a look at, especially the post made by scathcart a few posts down.
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...restarting+car