Josepi

yea...

To sum up recent events in:

Saturday, had to startup the car, move it let it run for about two minutes then shut it off (1.5-1.7K).

Sunday, it sat.

Monday, I went out to start and it seemed like it was catching on the first rotation, then it seemed like a flooding. It was turning over, but no ignition...

Today, praying for a simple problem like a blown relay to the fuel pump (not stock) I was getting voltage readings at the relay and tried wiring the pump straight to the battery. For pure ***** and giggles, I reach down to the main pulley and give a try at turning it. To what can be described as that feeling where you know your wallet is probably about to cracked open, the pulley turned freely...not requiring much force at all.

Questions:

1. Possible that the quick startup/shutdown (dumbass move I know) caused a flooding situation, mixing gas and oil/carbon and binding the seals in a recessed position?

2. Would pouring ATF into the housings do any good? I could understand a single housing retaining compression giving me a harder time with rotating the front pulley...

3. Likelyhood that the motor was partially blown already (stock block 113K miles) and this is just the final nail in the coffin?

4. Anyone have a free S5 13BT they don't need? Hell, even a S4 block? (Microtech, doesn't really matter which block is used!)

5. Suggestions? Anything? Animal sacrifice letting it bleed on the TMIC?

The motor turns over faster than any motor I've seen getting 11.3-11.6V....I guess that's neato...

Josepi

I may be experiencing a bit of my paranoia...

I repulled the leading plugs, turned it over about 5-8 seconds at a time for about 5 or 6 times...the fuel pump is working fine, unplugged that from the relay and the chugs got progressively stronger...but it's still not starting.

Plugs were cleaned before reconnecting the pump, but they probably have some age on em, anyone think new plugs would do the trick?

brianmcd

Wow, sorry to hear about that, hope you get it sorted out soon.

Bump.

SpeedFreak03

1. Possible that the quick startup/shutdown (dumbass move I know) caused a flooding situation, mixing gas and oil/carbon and binding the seals in a recessed position?

I doubt you fucked up any seals but Its probably flooded.

2. Would pouring ATF into the housings do any good? I could understand a single housing retaining compression giving me a harder time with rotating the front pulley...

I dont really know but I doubt it, I think the car would still start with only one rotor, it would just be really slow.

3. Likelyhood that the motor was partially blown already (stock block 113K miles) and this is just the final nail in the coffin?

This is a possibilty, but you should really do a compression check that will tell you if apex seals or something else is fucked up.

4. Anyone have a free S5 13BT they don't need? Hell, even a S4 block? (Microtech, doesn't really matter which block is used!)

Sorry cant help u there But how do u like that microtech?

5. Suggestions? Anything? Animal sacrifice letting it bleed on the TMIC?

Well other then a nice red accent in the engine bay I doubt that will help very much.... But do a compression check, that will tell you a lot about whether your apex seals are shot.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

I would put some atf/motor oil into the lower chambers, remove the EGI fuse (closest to engine), crank it for a few seconds with foot on the floor, clean/replace plugs, replace EGI fuse, and see if it starts. Sounds like simple flooding to me.

Wait...I see you are microtech equipped. Disable fuel/spark for the first step, then restore it for startup.

IF you are in doubt, check for spark on all 4 wires (use a spare plug and put it into the wire end, lay it on the chassis, and crank the car while observing for spark). Then check for compression...you should get equal pulses front and rear one per rotation. Have a friend crank the engine for you while you hold your fingers near the open plugholes for accurate comparison.

The next thing to check would be a fuel problem, but it is unlikely you have just up and developed a bad fuel injector issue. Do the easy spark and compression tests and let us know the results.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

BTW, a rotary should turn pretty freely by hand...this is not a bad indicator. IT is totally normal to be able to pull the PS belt and rotate the engine without much difficulty.

Oh, and when rotaries flood really well, they spin freely like a starter motor when it goes bad...zzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzz.....the atf/oil will restore compression and start it up.

SpeedFreak03

Whoa I didnt know that!! Thanks for the info kevin!

Josepi

That's what it was doing...Tried reusing the old plugs to no avail, going to pick some up today. Probably going to get some kind of hose to use to inject some oil into the chambers.

Off color question, do you think it's possible for the gas to rinse off any deposits seeing that it's been doused in gas for days now?

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

Not really, no. You can sit carbon'd rotors in a bath of gas, kerosene, just about anything you want, without much of any affect. Now if you heat that bath, and agitate it, then you start to make progress, but still not a whole lot.

calvin

I really think it just has a major flooding problem. Nothing serious.

Pull out both leading plugs, disconnect the fuel pump (with the relay or fues or whatever) so that it is not pumping. Crank the car for about 30 seconds, until nothing but air is comming out the plug holes. Then put about 1oz of ATF in each rotor housing (I have a trick for doing this if you don't know). Then turn the engine over by hand (slowly) and let it spread all around. Then put the plugs back in, hook up the fuel pump and it should start. If it doesn't then try starting it by a tow rope (be careful).. If this doesn't work, verify that the ignition is working.

Oh it is best if you do this with new plugs just to be sure.

Josepi

I've done everything but pouring ATF into the housings with no success.

What I did yesterday:
Pulled leading plugs, disconnected fuel pump relay, swapped battery from car freshly driven, cranked 5-8 seconds at a time about 4 or 5 times, replaced all plugs with new plugs, tried starting 2 or three times, reconnected the fuel relay, gave it a few seconds to prime, tried starting about 4 or 5 more times. It sounded like it almost was going to catch about 3 times in a total of 30 rotations...

It makes a nice chugging sound, but I'm wondering if the microtech is dumping in too much fuel to accomodate for the starting under colder conditions, so today I'm going to clean the new plugs, turn down all of the temp correction fuel to nothing and redo the whole deflooding procedure.

What's a handy method for getting ATF/oil/? into the chambers?

SureShot

An old style pump oil can with a vac line stuck on the tip.
A basting syringe.
A camera lense dust bulb blower.

calvin

I use a long peice of about 1/4" clear vinyl tubing. I use it sort of like a straw and suck the ATF in it (about 12-18" worth is about the quantity you want) and then hold the suction, put the tube in the spark plug hole and blow it out into the housing.

If this does not work, you need to do at least a simple compression check and also verify that the ignition system is working.