7th Heaven

i took off my stock air intake tube today as i was putting in the custom CAI.. anyways i cant figure out what this component is, and if i need it, its just in front of the throttle body (facing the car), haynes called it the double throttle diaphram. when i had the intake elbow off i pushed down on it and it basically closes the top two most foward plates, while the rear three deeper in stay closed all the time except of course when ur on the gas. there was a line connecting to the nipple of it on the bottom, the line passes under the intake elbow (really hard plastic piece that bolts to the TB), and under the intake elbow it connects to some green filter looking thing. it joins there at the green cylinder thing. it broke on me, inside it was a mini paper filter, where it joins. from there it keep going towards the firewall and connects to one of the two white little plastic nipples in between the TB and firewall.... when i take off the line at the white nipple, it just whistles, and when i put my finger on it it suctions. well since it broke, i can reglue as thats how it was, but id like to know what it does and if i need it, i saw some others' engine bay pics on here and theirs were removed...

pic of the thing im talking bout, right next (in front of) the TB. has a hose that connects to the nipple on the bottom side of it....


...and that little black hose passes under the intake elbow, connects to a mini green filter, and continues under the intake elbow, and finally goes up and hooks on to this white nipple along the firewall behind the TB....


and now my other question, again in between the TB and firewall, along the TB is a metal tube which connects to a rubber black hose which connects to a nipple underneath the OEM intake tube (the bigger nipple, i know there are two, my smaller one was capped)... this one also has suction on it, can i just put a mini filter on this one as i dont have a nipple on my custom CAI? it should work... it was connected to the intake tube which sucks outside air, same as a mini air breather filter. but whats the metal tube going to/why does it need air?

pic of it... this is the metal tube part.


also putting my thumb over both of these suction devices or whatever, to clog it up i guess you can say, has no effect on the idle of the car. car runs fine btw, idles as it did this morning... just need to figure out these 2 components.

inflatablepets

Look up the TB mod and that will tell you a lot.

NZConvertible

Have you considered daytime photography?

Bob_The_Normal

Yeah man, wtf... ever heard of a FLASH camera?

Here are some pics with LIGHT, might be useful.

--Gary

7th Heaven

^ it was nighttime =\

anyone can help me?

DerangedHermit

Take the pics again, it's daytime now .

WAYNE88N/A

Well, I can decipher the middle picture anyway, lol...

Your big bypass air tube feeds your BAC and air bypass solenoid valves, for your idle control through different loads. The car will run like crap with that hose off, so I would imagine it would run like crap with a little breather filter on the end of it too. See if you can rig up a way to connect the bypass hose into your new intake...

HAILERS

The pictures are really bad, but the description isn't so bad. You got some crummy answers, also.

My crummy answer: Yes, it's the double throttle diaphram. It's more or less like a choke for cold days. It will close the two throttle plates you described during cold startup, and slowly open them all the way.

The green/white thing is the delay valve. It maintains a vacuum on the double throttle when the throttle is bliped. Sort of a damper to keep the two plates from gong open/shut/open/shut.

The plastic/metal device is a water thermo valve. It is the device that regulates vacuum to the double throttle diaphram. When cold it passes vacuum to the double throttle diaphram. As the water warms up, it restricts vacuum to the doublem throttle diaphram and eventually blocks vacuum to it. When that happens the double throttle diaphram spring loads the two throttle plates to full open. This works quite different from a turbo's two outter throttle plates. It has diddly squat to do with any throttle body mod.

Before you do anything about this item, put a vacuum hose on the nipple of the double throttle diaphram. Suck on it. Does the suction make the diaphrams lever move? Does it hold a vacuum? If not, you need another diaphram. I personally have never seen one that worked. I've looked in wrecking yards and never found one that worked.

My advice about the double throttle diaphram..........ignore it. Leave it alone. The two throttle plates are spring loaded to wide open. The car will run just fine as frogs hair without it, except maybe on a very cold morning it might make a small difference. Just cap/block off the vac line goine to it. IF the delay valve is broken.......block off the nipple on the water thermo valve. Even better, block off the two nipples that feed the water thermo device at the source of vacuum, located about three inches below the water thermo sensor.

NOTE: The water thermo sensor IS NOT the same thing as the THERMOWAX. So if someone is thinking THERMOWAX......get your head out of your dark place.

Note: there is/are FREE DOWNLOADS OF THE FSM ON THIS SITE! And on occasion you can find original FSM's on E=BAY. I bought an extra one last year for twenty five bucks. Do your best to not buy Haynes books, if you can avoid it. Personal predjudice. some humor involved.

7th Heaven

thanks Wayne and Hailers. so basically, fab up a new nipple on my intake piping for the big black rubber tube that feeds the BAC and air bypass solenoid valves. and plug the little white nipple at the water thermo valve and the double throttle disphram's nipple also? i dont go crazy on my 7 when its cold, i always let it warm up, so i figure blocking off that delay should be ok...

now my new problem... the car starts, then dies. if i give it a little gas right after it starts, it will stay on and run. i searched and got many different answers. i can say that my AFM is tilted to the side a bit and maybe pointed down more because of the new piping, so im thinking that could be it. im going to tilt it back the way it was and see if it works....

7th Heaven

well adjusting the AFM didnt work, still does it... i'm guessing it could be an intake leak at one of the couplers or maybe one of those two vac lines mentioned above need to be reconnected...

HAILERS

Ref the number one picture: You don't need to cap that off if you cap off the hose in the number two picuture. That hose attached to the water thermo in the second picute feeds the water thermo and the double throttle diaphram. Cap that hose off at its source and you won't have to cap anything else as far as pictures one and two go.

Picture number three just needs a hose on it to connect it to the nipple on the air inlet duct. That nipple should be on the bottom of the inlet duct. Inlet duct being that waffled dust that........runs b/t the throttle inlet and the exit of the afm.

7th Heaven

that makes sense, only need to cap the plastic white nipple. but could having these two hoses disconnected make the car shut off half a second after it starts? i'm thinking i may have an intake leak, the piping is 3" ID and the couplers are supposedly 3" ID also, but they are ******* huge and way too big. you have to tighten them down a LOT, but it fits fine over the intake duct/TB elbow though

HAILERS

About the white nipple: What I'd do, is follow the hose in that picture that is on the other nipple to its source. Then I'd remove that hose and cap the metal nipple that fed that hose. You can cut a vac hose.....fill one end on the hose with RTV.....let it setup...then install the end of the hose without RTV on to the metal nipple. Just picture a one inch long vac hose with RTV in one end and the other end on the nipple.

I don't understand the three inch talk. Is this original inlet ducting? Anyway, if you can get it to idle, just spray some starter fluid on the couplings to tell if they are leaking. Yeah, it sounds like you might have a vac leak and or the bac is not being fed air so it can idle the engine....or the bac is disconnected or????????????????

flamin-roids

double post. Dammit?

flamin-roids

Were you the paris hilton camera man?

7th Heaven

the 3" inner diameter is the new intake piping. as for the bac being disconnected, the rubber hose that goes to it IS disconnected, it used to go onto a nipple on the OEM intake duct, but like i said i have new intake duct without a nipple for the hose to go on, so in a way its disabled. so my 3 possibilites of my car dying right after it starts are (this is what im thinking):

1. air leak somewhere along the intake piping, probably at the couplers
2. bac hose not connected to the intact duct
3. water thermo's white plastic nipple that connects to the double throttle diaphram is not hooked up (but i highly doubt this last option, as most on here have they're DTD removed because of the TB mod).

right now im leaning towards an intake leak as these couplers aren't the best, im ordering some silicone couplers now and hopefully next week i can troubleshoot. till then ill have to give it some gas as i start it up so it doesnt die on me. i'm going to fix the green cylinder delay valve though for the DTD and hook it back up and see if it makes a difference.