ok heres the deal..i have an 87 turbo 2 with a walbro 255,rb full turbo back,hks megaflow intake and an s5 turbo,i am planning on getting the rtek 1.7 ecu with maybe some 680cc injectors or 720cc's,i will also have a safc2 and a aeromotive fuel pressure regulator....ok my question is...can i remove those vaccums that are under the UIM???? i have no ac,no heat, no PS, just the motor in the car you can say lol...i wanna know if i was to remove those lines and just run 2 fuel lines( feed and return) to the rails what would be the BAD from this???What would be the GOOD if there is any?????...not sure if you could search on stuff like this but sorry inadvance before you guys go crazy and flame me...thanks

 

The Rtek 1.7 requires 720 or larger secondaries. You can't use 680s.

 

clearly thats why i said i was using a safc2 also....increase the flow of the 680's.....anyone have any ideas on my question????????????? thanks

 

the 680s will flow almost as much as the 720s will...it's like 715ccs or something.

If you want to remove the rats nest, do a search in the archives for "Rats Nest Removal"

I have it done and it works fine. I'd suggest getting blockoff plates from www.2751engineering.com for your BAC and your ACV if you plan on removing those too.

 

thanks man but do you feel a difference in the car?? idle different?? let me know

 

um...it's gonna be a little tougher to set the idle since you're going to have to rely on the the Idle set screw on the back of the TB and the TPS. But other than that, it should idle fine once it's set.

 

Oh...and rather than spending the money on an RTEK 1.7 and an SAFC, why don't you just spend the same amount and get the RTEK 2.0?

 

<sigh>

I guess if you openly choose to do something different than what we say you need, you can't blame us if something goes wrong...good luck tuning..

 

turbo2ltr its been done before and i have yet to see or hear problems.........now the 2.0 is out of my price range...i got my safc2 from my cousin for free so all i will be spending is 150 the most i guess...well i'll let you guys know what happens but thanks

 

You would serve your customers better by provided them with proper technical explantions rather than snarky comments...

Is there any reason at all why a fuel controller can't be used to make up the 3% difference in flow between a 550/680 combo and the recommended 550/720?

 

thanks NZConvertible glad to see i wasnt the only one that picked up on that..anyone else have any more to say about the removal of those vaccums??

 

SAFC in any form is NOT a 'fuel controller' it's simply a MAF interrupt that allows the user to fool the ECU into seeing a false flow, this is a 2D device that ONLY changes your base air ratio curve, nothing else. You can't 'Tune' with an SAFC.. period.. people who do are throwing away money and fooling themselves..like butt dyno jockeys and turbonator users..

Safc is used when you add a larger MAF or some setup that changes the inherent flow characteristics associated with the MAF calibration of the sensor/ECU.

 

I'm well aware of the limitation of interceptors, but most of your post is just BS. Not a fuel controller? Whatever... Hundreds of cars all over the world have been successfully "tuned" with S-AFC's and similar products. Your little rant didn't even answer my question.

 

Sorry if my post sounded snarky. That was not my intention. I'm not looking at this from a technical standpoint, but rather a liabilty standpoint. Can you do what he wants to do? Sure. Will Joe Noob realize the implications of running smaller injectors after reading this thread and thinking he can do the same? Maybe, maybe not. People can do anything they want, but we say you need 720s. Who's going to get the blame if Joe Noob runs a 1.7 with 680s and blows up because he read this thread that said someone else is doing it without any mention that we require 720s? I simply don't want to see anyone blowin up.

But on a side note, remember that the AFC does not know if the secondary injectors are on or not . This makes it hard(er) to tune properly because running different injectors than the ECU is expecting puts a large step in the required correction. i.e. no correction is needed when only the primaries are on, then all of a sudden, the larger (or smaller) secondary injectors come on requiring a correction. But the AFC doesn't know exactly when they came on so you end up with rich or lean dips depending on the what side of the secondary hysterisis you're on. With the 1.7 and the proper sized 720s that large step in correction isn't there so the transition ends up being smoother, even if you apply a correction to it via the AFC.

Can use an AFC to correct for different size secondaries, of course, it's been done for years. It's just not ideal, especially when you are already getting the 1.7...

 

ok how about more info on my question??? thanks

 

Your aware of the limitations yet the post was BS.. lol good try..

but please tell me.. where the fuel injector intercept wiring is on the SAFC/AFR ?? because the ones I get up here don't seem to come with them..

and your reply had nothing to do with the question either so bully on you.

 

Once you do your intended mods, you can remove certain lines. Most lines are for the emissions solenoids and can be removed off the bat, but there are lines for the stock fuel pressure regulater and oil injecters that you don't wanna remove yet. Once your planned mods are done, go ahead and remove it........just plumb new oil injecter lines from the manifold, and run a new line to the charcoal canister hookup (Next to the Brake Master cylinder, follow the metal lines and you'll find it) to the oil filler neck.

 

BS as in you saying it in unable to tune. And, the intercept wiring is where it is spliced into the ECU wiring harness ....

His reply was calling you out on not answering his question, which, with this last tort, you obviously still cannot answer. Hats off to you for being ignorant, sir.

 

LOL whatever. the original question was being answered just fine. my post was simply to point out the misnomer of using the Safc as a 'fuel' computer to adjust across the map with .. if you don't quite get it.. then that's your problem.

and it's a 're-tort ' not a 'tort' .. speaking of ignorance..

 

I totally understand where you're coming from, but this is what you should've said the first time. Joe Noob learned a lot more from your second post.

But lets not overstate this particular case. Running 3% leaner than stock mixtures is certainly not something I'd be worried about, and is probably less than what would be taken out using the S-AFC if a proper dyno tune was done. At least with the S-AFC the flexibility is there to dial in the right mixtures even if the injectors aren't exactly what the chip is set for. The problems of using the S-AFC with staggered injector sizes is well-known, but in this case the issue will be far smaller because the "error" being corrected is far smaller.

Your post was just a list of BS statements:

"SAFC in any form is NOT a fuel controller"

Except that it allows you to control the amount of fuel being injected across a range of engine speeds and loads. Do you have a better description for it? Preferably an intelligent one...

"this is a 2D device that ONLY changes your base air ratio curve, nothing else."

And that's all it's supposed to do. Most of the tuning is already in the ECU. That's the whole point of an interceptor; to make adjustments to the factory tune. And while the S-AFC doesn't do true 3D tuning, the fact that you can alter fuelling based on both rpm and load means it's not 2D.

"You can't 'Tune' with an SAFC.. period.. people who do are throwing away money and fooling themselves..."

There are hundered of people all over the world (users and tuners) who would laugh at you for that statement because it's complete nonsense.

"Safc is used when you add a larger MAF or some setup that changes the inherent flow characteristics associated with the MAF calibration of the sensor/ECU"

This statement implies this is the only use for one, which is more BS.

 

ok guys thanks for answering to my thread and i want to let it be known that I did not start this lol...ok guys its done you both made your points...well..one of you did...thanks again

 

Excuse me .. it will adjust for 'loads ' LOL holy crap.. how can someone with this many posts on a car fourm not have learned anything??

how can a 2D air ratio tool adjust fuel for both RPM and LOADS .. that requires a 3D table.. which the AFC?AFR are not capable of doing. Ever. Oh and the SAFC/AFR WAS Designed to do that ONE job and I've seen it used many times in Japan ( in person) for just that one purpose; to work in conjunction with a tuned ECU. ( you know that little box with the 3D look up tables that's modified to work with larger injectors..ect.)