BlackRx7

Okay I was looking at the Mazdatrix web site on the front cover o-ring page and notice the 86-92 gasket that came in my gasket kit does not look like the 86-92 front cover gasket more like the 79-85 gasket....





the reason I'm thinking of using it, since after removing the front cover and oil pan and finding the pinched o-ring, puting another o-ring it it, and I'm pretty sure it got pinched again since my oil pressure is like before, the gasket should help hold it in place better...

BlackRx7

anyone?

BlackRx7

Icemark you must know

hypntyz7

You have an s4 engine, right? Ok, the deal is:

s4's used a single rubber o-ring, and the casting around it was very thin. the gasket that was supposed to be used fit right around the o-ring exactly, so it had nowhere to go.

the s5's had a rubber o-ring AND a teflon spacer ring, with a larger casting, and a gasket with a larger hole. the teflon ring held the oring in place.

well, for what ******* ever reason, the gasket makers saw fit to only give you the s5 front cover gasket for all 86+ engine kits. So, now if you use this gasket, the o-ring has room to break and leak, since the gasket is not there to hold it in place.

What you can do:

1) get the older, correct gasket, with teh small hole.

2) do not use a gasket at all. Since the front cover will sit closer to the engine, it will sit directly flush with the casting around the o-ring, sealing it in place and it will have no option but to stay.

Yes, I have had my rounds with the ******* o-ring that costs hours of work too. Took me a while to figure it out actually. Front cover jobs are a bitch in the car, especially with a/c and p/s.

IWNTA20B

If you have an S4, do not use the gasket. Use Hylomar on the O-ring and silicone sealant for the cover. If you do use a gasket, there is a chance the ring could get squeezed out since it will put that much more space between the O-ring and cover. Chalk one up for the Mazda engineers. I guess they figured this out and redesigned the S5 front housing. The fucked up thing is, when you buy a re-seal kit, they give you a gasket for the front cover. ****, they must *know* it's going to cause trouble. Anyway, I have *never* had a problem using Hylomar on the O-rings and silicone sealant on the cover. Make sure you let the silicone cure a few minutes then tighten it down. You don't need to tighten it too much since they are aluminum and you don't want to strip anything. They're 12mm so take it easy on it. Always use a torque wrench.

BlackRx7

okay wellI guess I read the madatrix site wrong the 79-85 the one is right....I just got done installing the front cover without a gakset and silicone instead...and still the o-ring got pinched...looks like I'm going to have to pull it apart again, but its only a days PITA job....I think i'm going to get the earlier gasket this time to help hold it in place this time

Icemark

Kevin took care of you for an answer before I could

What I have done a couple times now is:

This is the new gasket with the old cover style:


See how there is a gap between the gasket and the O ring?

Well I simply fill the gap with some high temp gasket silicon, let dry, then trim the extra gasket out of the way.

That way you can still use the gasket, but the O ring is held in place by the cushable silicon.

I haven't had any leaks when doing that, but none of the motors I have done that method on have more than 20K miles on them, so I don't know for sure how well it will last.

BlackRx7

sounds like an idea..I wounder if I can find a plastic o-ring a an auto store that would fit? but you do this with the motors out of the car I assume, its gonna be pretty hard with the motor in the car....also should If I use silicone instead of the gasket should i put it on the front housing or the front cover? i have been putting it on the front cover...

hypntyz7

Dude, trust me...just take it back apart, and reassemble it with a new o-ring, a little hylomar and/or sealant on each side, and no gasket. The black rtv is very high quality and its what I use on all my engines, and it will do just as well or better than a paper gasket, and you will not have another failure provided you dont let the oring slip out of place when installing the cover.

BlackRx7

well I just order an 83-85 gasket and O-ring, with the the theromstad kit with 2nd day air for only 22 bucks so I'll try that first...but i still shoulkd use some RTV to hole the gasket in place right?

Icemark

Kevin, does have a lot more experience with this than me, You may wish to follow his suggestion (since there really is not any long term reliability results on how I have done it).

hypntyz7

No, if youve already ordered teh gasket, then use it. THis one will work properly. Bottom line, you dont even need a gasket though, best thing to do is not use one at all on 86-88 engines.

rx-7fc

hypntyz7 i put a s5 front cover on a s4 engine and what gasket would i use or do i just use black rtv i put the cover on a few weeks ago but it has a little oil leak so i have to fix it

hypntyz7

the front cover doesnt matter...they are all just a flat surface. the front iron has the casting that controls what you have to do with the o-ring and gasket. IF using an 88 or prior front iron, you must either a) use no gasket on the front cover, or b) use the pre-85 gasket. IF using an 89 or later front iron, use the gasket they give you and the teflon o-ring along with the standard o-ring, and it will all work normally.

IWNTA20B

The problem is not the cover...it's the S4 front housing casting. There is very little surface area where the O-ring sits compared to the S5 casting. If you *want* to use a gasket, use the '79-85 which has a smaller O-ring hole. You can get away without a gasket. You don't need it. Some people feel comfortable using one so if you must, use a '79-85 gasket. All you need is high temp silicone and either Hylomar or silicone for the O-ring when not using a gasket. As suggested, if you are using silicone , let it cure a few minutes before you install the housing. On my S4, I have never used a gasket and no leaks whatsoever.
What a lot of people do is tighten it down too much and or doesn't wait for the silicone to cure before torqueing it down. All you're going to do is squeeze out the silicone. I'm sure Hypnotyz7 and Icemark have done this numerous times. We are giving you sound suggestions from experience. Again, torque in sequence and use a torque wrench so it's evenly tightened.

bejbis

i just rebuild my S4 motor, and man does it feel good to do it yourself. but im ganna take hyptnotz advise and just use that black rtv stuff and the gasket they gave me right?



thanks
Daniel

HAILERS

***i just rebuild my S4 motor, and man does it feel good to do it yourself. but im ganna take hyptnotz advise and just use that black rtv stuff and the gasket they gave me right?*****

Wrong. You going to chunk the gasket. Your going to use Black/Grey/Red RTV in lieu of the gasket and make sure you don't plug the small, approx 1/16th inch hole on the left side that feeds the MOP. You are also going to use the black o'ring and teflon ring if you have the *Later housing* but just the black 0'ring if you have the earlier gasket.

Your also going to go to Mazdatrix.com and read the FAQ at the bottom of the lead page.http://www.mazdatrix.com/faq/oring.htm