graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

OK, Here is the question. I have just rebuilt my TII 89 S5. In the pre-start procedures from Rotary Ressurection, it mentions to check to make sure that there is oil at the filter housing. Without the oil filter on at all, it is dry as a bone. When cranking, no oil is pumping. I did re-use the old oil pump. The engine was a JDM with around 50 k on it. Any help?

Smoken'

iTrader: (1)

How long did you try to crank it? It takes awhile to get it primed. You did put the oil pickup on right?

eriksseven

iTrader: (6)

Yes, crank 4-5x for up to 10 seconds each time. If you had removed the oil-pressure sensor during the rebuild it could've died on you if it were exposed for a while... I've had several fail. See if you can borrow or find a known working sensor to make sure it's not just the sensor.

Try removing your "front" oil-cooler line (that plugs into the front-cover) and then have someone crank the engine over while you watch. If oil starts pumping out, then you obviously have the oil-pickup, oil-pump, pump-chain etc. hooked up. This would be a good thing and I would focus on just cranking your engine over a bunch trying to get oil to show up at your oil-filter/pedestal--it will probably take some effort. I would probably not want to start the engine though if your oil-pressure gauge is not working (even if you get oil all the way up to the filter)--because you really want to be able to monitor your gauges with a fresh engine.

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

I tried to crank it probably 10 times becasue I had an issue with the thing not firing. Thank God it did not fire, if I am not getting oil. Of all things, I found that I had the fuel lines reversed and there was no gas getting to the rotors. I will try the front oil line to see if that helps.

As far as the oil pick up tube, if I recall, there is only one way to put it on where it will fit down into the pan. I may be wrong.

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

Looks like I'm screwed. Disconnected the front oil cooler line where it goes into the front cover and cranked it. Nothing came out. I guess its time to pull the front cover. This sucks. I have been a year on a complete re-build of the entire car and this happens.

Tofuball

You don't have to do that. I've had this happen before when someone rebiult an engine and forgot to prime it.

If you are 100% sure you have that pickup tube on right and you have enough oil in the engine, do the following:

-Get a grease gun and load it with vasoline.
-Stick it in the hole going back to the oil pump and fill the tube, spining the engine backwards a little to get the vasoline into the oil pump and a bit beyond.
-Re-attach oil hose.

DONE

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

Great,

Mine is an S5 turbo, so there is only one way that the pick up will fit on the mount or the oil pan won't go on. I am assuming that your method creates a sort of siphon effect to get the oil flowing. When you talk about the tube going back to the oil pump, I am assuming the front lower part of the front cover where the oil cooler line connects. I am just scared to death that I have something wrong in the pump and its going to screw up the engine if it fires and there is no oil.

eriksseven

iTrader: (6)

Yeah, I would be paranoid as well... I've been in your shoes several occasions and it can cause anxiety.

Worst-case scenario is that you have to pull the front-cover which in *reality* will probably only take you 30-45 minutes... This way you can check the "stack", make sure you have everything installed correctly (the long "shaft-key" etc.). Chances are if you don't have an oil-pickup tube sitting around somewhere--it's probably in the oil-pan like it should be. Also check that your front-cover O-ring and retainer didn't somehow get misplaced or pinched. This can cause low-oil pressure/oil-bypass and may prevent oil from spurting out of the front-cover oil-line "hole" like it should. This has never happened to me, but people talk about it often when referring to low oil-pressure. That being said, you don't want to fire your engine without being sure about this... Chances are you're just fine--but just go through the aforementioned "steps" and post back with your success story.

88rxn/a

iTrader: (6)

here is how i primered mine when i had the SAME exact problem....
remove front oil cooler line
take a long tube (prefer clear to see if any oil is moving)
put a funnel on one end and attach the other end where the front oil cooler line normally goes to the fornt cover...poor some oil in the funnel and crank (with NO fuel going to motor)
once its primed oil will start coming back into the funnel so be careful!!!
confirm oil is in the filter now
fire it up!

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

OK, pulled the front cover tonight. Wow what a B?!? to get the cover off of the front of the oil pan. I am a believer the the black RTV, that stuff wouldn't let go. I checked everything in there and it all seemed OK. The o-ring with the teflon washer was right where I put it ( I had secured with a dab of black RTV, the oil pump was installed, the key was in the gear, the oil pick-up tube is sitting in oil in the pan. I checked the pump and it rotated fine. I did check the wear between the tips of the rotors and the housing in the pump and it was out of spec. It was larger than the FSM says is the max. It looks a bit scored in there on all surfaces that are aluminum (not the rotors). The guy at MazdaTrix said that that even bad pumps pumps something. At this point, I am going to go ahead and buy a new pump and install it. It is not worth the risk. I have a hunch it is something else though. I don't want to re-install before I figure out what is was.

I am wondering if the oil pump failed on the original failure when I lost the front rotor and housing and apex seals. Any other ideas folks? Could it be the pressure regulator stuck shut? Looking for answers.

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the advise. I will prime using this method when I get it back together. Sounds like a good way to do it.

88rxn/a

iTrader: (6)

worked wonders for me!!
damn double post!!

scrip7

iTrader: (6)

A common practice on any type of engine is to pack the cavity of the oil pump with Vaseline before assembly, working it in between the pump's rotors. When the engine is re-assembled, the packed vaseline will create a more positive suction through the pickup tube and almost instant oil pressure when cranked.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

Problem wasnt the oil pump. Even a pump that is a little out of spec will pump fine but the volume might go down a little at high rpm. You sure the pump was bolted firmly to the front iron? If you leave the bolts snug/loose then it will not maintain a prime because the air is getting inside.

I have never had a pump that wouldnt prime, and I install them dry and dont do anything special as far as pumping oil inside or anything.

When you put the new pump on, give it a few spins by hand and be sure some oil shoots out of the hole on the iron where the o-rings go. Then put the cover back on and you will be golden. You can use a drill to help prime the pump if you need to, it turns clockwise.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

and cranking the engine for short spurts and letting it cool off too long between cranking cycles it will never prime, especially if it is too worn to create enough suction. remove the leading plugs and crank it for a good 30 seconds and i bet you get it taken care of.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

I usually crank for about 15-20 seconds and then oil pressure builds and I stop. If I dont see pressure I wait about another 30-45 seconds and hit it again for 15-20 seconds, then go check the oil filter. When I see oil, I replace the EGI fuse(s) and crank that bitch up.

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

I appreciate the input. I pulled the front cover off after I posted some things and believe it or not, found nothing wrong. I did buy a new oil pump and installed it and it pumped just fine. THanks for the input on priming with the vasoline. It worked great. I just had to flip the pump around by hand a few times and WALAH! The only thing that I could think of is the little tick marks in the pump on the rotors and the housing. These are supposed to line up. I guess this is so the inner and outer rotors on the pump are syncronized to create a pumping action. Before I thought to check this, I had pulled the rotors out of the old pump to see if anything was wrong. So it was too late to see if they were in there properly or not. Maybe this was the problem. I put it back together and now I have oil pressure. It still won't start, but it has pressure. Right now, I am trying to figure out why it is not getting spark. When I take the number one rotor plug wire off and ground it to the strut tower, and I am cranking the car, there is no spartk. When I remove the Crank angle sensor and just turn the ignition switch to on and just spin the gear on the CAS, I get spark. For some reason, I am not getting spark when the ignition is turned to the "crank" position or start position. Any Ideas. I am getting a buzzer. I know that either means low coolant or low oil. I know that there is enough of both in the engine. So there must be a problem with one of the sensors. Is there an interlock with the buzzer that if it is picking up a low coolant or low oil that it will not allow the engine to recieve spark when you crank it?

Puzzled?

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

The buzzers have nothing to do with the running of the engine. Sometimes on fresh installs the oil buzzer goes off because the float is stuck in the down position, and the oil needs to thin out and slosh around some to get it to rise. I usually just unplug the sensor for a while until I get the car running then plug it back in.

That is a very odd problem about the spark. You sure your battery is up to the task? Often it is necessary to use a battery charger or a jump on cars where batteries have sat a few weeks/months since they last ran. Try a charger set on 40-50 amps and see if your spark comes back during cranking.

graniteguru

iTrader: (1)

I have the car hooked up to another truck with heavy jumper cables. It is still not getting spark when cranking. I don't get it.