staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

Car will not start unless battery is jumpered directly to starter.

Bypassed clutch switch = no dice

Tried another ignition switch = no dice

Starter is good, car runs fine once started by jumpering

ugh . . .

For all those who a wondering, i searched, this forum is too cluttered with **** and stupid questions so i opened a new thread.

Any help would be great.

HAILERS

So you put a meter on the small wire on the starter solenoid and go to start, and what voltage did you get on that wire when you went to Start?

And what happened when you went to the solenoid on the starter, and jumpered the small blade on the solenoid to the large wire on the starter?

Arkiane

Hailers sounds like he's on the right track, I'd say that you've got a bad solenoid. You should be able to hear an audible click when you turn the key to start if the solenoid engauges correctly.

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

starter is PERFECTLY FINE, solenoid and all, even tried a different starter, no clicks nothing, but the minute you jumper the battery to the solenoid it fires up perfect, the solenoid is fine its something else, any other ideas? I've dealt with bad solenoids before, this doesn't act like that . . .

Icemark

Theft relay plugged in?

HAILERS

So??? You don't want to answer the questions asked?

And how did you jumper the battery to the solenoid?

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

i'm not understanding you, very tired, i bought a trigger switch from autozone, hooked one to the positive battery terminal and the other end to the post on the solenoid, the same post that the power to the starter comes in from.

the security system seems to function, but it wouldn't hurt to look, isn't that relay located near the clutch master cylinder?

Skidtron

iTrader: (1)

Yes it is (the theft detterent start signal relay) and did you make sure to jumper the right clutch switch because one is for just the ECU and one is for the start circuit. At least on a S5 it's like that. The one for the start circuit is the one closest to the firewall not the one at the place where the pedal returns to. If that's not the issue then bypass the relay. Just unplug it then put a jumper wire accross the the connector that you unpluged on the start wire side. And it will crank right up when you turn the key.

Also a temp fix would be to unplug the start signal wire from the harness at the ignition cylinder plug then run a wire from there to the solenoid blade and it will start everytime. Well the starter will anyways. I think you either have the wrong clutch switch jumpered or the security system is disabling the relay or the relay is bad. From what info you posted anyways.

Good luck

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

hmmm i just took a piece of wire, crimped on two male connectors and put the ends into the ECU end of the clutch interlock switch connector, there was only one connector associated with it from what i could tell

HAILERS

There's two switches on the clutch pedal. The upper one is the clutch interlock switch. Pull the plug off and one wire on the Harness side of the plug is Black/Green and the other wire Black/Red. You just jumper a wire that has a male/female connector on each end, b/t the black/red and black/green, to make the circuit and tie it off somewhere.

Then turn the key to Start. If it does not start, then put a meter on the wire that goes on the small plug on the solenoid and see what the voltage is when you go to Start.


I'm fresh and wide awake. I don't quite understand the trigger switch. One end goes to the battery positive post and the other goes to??????? What? The small blade on the solenoid or to the large wire that goes to the solenoid?

If your car has no Theft protection, then you will have a Blue connector like in the jpg attached. That Blue connector is below the Trail Coil assy. Undo the three nuts holding the Trail Coil assy in place and move it to the side.

THEN, Pull that connector off. The plug it was connected to has a Black/White wire in it. It goes directly to the starter solenoids small blade connector. Put batt voltage to that wire and the engine will turn over, proving nothing is bad from there to the solenoid on the starter. If nothing happens, then put a meter on the Black/Green wire in that same connector and go to Start. You should see batt voltage anytime the key is HELD to Start. If not, then the interlock switch isn't jumpered right or the ignition key is messed up.

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

Large terminal on the solenoid, jumpered the clutch switch just as you described

the trigger switch is a button with two cables coming out of it with alligator clips at the end, hook one end up to positive and the other to the starter, press the button and zoom zoom, if you watch Gone in 60 Seconds they use one to steal a car.

Car has the factory security system, its an '88 TII

HAILERS

So the trigger switch is going to the small blade on the solenoid. You press the trigger and the thing starts.

You have Theft Protection. Hmmm. Instead of that BLUE jumper connector I made a picture of, you have a relay in it's place. Called a Starter Cut Relay I think.

So if the Theft Protection device sees THEFT, it will pull in that relay and keep the voltage from going to the starter solenoid. So maybe that 's your problem. To prove it you could just unplug your Theft Protection Control Units plug/plugs and try to start the car. If you disconnect that device, then there's nothing to pull in the Starter Cut Relay which is GOOD. That's in YOUR favor.

Another thing would be to find that Starter Cut Relay. Pull it's plug off. Jumper two wires in the plug. One being Black/Green and the other Black/White.

Sorry, I have no theft protection. I THINK that relay is near the Main Relay. Bolted to the inside fender outboard of the brake reservoir/trail coil assy. Like I said, I think its there. The wires in the plug should be Black/Green, Black/White, Light green/yellow. Actually the FSM shows two Black/Green wires in that plug. Try jumpering the black/white to the largest black/green, then go to start.

I THINK the Theft protection unit is on the passengers side of the interior. Mabe attached to the speaker outfit below the glove box. So if you go the route of just removing the plug/plugs from that Theft Unit, that is the general area where it resides.

ce340

Did you check all your chassic grounds?

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

grounds look ok but i'm going to go over them again tomorrow

kborro01

iTrader: (3)

There are two relays on the L/H rear febder near the clutch and brake master cylinders. The start cut realy should be the smaller one. The large one is the main relay that controls power to egi and such. If you don't have cruise control or it has never been installed, then there should only be one switch on your clutch.

HAILERS

The start circuit is simple. One black wire comes from the engine bay fuse box. It feeds the ignition switch. You turn the switch to START. The power passes thru the ignition switch and goes to the Clutch Interlock Switch. The switch makes when you press the pedal down. The power continues on to the Starter Cut Relay. If the Theft Protection Unit has NOT pulled in that relay, the power then continues on to the starter solenoid and the starter engages.

So. When you turn the key to ON, do you have the normal lights like the idiot warning lights and the instrument lights? IF you do, then the power from that black wire in the engine bay to the ignition switch is good.

I'll stop there. I just remembered you said the engine starts when you use the trigger switch device, therefore all the gnds are good. The only gnd involved in the Start circuit is the one from the battery to the long bolt on the starter. That's if you leave out the Theft Unit which pulls in the Starter Cut Relay when it senses a car being thieved.

staticguitar313

iTrader: (2)

sounds great, thanks for all the help guys, i'm a real idiot when it comes to wiring, i can handle just about anything else on these cars without a problem, but electrical systems are my Achilles heel.

Enthu

iTrader: (1)

I am having similar issues to the OP. I checked this b/w wire and I am only get 2.00 Volts witht the key in the start position!

HAILERS

Crummy connection somewhere b/t the ignition switch and that single small wire on the starter solenoid.

Go pull the Trai coil assy up and away. Don't disconnect anything. Just undo its three nuts and lift to the side. Look for the BLUE jumper I showed in a post above.

Stop here........if you have factory THEFT don't do the above or the below.

Now pull the BLUE plug off. Put your meter in the BLACK/GREEN wire and set to vdc and go to START. Still 2vdc? Sorry.

So now go to the clutch interlock switch at the TOP of the clutch pedal. It should have a BLACK/GREEN and a BLACK/RED wire if memory serves. Put the meter on the BLACK/RED wire and key to start. Should show approx 12vdc or so. IF it does...............................grab the interlock swithes elect plug (NOT the plug on the switches pigtail, but the plug on the harness that connects to the pigtail), and jumper b/t the BLACK/GREEN and BLACK/RED wire. Use a piece of spare wire or whatever. Now go try to start the car with all the other connections back on the harness. IF it starts the interlock switch is kaput.

Most cars have two switches on the clutch pedal. The interlock switches wires are colored as described. IF the colors on the switch your looking at are not those colors.........it ain't the interlock switch.

You didn't say what year/type of RX. It matters. Early 86 and some 87 turbo cars have no clutch interlock switch. Series five colors MIGHT be different than those for a series four which I described.

IF you have factory THEFT protection, then you have no BLUE jumper in the harness. You have a Starter Cut Relay that is effected by the THEFT protection unit. IF the Theft unit sees a THEFT happening, it pulls that relay in and seperates the black/green wire from the black/white wire that goes to the starter solenoid. So we need to know what car/series and if THEFT unit protected or.........not.