bighead

I've got a 1986 RX-7 NA.

I just got it off someone, who says it's been sitting for more than a year, with the spark plugs out and no exhaust system, not even manifold. But apparently, it's been rebuilt - it has blue painted side housings.

So I tried to start it and at first the starter when "Rrrrrrrrrrr" and then I let go of the key. Next time I tried to start it, just CLICK. From then on, only clicks. But one other time, it went "Rrrrrrrrr" for a second. Other than that, clicks only.

My cousin and brother tried push-starting the car, and when it was up to the max speed they could push it, I would drop the clutch in. And the car would then just come to a halt. We tried this a few times, to no avail.

I then tried hammering the starter, going into the car and starting it. That didn't work. So I hammered it again, and it still didn't start - but the familiar CLICK was still there.

So then I read about carbon lock and I tried turning the eccentric shaft bolt... but I couldn't turn it either way. I tried with all my might, but I couldn't! (Of course, the car was in neutral)

Now, my question is: Is this carbon lock or just a starter problem?! The engine did go "Rrrrrrrrrrrr" twice...

Please help! Thank-you so much!!!

bighead

One more question... am I supposed to be able to turn the eccentric shaft bolt (19mm) quite easily by hand if nothing's wrong???

7th Deadly Sin

i have a 86 rx7 too, i bought it for a t2 swap but i have no use for it cuz imma pick up a t2, so imma sell it to my friend, but the guy i bought it from said its been sitting for a year and he said the apex seals r broken, i doubt that though, he probably just used that as an excuse cuz he knew i wanted a body for a t2 swap, now im selling it and when i tried to start it, no clicks just the gauges lit up

White_FC

If I didn't know better it sounds alot like you have a flat battery mate..

Did you try jump staring it before you tried pull/push starting it???

A carbon locked engine WILL turn over by cranking with the starter on a healthy battery (not too say thats good for a carbon locked motor, but it WILL happen)

Either way just sounds to me like you have a flat battery...

dorifc3s

I have an 87 FC and it doesnt start either. It cranks but diesnt start and it has been stored for a year as well. But when I crank it goes "whrrrwhrrrr..whrrwhrr" like in pulses. And when it cranks, its around 1000rpms usualyy but spikes to 1500rpms sometimes. The battery is finr, I think the starter is fine too, but I dont know why it isnt starting.

I pulled the plugs and they were wet a couple times, so i took em out and cranked it and it cranked better but still didnt work.

How do I turn the ecentric shaft bolt? I tried turning the flywheel and thta was real hard. what could it be?

razorback

i have the same problem dorifc3s. i dont think my car is getting spark or fuel either. what could it be?

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

No, carbon locked engines can be solid. Even huge breaker bars and push starts won't budge them.

But start simple. Try turning the engine by hand...Does it turn? If so, then don't worry about carbon lock.

bighead

I put a ratchet and an extension on the eccentric shaft 19mm bolt and I pulled it with all my might while the car was in neutral - no movement there.

But... do you guys think that this car could have carbon lock? It was definitely rebuilt...

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

If you can't move the engine, then something is wrong...Sure sounds like a locked engine to me.

bighead

Yup, I now believe 99% that it is a locked engine. I tried turning my 1990 GXL, and it was so damn easy to move! That confirms to me that this 1986 Base has bit the carbon cookie.

So I bought some MotoMaster Carubretor Cleaner... since I couldn't find AMSoil Power Foam or MMO... I bought two bottles, poured 1/4 in one rotor, 1/4 in the other and 1/2 on the floor. I ran out before I could put any in on the exhaust side... hope it works!

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

At this point, you might as well use ATF. Not like it's going to get "more" broken...

bighead

Yeah... that's what I'll do if this stuff doesn't work. This stuff is expensive compared to ATF...

What happens if I force it with the biggest mother-of-all breaker bars?

Bambam7

Ok, well, you can run the risk of deforming your locked apex seal or denting the rotor of you push too hard.
If you are planning on un-seizing it yourself, atf works well after sitting for a day or two, but make sure you turn it BACKWARDS- counterclockwise with a big bar to break it loose- forwards can do the things I just mentioned.
You could have scrwede yourself by push starting it though, could have really fucked the housing.

White_FC

BamBam just raised an interesting point, CAN you turn it backwards at the moment?

I still don't see how a carbon locked engine could NOT be turned over by a good battery/starter motor....

Did this happen to you personally Aaron cake? I just find it hard to believe thats all..


And for what its worth my spare engine I had soaking in ATF for near on a year still had COPIOUS ammounts of carbon build up all over each rotor... Which leads me to the conclusion that ATF does nothing at all for the hardcore carbon build up seen in unlooked after rotors.

hypntyz7

Not carbon lock, but rusty internals. When you let an engine sit like that, with humidity and water able to get in and out of the engine, the rotors rust up pretty quick. Since all the seals are compressed in a working engine, they rust in place solid. Even if you take the thing apart, where a normal engine would have all those seals expand and push out of their slots, an engine like this will have rotors and seals that can never be used again, because there is no way to get them out. There is a picture on my webpage tech section of this occurence if anyone wants to look...

White_FC

Thank you hypntyz7, that makes considerably more sense to me than a carbon locked engine that can't be moved at all...

dorifc3s

So whats the most common problem for stored FCs that wont start?

How much are rebuilds for rotaries? Isnt the rebuild kit from mazda like 900 bux?

bighead

hypntyz7

You make a lotta sense... you see, the engine sat for like a year with no exhaust, not even manifold with that hole open and no plugs. So I can see where rust would've gotten in!

This really sucks...

hypntyz7

Most common? Flooding. Second most...electrical issues, such as starter connections, battery terminals, fuel pump, etc.

Most common problem if the engine is found to have an internal defect/loss of compression/lack of ability to turn? Stuck seals...

-due to sticking carbon (not necessarily carbon lock) keeping the seals from freely sliding in their slots,

-from rotors rusting and the seals being locked in place, refusing to compress in and out,

-or from carbon lock (carbon flaking off and landing in one corner of the engine, physically prohibiting the rotor from moving any farther).

The first 2 are more common, in reality.

hypntyz7

Example of a rusty rotor with all the seals locked in place...you could clean the rust off the rotor and probably use it, but the seals can never be removed, so you can't...

White_FC

Holy crap!!
That is seriously rusted!

bighead

Mine may not be the rust... since the engine was rebuilt and didn't sit for too too long. Still haven't figured it out.

bighead

WHOOO-HOOO~!!!!!!!!!

I got in the car and just started cranking the key madly... and kept doing it. Then all of a sudden the car went, "Whrrrr RRrrRRrrrrrrRRR". So... I think the engine turned over. Anyway, it didn't do that again.

But anyone got any ideas?

White_FC

And your Suuuuuure this car doesn't just have a flat battery??

bighead

Oh yes... I charged it and it was full. I have a charger.