Ziggy682

Well, my A/C has slowly stopped getting cool, and it's starting to get pretty warm here in Texas. I am fairly sure I just need to get my freon charged. Here's the question.

Should I pay out the a$$ and get it charged with R???(the old stuff), or convert it over to R-134??(the new stuff). I know converting it will be cheaper in the long run, but which will be cheaper now assuming it needs a full charge? Any ideas how much it will cost?

Sorry for all the questions, but I have never done any A/C work. This will also be the first time in about 4 years that I have paid anyone to lay a finger on any car I have owned. Oh well, I guess you have to let the professionals do some things.

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

Converting to r134a isnt as hard as you might think. The most expensive thing will be to get your existing system cleaned out. That has to be done by an AC shop. Once the R12 is out, all you have to do is buy an R134a conversion kit ($10) which is nothing more then the right connectors that fit over the R12 connectors. Then its $6-9 a can for the R134a. I would use the R134a/oil charge cans, and purchasing a charging kit usually runs $22. So total cost to me was $40 for the kit and R134a/oil plus $30 to get my system cleaned from R12..

Rat

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

By the way, one can of R12 runs about $35 and they wont even sell to you if you dont have a certification to use it.

RX7BEAR

I have done more then 8 cars with the conversion kits !!! Just make sure all of the freon gas is out of the system. The oil charge that comes with the kit makes th eold oil work with the new stuff. Pluss if you have a slow leak they also sell this other stuff for about 26.00 that will seal that too. total cost retrofit kit 46-48.00 leak stopper 26-28.00 and you rdone .

'Vert in Vegas

BS!!!
You will not make it throgh one season with mixed oil. You will trash your compressor.


Also not true. You must change the o-rings and repair the leak correctly.
This guy is giving BAD advice.

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

Hey Vert N Vegas, are you an AC specialist? Cause if you are, I got a million questions I would like to ask!! I hope the advice I gave was okay....

Rat

RX7BEAR

I havent had one problem yet and none of the peoples cars have either except one guy had a condenser go up

'Vert in Vegas

Yes.
Ask away.

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

Actually, the problem was, I had a depleted system. I charged it with 134a, but I couldnt get low side pressure much above 20 psi, but it was blowing cold. Well, the next day I was driving, and the high side line just blew up. Frigging AMAZING!! And really loud. My friend says its because I didnt get all the r12 out. Is that true? And if so, is there any way to purge a system without going to a specialist? Assuming the system is depleted? Obviously once the line blew, all pressure was lost. Can I replace the line and recharge? Or what should I do? I have another 7 donor car with a charged and operational r12 system, but I am gonna strip that car for my other one. Should I have the system vacuumed out?

Thanks!

Rat

'Vert in Vegas

YOU HAVE BEEN LUCKY, NOT SUCCESSFUL.
Honest, this is not a area to cheat.
You just can't win.
Here is a sight that covers some of the risk.
http://www.ackits.com/blackdeath.htm

'Vert in Vegas

You are pretty much screwed. This is exactly why I am trying to convince RX7BEAR not to do it.
The real question is what do you do now?
Or do you want to know what you could have done differently?
I will talk you through either (or both).
look at my other posts on A/C here.

88TurboII

I personally would not convert a 2nd gen to 134a. In my experience, 134a is not as efficient as r12, and a converted system will not be as cold. R134a is fine in a newer vehicle designed for it, because the components are designed for it and more efficient in themselves.

I've also seen a compresser that worked fine with r12, and froze up a week after being converted to 134a. It's a crapshoot. If you convert you for sure should change the receiver/dryer, and all the o-rings would also be recommended. You need a vacuum pump if you're going to do it right.

If it's been years and now just needs a 12 oz. can of r12, why not just buy one off ebay? It's not all that expensive, and may last you as long as you have the car. Of course, if you have a leak you should get it fixed. That's different than having a 10 year+ system that finally needs a charge.

Vert n Vegas sounds like he/she knows what they are talking about.

Mr Rotary

You know what you're talking about too

'Vert in Vegas

I would agree it is better to keep R12 in your system, whenever possible.
It will cool better, and its use avoids a lot of work converting to R134.
The only way I would consider a R134 conversion is when you are replacing the compressor.
That would be a good time to consider R134, but I would definitely go to a larger condensorat the same time.

RX7BEAR

I guess I have been lucky then . It just seems to me that they would say all this on the boxes the kit comes in . All the systems I did were empty of all the gases but not the oil. I would hate to have a line pop on me or my compresser go up. Like I said I must be lucky huh ? And yes it is not as cold as the R12 was but hell we wont be able to get that stuff soon. It will be put to the test soon enough Im moving from michigan back to Maryland were it has been in the 100 's this week

'Vert in Vegas

You still have a chance to save some serious expense.
I strongly suggest you get rid of that mixed oil, which has acids eating away at the internals of your compressor.
Purge the compresor, evaporator, condensor and lines.
Replace the drier.
Put in the blue o-rings designed for R134.

RX7BEAR

were do yo get these seals? mazda?Why dont they tell us this stuff on the box ? I saw no warning of this at all !!! Damn If I want my stuff to pop !!!!!!!!! I can get a friend to evaporate my system of the oil and stuff .

'Vert in Vegas

Pep Boys or Autozone can fix you up!
Or any automotive A/C parts supply house.
I try to avoid the stealer.

Ziggy682

On Ebay, every auction says you have to have an EPA certification to purchase the R12. Is this just somehting they have to say because Ebay requires it, or will they actually check?

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

I want to convert to 134a. I am gonna have to strip my other car anyways, its too far gone body-wise to salvage. So as sorry as it sounds, I am going to strip all the good parts off and send it to the graveyard..

Which means that I have 2 complete AC systems, both uncharged, that I would like to build a 134a out of. Obvioulsy I would like to do it myself, but it looks like that may be difficult since I lack the vacuuming equipment to evacuate the system. I dont have a real big problem with taking the complete system to a specialist to have it vacuumed and flushed. Other then that, I should be able to fill it myself.. Shouldnt I?

Rat

88TurboII

I've only bought R12 on Ebay twice, one place checked, one didn't. Not a problem for me, because I have the certificate! It's really simple to get! Check our www.asecert.org. You can take the 20 question test on-line and get the cert for something like $20 or $25. Special classes or education is not required, and the questions have links where you can find the answers! LOL... Every Mazda owner should become certified!!!

'Vert in Vegas

Yes, you can do this.
First choose a compressor that has not had mixed oil in it. Flush out the old oil with mineral spirits, turning the clutch by hand to pump it clear. Then flush it clean with TEXACO HFC100 OIL
TEXACO HFC100 OIL is the oil of preference to lube your compressor with R134.
remove the expansion valve so you can flush out the evaporator, condensor and lines. Use mineral spirits.
Do the condenser a few times. Use plenty of air to blow the residual flush out. Change to
a R134 Compatable Accumulator . You MUST put in a new accumuator (drier).
Put in the blue (r134 compatible) o-rings.
Put it all together, take it a shop to put it on a vavuum pump.
At that point you can let them put in the R134 or you can do it.
Enjoy your A/C!!

turbo II addict

iTrader: (1)

convert it to r134 it is a lot cheaper my dad owens a body shop and it only costs him 120$ to get a cylinder of r134 and it costs him close to a grand to get one of r12 so go with the r134 its alot cheaper

'Vert in Vegas

There is more to the conversion than just the cost of R134.

J-Rat

iTrader: (2)

Thanks man!!