Icemark

I have been tossing this idea around of a water to air intercooler, simular to the Jackson Racing one for the sebring supercharged 1.8 miatas


but I am wondering if anyone is using a water to air intercooler, inplace of the stock or a FMIC.

If so, what you think...advantages, dis-advantages?

chris_stampe

How much would one of those run?

TonyTurboII

Not sure, but that unit looks too small for a TII... Im interested.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

I know there are a few people running them on the FCS_ORG list, but I don't know if there are any on the forum. From what I've heard, they've had good results turning the stock IC into a water-air unit.

Remember that superchargers put out less heat than turbos, so if the intercooler is designed for supercharger applications it may not be big enough for high-boost turbos.

Icemark

They are claiming a 100F drop at 6 PSI boost for the Miata 1.8liter motor. But I am not sure what the CFM difference between the T2 and Miata is... I am figuring probably another third more on the T2 than the Miata.

Cost for the kit is $1000 retail at Moss, but might be able to find it cheaper.

I am trying to get away from my whole front end filled with the FMIC or having to go back to the stock intercooler and use the lame T2 hood. So I am starting to investigate the options.

Water to air seems to be the best alternative when size and weight comes into play.

Scott 89t2

brain cain has a nice setup. "BDC" is around here every now and then. he took a stock IC and sealed it with alum plates on the top and bottom, and runs his water through the stock IC. he has a 5 gallon water tank in the rear bin. a huge electric water pump, and a rad from a small car mounted in his bumper. the water goes from the tank, to the IC, to the rad, back to the tank.

his last dyno put down 420RWHP but he was maxing out his four 720cc injectors. he added some 1600 last month or so. I'm still waiting for some new numbers

the fact that he is running 450+hp though the stock 2" IC piping is amazing.

TonyTurboII

Wow, ill have to email BDC.

In therory, it would be great to have the tank to put ice in.

NRA T2

sounds good and expensive I'd recomend going for air to air

Scott 89t2

that's what it's for you won't beat a air to water for drag for that reason. you can get your intake temps below the outside air temps. it's just not as good for long term boosting, which is why you want as much water in the system as possible.

I was thinking about making one, it's not that hard. but it is heavy. he said it added like 75lbs to the car. it also makes the car alot more complacated. more things to fail / go wrong.

BDC

Air to water intercooling is far, far, far superior to air-to-air, although it's also far more complex and has more point of potential failure. That's the downside to it.

In my experience, I've had great success using A2W. The basic setup Scott Mac pretty much nailed -- Stock 88 10th Anniv top-mount IC (Trey Cobb's old core to be exact) jacketted to hold water and running 0.5" OD lines, then switched to 1" ID lines), running to a Daihatsu Charade .6L engine radiator, then back to tank. The pump I currently use is a RULE 1000gph bilge pump submersed in the tank. The tank is constructed of fibreglass matte based on the layout of the storage bin. It has a hole for air breathing as well as a 4" PVC cap for putting ice and water in.

I haven't used the system in quite awhile per the top-mount core's welds splitting, shooting water out like a Super Soaker 3000 (Better than my neighbour's kid's water gun) all over the place. Kinda embarassing at the track, too, when you fire up the pump and soak the guys in front of you.

Part of the reason why I've been so lucky with dyno and power results I believe is because of this superior intercooling. At just 5lbs of boost, I can dyno 300hp to the drive wheels and run high 12's on street tires right at 110mph. I attribute it to how the engine is built, the sizing of the turbo (especially turbine housing), and the great A2W intercooling.

For anyone endeavouring to give this a whirl, I highly recommend it. You don't necessarily have to use the stock top-mount core like I did but it's nonetheless a very fun and entertaining project to work on. Also a hoot to watch work. =)

Regards,

B

Icemark

hey BDC,

On that bilge pump, are you running it 100% duty cycle then or just when there is positive manifold pressure???

UniqueTII

I bet you could adjust the voltage to the pump with the boost sensor voltage.

Icemark

Yeah I was thinking that or a simple vacuum sensor... not any reason to cool when not under boost I am assuming.

jimmyv13

Hmmm....

This doesn't sound extremely hard to do. What kind of 1" ID lines are running to the radiator, the pump, and back to the IC? Are they insulated?

What size is the radiator and where exactly is it, same place as a FMIC?

Scott 89t2

sure you do. so when you hit boost, the water is as cold as posible. the water gets heated up while on boost, and cools down while off boost. you need the pump running to cool the water down while off boost that's why I said for long boosting, you want as much water as possible.