CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Ok, i am going to be doing my engine swap and wiring in a wolfv4 starting sunday. On pg 44 of the instalation manual for the wolf it talks about multi-coil ignitions for rotary engines and there wiring. There is a side note mentioning that

"We (wolf) strongly recommend using one coil pack per sparkplug in all rotary applications. This is because of the high-energy requirement placed on ignition systems used on rotary engines. Dual Output coils, although having a high secondary voltage, are biased to one of their outputs, causing one output to have weaker spark than the other."

Just looking at the wiring diagram for 4 individual coil packs and the wiring on the coil's makes me belive that this would be an extra 2 min of wiring, so that I am not worried about

I was wondering though if there is a downside to using 2 trailing coil packs? Are they weaker than the leading coil pack etc?

-Jacob

ilike2eatricers

Interesting. Wouldnt an MSD box help fix the problem?

Kingofl337

Buy a 4 pack of MSD Blaster Coils

wpgrexx

you should check out the electromotive coil setup. very nice 4 coils. Grass roots motorsports used it in their rotary spitfire

bdrx-7

i would like 2 no 2 wouldn't it b better 2 get something like a MSD ign cuz i can get one 4 me for dirt cheap

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

I know it would be cheap to buy aftermarket coils, but i have a few sets of good coils, nobody has ever attempted this?

-Jacob

NZConvertible

We already have one coil/ignitor per trailing spark plug, so I presume you mean replacing the leading coil with two seperate ones (thread title says trailing). I've seen many cars make a lot of power on the stock coils without probs, so unless you're aiming for really big power I wouldn't be too concerned.

White_FC

I guess it really depends on wether or not the Wolf V4 is setup for using two leading ignitors or one? Or has it got just one 'trigger' output that you can daisy chain external ignitors off? .. sorry i don't know squat about the Wolf ECU's..

If you have the option, you might aswell run dual leading ignitors/coils.. IMHO.

(having said that i'm running the stock leading coil.. )

RETed

1) I dunno how you're going to adapt the "trailing pack" to the leadings?
Do you realize that the trailing coil pack uses one signal channel and one toggle channel.
Does the Wolf3D has some kinda control to handle running the toggle on the leadings?

2) Running single coils on the leadings does not guarantee you retain the wastespark "far trailing" spark that cleans up the combustion chamber.
Does the Wolf3D explicitly state you keep this extra spark?


-Ted

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

The online version of the manual i am quoting this from is here

http://wolfems.com/products/enginema...nstallshortcut

Pg's 44-45 (ill upload screenshots of the diagrams also)

From what i understand of wolf's wiring dagram, there is no 'toggle channel' output from wolf to either set of coils. Wolf simply runs one ING output to each coil (one to each trailing ignotor, and 1 to the leading pack)


Im pretty sure judging by the wiring diagram that i would retain the wastespark running 2 seperate coils because the ING output that goes the the leading coil is simply split and run to both seperate leading coils

Isnt the leading coil the duel output single coil? I only say that because the trailing coil is 2 seperate coils and the leading is one large unit. Am I wrong?

I have a feeling that there is a bunch of confusion as to what i am trying to so

So the first attachment is what i would wire if i used the stock coil/ignitor configuration with the wolf

The second attachment is what I am wondering if i can do using 2 <b>TRAILING</b> coil packs. Again i say trailing because from looking at them visualy it looks as if the trailing is 2 seperate coil's, and the leading is one single coil with output's to both leading plug's

-Jacob

White_FC

Ok basically you can´t use the trailing ´pack´ at all....
You could use the coils, but you need after market ignitors, probably bosch ones.

for the leading it would appear that you COULD use the stock ignitor/coil combo.
OR you could divide the signal, like i thought earlier, to power two seperate ignitors and two separate coils.
but for the trailing, since the wolf has two outputs, one for each coil you cannot use the stock trailing ignitor. You need two seperate ones.

RETed

If this is true, you can't use the stock trailing toggle ignition coil pack at all?

That is correct.
It's called a "dual tower" coil, so it's a single input that fires off two spark plugs at the same time.




-Ted

Kenteth

Can you guys just quickly correct me if I'm wrong, Leadings fire simulatnoisouly, and the trailing fire independantly. And... why?

RETed

Try search for those rotary engine simulations that show the ignition firing correctly.
That wastespark'd leading fires as a "far trailing", so each rotor face actually sees three sparks on combustion!

You can't do this with the trailings; if you did, the wastespark'd trailing will fire too early in the other rotor.


-Ted

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Im not sure, I am using the wiring diagram from this post

https://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php...54&postcount=1

There are 2 wires to the trailing pack, im not thamliar with what these actualy go to 100% though so i cannot say 'its right'



As for the ignitors, this is the first i have hurd of needing an aftermarket ignitor for the trailing coil pack, I guess ill call around to find out about this. It doesnt mention that the wolf cannot use the pack anywhere in the manual. With the rotary specific diagram it gives with the leading and trailing packs, If it wasnt compadiable you would think they would mention something

-Jacob

Kenteth

and thereby trying to push the rotor the opp direction/? makes sense.

White_FC

CrackHeadMel, just call your wolf dealer that your bought the ECU from and ask them if your ECU is setup to fire the stock trailing ignitor/coil or two aftermarket ignitors/coils.

White_FC

Okie with about 2secs of searching, "The only problem i can see is the ignitor, but thats an easy fix with the bosch 2 channel one. "
that was from 'Fatty_FC3S' in https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showthread.php?p=3359183 that thread.

RETed

Bingo...


-Ted

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Is that as specific as i need to be when i go to a parts counter? a bosch 2 channel ignitor?

-Jacob

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

NM, i found the wiring and the part number for the reccomended bosch ignitor

Its here on page 5

http://wolfems.com//freestyler/gui/f...20Tech%205.PDF

totallimmortal

this thread makes my head hurt

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Hey mine too


I wasnt able to find the ignitor. I went to VW and they had one similar however it had 2 plug's and 4 more spade connectors than the one reccomended. they also wanted $327. After that I went to the only auto parts store in my area that anybody knew that sold bosch ignitors. They were able to bring up listing for the reccomended bosch 200 however it was a special order and he couldnt get me a time frame, or a price untill it came in. He did however tell me it was a porsche ignitor and a porsche dealer might have one instock (i can only imagin how much that is going to be)

Being that I coulnt find the reccomended ignitor at a cost i can afford, can i run 2 single channel ignitors?

-Jacob

Net Seven

iTrader: (5)

Yes this is correct, you cant use the stock trailing ignitor. I called up Chris (wolfems dealer) and he told me to just disconnect mine for now and run just the leading, til I get an ignitor for my trailing.

I took the CAS out and was spinning it by hand and watching the sparks, the ones comming out of the leading coil were very strong and looked good. I had the tailing wired up same way as you would a haltech, but the spark was very very weak and wasnt as often as the leading spark.

Anyone see anything horribly bad about not running the trailing spark for now, while I get myself an ignitor? Chris told me its fine and they used to run them that way back in the day all the time.

CrackHeadMel

iTrader: (2)

Could that be why i was getting an error count while trying to start my car today?

-Jacob