5 lug to 4 lug conversion
I wish I was driving!
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: BC, Canada
Originally Posted by daviddeep
Scathcart, aren't the 5-lug rear brakes (in S4 cars or S5s with 4-piston front brakes) also vented versus solid rotors? You'd think that would be an improvement in terms of fade.
I wish I was driving!
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 5,241
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From: BC, Canada
Originally Posted by RockLobster
BZZZZ.
From alot of experience I can say they are quite different systems. The 5-lug 4 piston front vented rear setup is far superior to the non-vented 4 lug or even the single piston 5 lug.
My grandmother could tell the difference on the street (and she is dead!). I can tell the difference on the track because I like having brakes going into turn one at 140.
Also there is a big difference between the 90GTU brakes and the S4 4lug setups. The 5lug single piston is like having a big brake kit compared with the 4-lug.
The biggest difference is in the heat disipation of the 4lug vs the 4piston in the front and the vented vs non-vented in the rear. And the vented rear setups have calipers with far superior heat dispation. Sure the pad size is the same but the whole setup disipates heat far better. FAR from identical.
I read some where many years ago that the 4 lug was a carried over 323 setup to save costs.
From alot of experience I can say they are quite different systems. The 5-lug 4 piston front vented rear setup is far superior to the non-vented 4 lug or even the single piston 5 lug.
My grandmother could tell the difference on the street (and she is dead!). I can tell the difference on the track because I like having brakes going into turn one at 140.
Also there is a big difference between the 90GTU brakes and the S4 4lug setups. The 5lug single piston is like having a big brake kit compared with the 4-lug.
The biggest difference is in the heat disipation of the 4lug vs the 4piston in the front and the vented vs non-vented in the rear. And the vented rear setups have calipers with far superior heat dispation. Sure the pad size is the same but the whole setup disipates heat far better. FAR from identical.
I read some where many years ago that the 4 lug was a carried over 323 setup to save costs.
I also find it funny that you think the 5 lug single piston cars stop SOOO much better than the S4 set-up. The systems are identical, save a slightly smaller rotor diameter in the front. Above all this, the S5 cars have an additional 200 lbs to them... does this not account for anything? Stopping distances, with equal pads and equal tires, are better for the S4 in my testing. (virtually identical conditions to above, cars had similar options)
Tell me when you've failed to be able to lock up single piston brakes in street driving. I can do it with BFG KD's (245 front, 275 rear), and you won't find better street legal dry traction than those tires... so if the single piston brakes still provide more braking torque than the tires can provide, what difference does an upgraded caliper do?
If fade is a problem, improve brake ducting. You act as though fade is so significantly worse on an single piston caliper.
Honestly, I doubt anyone in this thread making these comparions has done any real testing themselves. Hell, I doubt any of you has even bothered to do any of the braking torque calculation differences between the two set-ups. Its pretty obvious.
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Joined: Aug 2003
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From: bay area
in spirited driving the fade difference does matter a lot between the single piston and 4 piston. My friend had a single piston gtu and i have a 4 piston gxl, even with a heavier car, i dont fade much after about 15 minutes of driving, the brakes start to smell and the fade is a slight pad fade. My friend on the other hand has fluid boil and nearly flies off the road at the end and gets pad fade much sooner than i do. He swapped to 4 piston asap and has no more problems.
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Joined: Sep 2003
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From: BC, Canada
Well ducting will help fade, so will larger rotors, and vented rotors. The 4 pot 5 lug setup with ducting will provide the best fade resistance. The rear brakes can be a liability at the track. At Pacific Raceways last fall I faded my solid rear rotor single piston 5 lug brakes, but not the 4 pot fronts (didn't get the rears in time to change them before the track day).
Originally Posted by TehMonkay
So Mazda stuck with the 4 piston calipers and brake rotor diameters on the FD from the FC, why? Maybe because it works really well?
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Joined: Nov 2006
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From: Seaside, CA
1. Most braking is done with the front brakes so switching the rear, which isn't that big of a difference anyways, doesn't really mess anything up. Also the fact that I own a lighter S4 and want a realtively small and light weight wheel reduces the need for the "better" 5 lug system.
2. Just because I'd like my car to have wheels that look the way I want them to doesn't make me a ricer. It's not like I'm going to dumb up my car with stupid pimp my ride style accesories.
3. And yeah I know there are more styles available for 5 lugs but I like certain old school JDM ones that only come in 4 lug.
2. Just because I'd like my car to have wheels that look the way I want them to doesn't make me a ricer. It's not like I'm going to dumb up my car with stupid pimp my ride style accesories.
3. And yeah I know there are more styles available for 5 lugs but I like certain old school JDM ones that only come in 4 lug.
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Joined: Nov 2006
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From: Seaside, CA
Plus my brother in law is letting me use his radials on the strip and he has an accord. Although my ride is no where near being track ready i'd like to save a few bucks by sharing tires with him.
Drive.
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,676
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From: Washington, North Carolina
....probably one of the silliest ideas I've heard in awhile on this forum. I can almost guarantee whatever 4lug wheel you're looking at you can find something that looks identical to it in 5lug (except the extra hole of course.....but yea ...i'm the last one to call ricer on somebody...but this seems extremely ricerific.
BUY WHEEL ADAPTER PLATES IF YOU WANT 4 LUG, or get the precious wheels your willing to lose braking for RE-drilled, or make more money so you can afford wheels the fit other than a set off your honda your coveting, let go
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Joined: Nov 2006
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From: Seaside, CA
The Work Wheels Equip 01, Equip 03 or even Drag DR 20's only come in 4 lug. But you know what dude you guys can think what I want is ricer or completely retarded because they're your opinions and your entitled to them. However I don't go around smashing on your idea's or aspirations so why the hell are you F*#$ing with mine? There's no reason for it but to make asses out of yourselves so just stop.
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