13b carb options ?
11-20-09, 08:01 PM
#1
13b carb options ?
hey , my fuel injection system is on its way out 
its injecting way too much fuel , untill you cant open your eyes with out watering. i tried adjusting the leaner or richer **** (or whatever you call it lol ) to no avail i also replaced it which also did not work . and i do not want to spend 1000's of dollars on it so , my buddy recommended i get carbs for it instead. i saw some kits for sale like the side draft ones, but they are also 1000- 1200 . is there any less expensive (excluding fuel pump and other whatnots )? what do you guys recommend in the way of carbs to cut expenses down ? oh by the way my 7 is a 87 n.a if that helps ?
its injecting way too much fuel , untill you cant open your eyes with out watering. i tried adjusting the leaner or richer **** (or whatever you call it lol ) to no avail i also replaced it which also did not work . and i do not want to spend 1000's of dollars on it so , my buddy recommended i get carbs for it instead. i saw some kits for sale like the side draft ones, but they are also 1000- 1200 . is there any less expensive (excluding fuel pump and other whatnots )? what do you guys recommend in the way of carbs to cut expenses down ? oh by the way my 7 is a 87 n.a if that helps ?
11-20-09, 08:56 PM
#2
It means 12A all ways^
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HAHA. Carbs... Just take your injectors out and have them professionaly cleaned by these guys. Will at least make a big difference.
http://www.cruzinperformance.com/
http://www.cruzinperformance.com/
11-20-09, 09:20 PM
#3
Buy yourself a $10 multimeter and start testing your sensors. It could be as simple as a bad temp sensor telling your ECU that the car is never warmed up so it runs it rich. The fact you're getting fuel makes me think easy fix.
Carbs suck. It is very seldom that a carb will perform better than injection. If it does, it isn't because its doing a better job mixing fuel and air, its about system design and class rules if there are any.
Carbs suck. It is very seldom that a carb will perform better than injection. If it does, it isn't because its doing a better job mixing fuel and air, its about system design and class rules if there are any.
11-21-09, 12:18 AM
#4
see , its much easier with a carb , i know people are going to disagree but i rather get under my hood and replace a mechanical part instead of trying to figure out what sensor or whats wrong with my ecu ( e.g re solder) . and a bonus is that it cleans up most of your engine bay .
11-22-09, 10:42 AM
#6
Engine, Not Motor
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see , its much easier with a carb , i know people are going to disagree but i rather get under my hood and replace a mechanical part instead of trying to figure out what sensor or whats wrong with my ecu ( e.g re solder) . and a bonus is that it cleans up most of your engine bay .
Ignorance is not an excuse to "simplify" a system because an complex system is not understood. There is little to figure out with the OEM EFI system. It is all laid out in the FSM and troubleshooting it amounts to checking sensors with a meter in a logical way. Half the time, it ends up being nothing more then a bad TPS and/or dirty injectors.
This whole "cleaning the engine bay" is something that I will never understand. So we sacrifice mileage, drivability, midrange torque, idle control and several other important factors in making a car work well to make the engine bay look a little less crowded? Exactly how much time are people spending under their hoods trying to fix problems that they need the area to be less crowded?
At any rate, we just went through this in another thread:
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showthread.php?t=873971
11-22-09, 12:09 PM
#7
sorry let me clear this up, first off i forgot to mention me and mark ( aka theory on the forum) spent almost a whole day trying to set up the tps properly and fix the problem why it runs rich ( we did not fix both ) lol . second the guy that had the car before me CUT everything and did not solder it (thankfully all the connections were in the right spot) except for when he cut the bac valve connector and solder it to the fuel injection wire to use for the fuel injection .
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11-22-09, 02:46 PM
#8
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sorry let me clear this up, first off i forgot to mention me and mark ( aka theory on the forum) spent almost a whole day trying to set up the tps properly and fix the problem why it runs rich ( we did not fix both ) lol . second the guy that had the car before me CUT everything and did not solder it (thankfully all the connections were in the right spot) except for when he cut the bac valve connector and solder it to the fuel injection wire to use for the fuel injection .
For comparison:
Racing Beat Holley Kit
http://www.racingbeat.com
$960 USD Carb Kit
$19 USD Holley Choke Control Cable
$15 USD Holley Choke Cable Mounting Bracket
$175 USD Mallory 4070M Fuel Pump
$105 USD Mallory Fuel Regulator
Labor: Replace intake hard parts, reconfigure fuel system.
Tuning: Requires a carb parts kit, will not stay in tune during weather or altitude changes, no ignition tuning possible.
Tuning Tools: No datalogging, no gauges.
Pass Emissions Test: No (Must sell the car if moving to an area with emissions testing)
Potential: Racing Beat recommends only for non-ported NA engines up to 180hp.
Microtech LT8s
http://microtechefi.com
$1,000 USD LT8s
($180 USD Hand Controller - Not required if you have a laptop computer)
($450 USD Dash Unit - Optional type of hand controller with a better display)
($100 USD ECU Datalogging - Not required if you have a laptop computer)
Labor: Rewire about 21 leads and hook up 1 vacuum tube.
Tuning: Fuel tuning is pretty much the same as a carb but with no extra parts required, will stay in tune during weather or altitude changes, 16 ignition tuning points accurate to 0.25 degrees.
Tuning Tools: Datalogging available, laptop display includes real time MAP, AFR, timing, injector output, TPS, water temp, air temp, battery voltage, 3D mapping, diagnostic data, etc.
Pass Emissions Test: Optional
Potential: Will work with any type of porting on a 12A or13B Series 4 crank setup using Series 4 coil packs. The stock LT8s will work on engines running up to 25psi boost.
LT8 for sale in Canada asking $675:
https://www.rx7club.com/canadian-sale-wanted-classifieds-120/microtech-lt-8-a-821623/
11-22-09, 05:53 PM
#9
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I'm not picking on you specifically, but your post is a good example of something that really is flawed thinking.
Ignorance is not an excuse to "simplify" a system because an complex system is not understood. There is little to figure out with the OEM EFI system. It is all laid out in the FSM and troubleshooting it amounts to checking sensors with a meter in a logical way. Half the time, it ends up being nothing more then a bad TPS and/or dirty injectors.
This whole "cleaning the engine bay" is something that I will never understand. So we sacrifice mileage, drivability, midrange torque, idle control and several other important factors in making a car work well to make the engine bay look a little less crowded? Exactly how much time are people spending under their hoods trying to fix problems that they need the area to be less crowded?
At any rate, we just went through this in another thread:
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showthread.php?t=873971
Ignorance is not an excuse to "simplify" a system because an complex system is not understood. There is little to figure out with the OEM EFI system. It is all laid out in the FSM and troubleshooting it amounts to checking sensors with a meter in a logical way. Half the time, it ends up being nothing more then a bad TPS and/or dirty injectors.
This whole "cleaning the engine bay" is something that I will never understand. So we sacrifice mileage, drivability, midrange torque, idle control and several other important factors in making a car work well to make the engine bay look a little less crowded? Exactly how much time are people spending under their hoods trying to fix problems that they need the area to be less crowded?
At any rate, we just went through this in another thread:
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showthread.php?t=873971
I will attempt to address everyone in this one post. I have to agree with Aaron on this one.
As a mechanic with 15 years experience, I try to find out what caused the problem first. This is just good troubleshooting. All the mechanics I see these days are simply parts re-placers. What skills are involved there?
Why downgrade to a carbed setup? If they were better, than why are there no new cars with them. Hell, lawnmower engines are going efi.
If you were to properly troubleshoot and repair the problems, you will be rewarded by performance and mileage.
Bottom line... don't half *** it. Just do it right and do it once.
11-22-09, 10:20 PM
#10
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I will attempt to address everyone in this one post. I have to agree with Aaron on this one.
As a mechanic with 15 years experience, I try to find out what caused the problem first. This is just good troubleshooting. All the mechanics I see these days are simply parts re-placers. What skills are involved there?
Why downgrade to a carbed setup? If they were better, than why are there no new cars with them. Hell, lawnmower engines are going efi.
If you were to properly troubleshoot and repair the problems, you will be rewarded by performance and mileage.
Bottom line... don't half *** it. Just do it right and do it once.
As a mechanic with 15 years experience, I try to find out what caused the problem first. This is just good troubleshooting. All the mechanics I see these days are simply parts re-placers. What skills are involved there?
Why downgrade to a carbed setup? If they were better, than why are there no new cars with them. Hell, lawnmower engines are going efi.
If you were to properly troubleshoot and repair the problems, you will be rewarded by performance and mileage.
Bottom line... don't half *** it. Just do it right and do it once.
New cars dont have carbs because of fuel economy, in other country's new cars still use carbs.
11-23-09, 02:36 AM
#12
The Doctor
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Oh great, another one of these threads. You know, if you used the search button, their was a thread not even a week ago about the same SH*T.
https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/racing-beat-holley-carb-conversion-kit-873971/
Long story short:
Yes, EFI is superior to carb. You can't argue with a computer that is mathematically doing everything perfect.
The only thing that helps the carb's is that most of their intake manifolds are short runners and bigger ports, therefor opening up the peak hp rpm range.
Game over, end of story, end of thread. Use search button.
https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/racing-beat-holley-carb-conversion-kit-873971/
Long story short:
Yes, EFI is superior to carb. You can't argue with a computer that is mathematically doing everything perfect.
The only thing that helps the carb's is that most of their intake manifolds are short runners and bigger ports, therefor opening up the peak hp rpm range.
Game over, end of story, end of thread. Use search button.
11-23-09, 05:29 PM
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11-23-09, 05:42 PM
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Banned. I got OWNED!!!
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