dantheman

iTrader: (4)

The funny part is when they touch the cap right after that and burn their hand. :P

I also loved it when someone would pop a resistor and do the same thing.

Matty's first 1st Gen

Hey Kent,

I bought a bunch of resistors to put make the changes you mentioned in the last few posts, One question is what kind of diode should i go for, I wasn't sure so i just bought a Zener Diode 12V 1W. Will this diode work, or should i be looking for something completely differnent. I have a board i made that mimics your v 2 auto switching board, with some rigging up and soldering, I shouldn't have any problems making it function like the V2.1 pulse limiting board, Correct? Also where should i place the capacitors for the ICs?
ha, maybe i'm getting in over my head, but i'm giving it my best shot, Thanks so much, Matt

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Hey Matt,

Looks pretty good. I am not sure how easy it would be to modify to act like V2.1. There is a fair number of changes in the routing of the traces at each IC. If you would like, I can try to layout a single sided design of the V2.1 board. It may require a few jumper connections to make it work. I can even add the new modifications to the design. I will be adding the new modifications anyway fo the next batch that I will do after I return to the US. The diodes should be a general purpose rectifier type (1N4001 or similar). The Zener isn't what we really want. The main purpose of the diodes is to prevent reverse current flow through the regulator. Reverse current can kill the regulator almost instantly.

The caps for the ICs go as close to the ICs as possible (right at the pins is best). You want to connect the capacitor between the power pin and the ground pin. It helps to stabilize the voltage during switching and helps with noise.

Anyway, I should have some time this weekend to try to make a single sided layout for you.

Kent

Matty's first 1st Gen

Thanks so much kent, You're the man!

Rob Stolz

Yeah I read a little more on that, how much you charge for a TT curcate because I am interested. Does anyone have any dino test results of these ignition set ups or comments on how it improved power and gas milage. Im going to start looking for a second gen coil. Thats all you need right? a second gen coil and the TT curcuit. How much you figure it would cost to ship to saskatchewan by the way??

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Rob: I will send you info on pricing and such. Currently, I think that all of the boards may be spoken for, but I am putting together a waiting list in case someone changes their mind. I will probably do another batch when I get back to the US in a couple months (October or so).

Paul and Rob from Australia did some dyno testing. There isn't a big gain. They were seeing like 1-2 hp gain. A lot of the gain depends on how well the car is tuned now and how good the current ignition setup is. The TT does rev better and works better in the higher RPM range where the stock ignition starts dying off. There are some guys that reported a 2-3 MPG gain. Go back on this thread to Sept/Oct 2005 and you should see some reports.

All you need is the 2nd gen leading coil and the circuit. Possibly some wiring terminals and such depending how you want to install it. For the shipping, I am just doing a flat rate. It is easiest. There isn't much diffference in shipping costs to Canada compared to the US as the circuit is pretty light. I also ship USPS, so you don't have to deal with those large fees charged by UPS/FEDEX.

I have Dom's circuit nearly ready to go. I need to find something to clean the flux off and it will go out tomorrow night after work.

Kentetsu

Kent- Let me know if you still need a volunteer for testing. Now that I've got my system running correctly again, I'd be in good shape to do this for you. Just let me know if you need me for anything. Thanks for all of your work on this project. I still say that this is by far the best "bang for the buck" that we currently have for FB mods.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Hey Ken,

That would be great. The more people, the better. That way results happen faster if one person doesn't have time to test and will help separate issues that may be related to the car/installation and not the circuit itself. You just would need the assembled board (no box), correct? I can attach the wires that get modified (power, and ground). You can then use the other wires and box from the current installation. Since you have that heatsink, you could probably get away with a bit larger for R2. However, increasing beyond some point adds no performance and just stresses the ignitor. One the bench, 27k to 30k for R2 look good. We will have to see how they perform in the car and adjust accordingly.

Kent

Kentetsu

Kent- I'm a little hesitant to tear apart my unit since we are well into the Autocross season and would like to have a "known good" unit that I can fall back on if the test unit is having issues. However, if you were able to send me a complete unit I would be more than happy to return it to you after testing (perfectly happy with my current TT unit).

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

No problem, Ken. I can send you the box and all. Do you need the ignitor connector? Just trying to make sure I have enough boxes and connectors for the number of boards. I had to estimate on the boxes and connectors because I didn't have good numbers on how many people would be upgrading their old TT (no need for box and connector since they already have one). Anyway, I think that I may have a box left from the last GB that you can use. I will have to check the numbers on the connectors.

Kentetsu

Connectors are not a problem, I can rig that if I need to...

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Ken: I found a box for you. It looks like I don't have an extra connectors, though. I wish that I did. I don't even have a connector on my old TT box as I stole it to put on someone's box from the last GB.

I have Dom's box ready to go. It will ship tomorrow after I get off work. I will prepare Kentetsu's box this weekend and likely ship Monday. This way we can have you both testing at the same time.

Thanks for the help testing, guys. Hopefully the timing/advance will all wok correctly and we will only need to experiment with R2 for heat vs. performance.

Kent

Rob Stolz

Is there a simpler way I can wire in the second gen coil for direct fire to get some kind of performance for the time being or is the only way to make dgcdfis to work is with the transistor trick?

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Rob: Yes, you can do this: https://www.rx7club.com/1st-gen-archive-71/electrical-easy-2nd-gen-direct-fire-install-20-minutes-398818/ This was the common upgrade before the TT. It is still a good and simple upgrade. It is basically just replacing the coil (uses the stock 1st gen ignitor to fire it). The problem is that these instructions tell you to remove the 2nd gen ignitor. If you do, then you can't do the TT.

Check this thread as well: https://www.rx7club.com/1st-gen-archive-71/ignition-2gcdfis-diagram-correct-502148/ I listed how you can do the regular 2GCDFIS without cutting the wires. This way you can easily switch to the TT later.

Rob Stolz

ic, is there any kind of gain from this. Also How good is the msd? Thanks a lot.

Kentetsu

Yes, there will be a performance gain. This is what I used prior to getting the TT unit. It is definitely worth while doing this until you are able to obtain the TT. MSD is good too, but then your talking some real $$$

Unsupa

iTrader: (2)

can i get in line for a TT box?

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Sure thing. I already have you on the list, actually. You have a spot in this batch if you still want one. I basically went through my pm box and the thread and listed eveyone that expressed interest. I hope that I got everyone that asked. Anyway, I figured that if people then changed their mind, someone else could always take their place.

I just shipped Dom's circuit out. Hopefully he should get it the end of next week. Otherwise it will probably the week after sometime. I should be able to ship Kentetsu's on Monday.

Rob Stolz

Alright I am going to phone some auto wreckers right now. I should ask for the leading ignition coil off a mazda rx7 86-92? Is that all?

dj55b

iTrader: (2)

ya that will be everything ... if you can get the lines too it would also be good. just because they're longer, unless you plan on doing custom wires.

MattG

iTrader: (2)

Awesome! Any guess to the ship date?

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Hard to say exactly. If things work well with Dom and Ken, it will be soon. Hopefully everything will work well and they will just have to try a couple different resistors for R2 to get the best performance vs. coil heating. I can't wait to hear the results myself. The setup throws some nice sparks on the bench, though. I should put up some pics of what the 2nd gen coil can do.

- Kent

MattG

iTrader: (2)

Yes, Do it!

H4Inf

Hi all,

I just picked up all the components necessary today, enough for Rob and my cars, I don't think Rob has got time until another week has passed- I might pull my circuit out and make the modifications tonight and give it a test tomorrow :-) Looking forward to it, will keep you updated.

Paul.

H4Inf

ok I got all the components and couldnt bare to stare at them with excitement building, so I have already put them into the circuit and done multiple tests on the car.

R2: 27k 1% tolerance 0.25W
R3: 5.6k 1% tolerance 0.25W
0.33uF Electrolytic capacitor running across the power input
0.082uF Capacitors across the power of each IC (back)
Diode between In and Out of Vreg (back) IN4007
Additional ground from GND to Vreg tab
Diode inline with power input to board IN4007



With this setup I found that timing was retarded by I think about 4cm from the needle when I started the car at idle - this differs from our first TT with R2 in that this time it did not retard as much initially - as before we could hardly see the timing marks, they are now seen clearly.

The other problem is that the ignition retards as I increase the rpm.

It sounds like a very worked V12 engine when idling :P (I'm testing it at about 8pm here, and after turning it off I could hear my neighbours kids crying across the road... they prefer the smooth rotary sound)

Sooooo..... I have disconnected R2 again and the timing now advances the right way. The pulley marks seem to jump around less as well - they do not move so far.

I would be interested for Sam to double check that his timing is advancing with increased RPM (if standing on the side of the car with stock coils, the marks should move away from you as you increase rpm). If they are indeed moving that way, could we get some photos of your entire setup to see if we can trace what's wrong with mine..

Any other thoughts would be great



Cheers

Paul.