dean23

i have a q for anybody that miight know... if i plug that white plug from the tt to the trailing ignitor. wat will hapen??

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Hey Dean,

Sorry I haven't gotten back to you yet. Been super busy. I have had a look at the pic. I just need to download the wiring diagram on this computer (real slow connection). I just need to verify that the wiring is the same. If it is backwards, you will kill the 1st gen ignitor. We need to be sure before going further.

Kent

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Just a quick update. I have built and shipped all circuits to those who have said they wanted this version. If you wanted one, you should have either received it already or have a pm saying it is on the way. If you still want one, there is a bit more time, but I will probably be shipping my tools back next weekend. I can build a few in early October when I return to the US, but then I will be moving across country. That means it will be late October/ early November by the time I can do more.

Anyway, MattG is going to experiment with the extra ballast resistor to see about solving the heating issue. Once we have a good value, I can order the appropriate resistor and send them out to those who need one.

MattG

iTrader: (2)

Right you are Kent,

I am warming up the soldering Iron, as we speak. I still have a few things I need to do to the car, but I will get those taken care of, so I can begin to test.

MattG

iTrader: (2)

Ok, well I got the new resistor installed

Here is kents plan to add a extra 1ohm resistor to help the over heating problem


So I went to Radio Shack and picked one up. Well it didnt fit in the spot like we hoped becuase the wires came out on the ends and not on the top like the one in the Coil already.

So I did a lil drilling and got it to do just that. Well it was still to close for my liking.


So I put it at the bottom of the coil, and put some heatshrink on it to make sure it didnt touch.

I got a lil close with the heat gun on the yellow one lol.

I got a lil more work to do on my car before I can start to test it, but Working on this kinda has a lit a fire under my butt.

I will keep you updated

H4Inf

Hey Matt, that looks great - I can't wait to hear how you go! Good luck!!

DJAngelicon

That looks great. I can not wait to start a project soon with that. I hoping I can get my hand on a second gen coil pack so I can then order the part from kent.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Looking good, Matt. Matt is using a resistor that has a power rating of 10W, while the stock resistor is rated at 5W. That is why it is so much larger. Once we have a good resistance, I can track down some resistors that will fit in that side spot with the leads coming out of the bottom instead of the ends. My original plan was to just replace the stock resistor with one of a higher value. I found some this style, but they didn't have that metal mounting tab. The tab appears to have come as part of that resistor. If you remove the resistor, it says the manufacturer, resistance, and power rating (5W, 0.35 Ohm). Having a high power rating on the resistor we are adding is probably a good idea. The metal tab on the stock resistor helps transfer heat away and effectively increases its power rating.

When we have a good resistor that will fit where we want it, we should see about using some thermal epoxy or something to help with heat transfer.

Angel: I am sending you a pm now.

Kentetsu

Maybe the resistor should be mounted externally to aid in heat dissipation?

H4Inf

been a while since anyone posted, and i am getting tired of driving around on stock ignition after my ignitor/coil burnt out lol.. so im in search of a new coilpack (in australia) and i have just pulled apart my old ignitor.

looking at the design.. from what i can tell, ALL the heat comes from that resistor... why dont we drill some holes through the casing of the ignitor base and run high-temp cased wires through there and out to some sort of external heatsink device, instead of putting more heat into the area where the ignitor is..? (as kentetsu pointed out)

i opened up the ignitor component, and its about 5000 times more complicated than i thought it would be :P the whole circuit is covered in this thick jelly, that returns to its old shape after you stop messing with it, im guessing to aid in heat disipation perhaps..

ive included some pics here for all to enjoy:

high res here: http://www.pw.cx/rx7files/tt/tt_2gig...nside_650k.jpg 650 kb


high res here: http://www.pw.cx/rx7files/tt/tt_2gig...istor_404k.jpg 404 kb

you can see the discolouration on the wire casing, plus the surface of the wire itself is a bit crazy - rainbow like, which generally indicates its been getting hot..

driving's just not the same without the TT

cheers,

Paul.

Kentetsu

I agree, stock ignition sucks. After having the ignitor burn out twice in two weeks, both times shortly before a race, I've had to revert to stock and there is just no comparison. One thing that I've wanted to check but haven't yet, is whether the ignitor burned out or the resisitor. Its probably the ignitor, but it would be nice if my failures only involved the resistor because at least that would/should be replaceable.

How much longer until we see the "real thing" Kent? My car will be going into the garage for the winter soon, but by spring I'll have to have my TT back or I'll just go crazy.

H4Inf

interesting you bring this up! i just put a multimeter across the contacts of my severed resistor, and cant get a reading at all... i would think this implies that the resistor is dead. i dont know how to test the ignitor, and i must admit it was fun poking my finger around in the jelly substance covering it... should still work :P (have heard that they call this a potted circuit).

i should get a resistor and put that in see if it does the trick. kentetsu- you should get a multimeter onto your old resistors and see if they still resist or are completely dead.
note: resistance between the 2 wires going into the coil (black part on top) is 0.7 ohms. - according to the manual this is good. coil resistance should be 0.2 to 1 ohm

measuring resistances on the ignitor.
1.6 k between B and IGT
0.95k IGT to the plate its mounted on (gnd)

im not sure anyone knows exactly how the ignitor works, but maybe theres a way to test that.. however perhaps if the resistor blows that means current is forced to go somewhere it shouldnt.. hmm. anyone got any ideas?

Paul.

Dom

If the resistor blows it acts like a switch in the off position and current does not flow at all anywhere.

Problem is, what was it doing just before it blew. (shorting out and sending too much current???)

Kentetsu

I will check this out...

H4Inf

hmm im guessing the resistor blew because of something going wrong in the ignitor. i replaced the resistor in mine with 2x 1ohm resistors in parallel (so 0.5ohm effectively) and she wouldnt run ill install these new resistors into a new coil once i find one..

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Hey guys,

Thanks for the pics, Paul. I am now back in the USA. I will be running down to my mom's tomorrow to get some tools and stuff. I am going to rebuild the GSL-SE engine before my move to the East Coast. Before I do that, I will do some tests with the TT. My plan is to use the coolant temp sensor from a spare engine and measure resistance and compare to the resistance/temperature curve of the sensor. I will run a bunch of different resistances to compare the coil back temp vs. resistance. The temp should always decrease with increasing resistance. We need to just determine the optimum value. We want the resistance high enough to keep temps low, but low enough to keep performance high...

I figure the J-109s see about coolant temp. So, I guess that could be a reference. If we can get operation below say 180 F for long periods of idleing, we should be good. That will give a good starting point that we can tweek higher or lower depending on performance/lifetime we find.

I will keep you guys posted. It is good to be back...

Paul: The stock resistor is 0.35 Ohm, 5W. I think adding 0.5 Ohm or 1 Ohm should do the trick.

Kent

jarath

How bout a high speed CPU fan attached?

Kentetsu

Kent- it seems to be popular opinion that the problem occurs at idle, but why do you suppose that every one of my units seem to have been nonfunctioning following high speed runs (15 + minutes at 90+)? Anyone else seeing this?

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

I have not heard of this happening. Mostly it seems that it is during idle that tends to kill. Though, I suppose the failure may not happen at once. Perhaps that massive heat generated at idle could weaken the ignitor and then the failure just happens later. Anyway, I would recommend adding say a 1 Ohm, 10W resistor like Matt was trying. That should help the problem.

MattG

iTrader: (2)

Yes, Now that I have my pinto down here to drive around town and back and forth to school. I can start to work on the 7. My problem was that I needed my 7 for everyday use.

Right now im focused on getting my wideband install done. I am having problems with it reading the RPM's correctly, but thats a different story.

I will try to by the end of next week get my coil pack installed.

Kentetsu

I just tested one of my "blown" coil packs. The resistor has zero continuity. This will be great if when it blew it didn't trash the ignitor too. Hmmm.

Kent, is there any chance that, rather than adding another resistor, I could simply put one bigger one in? What size would I need to do this? I'll try just replacing the bad resistor in my last pack and see if she'll run...

H4Inf

im wondering why is the resistor blown. Kent might be able to help us out here, I havent got my head around the way the ignitor works with the coil and balast resistor yet.

There are 2 options. (assuming Kentetsu's ignitor is dead too like mine)
1. the resistor failed first, and this caused the ignitor to fail too
2. the ignitor failed first, killing the resistor

Someone with more know-how on this topic should be able to tell us which... but the failure of whichever went first was probably caused by too much heat/fatigue.

Kentetsu: I just tried replacing the dead resistor with 2 1ohms in parallel (making 0.5 ohm of resistance), and found it did not work. You could just put a similar setup in place and see how it goes. Mine looked like this (because I thought it was all dead so just cut all the wires initially to pull it apart):



PS. I'm still trying to find a coil/ignitor pack.. if anyone has one lying around i'd be happy to pay for postage to get one. From what I can tell, there are a lot more of these readily available in the states - im in Australia and only found one guy who wants about AU$150 for his 2nd hand.. wreckers have a similar price.

Kentetsu

Those are some pretty outragoues prices man. Ebay maybe?

Anyway, I just dug out a resistor from my old 240Z ingition setup. I have no idea what size it is, but I'm going to try it in my system to see if it brings it back to life. If that doesn't work, then I'll probably be of the opinion that the ignitor failed along with the resistor. I'll let you guys know what I find out, when I have the time to try this.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Interesting. If the resistor has no continuity, that would suggest that the internal winding in the resistor is broken. If this is the case, you would not get spark (the ignitor may be okay). If you want, you can remove the old resistor and just replace with one of greater resistance. I would try a 1 Ohm resistor. 2 1 Ohm in parallel will also work, but the temperatures may still be too high. When checking resistance of the resistor, it can be a bit tricky since the resistance is so low (0.35 Ohm). Some meters will not measure this correctly.

It will still be a while until I can test. I sent my 2nd gen coil pack and stuff from France before I left, but it has not gotten here yet. As soon as it does, I will start testing.

Paul: I can pick you up a 2nd gen pack and ship it over to you. I will see what I can find. If you want, I could send you mine once I test and then I will just get another for myself.

Kent

Kentetsu

Okay, here's an update. I tore down two "blown" coil packs and took a good look at them both. In one case, the resistor was blown, but in the other case it was still good (which, presumably means that the ignitor was blown).

Black wires leading to resistor = resistor blown (and possible the ignitor too, don't know yet).

Tan wires leading to resistor = resistor good, but unit bad (ignitor?)

I took the good resistor and put it into the pack with the (hopefully) good ignitor. I'll try to install it again this weekend and see if it lives... I'll let you guys know the results.