FC steering rack in 84 GSL?
Thread Starter
mad scientist
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,665
Likes: 2
From: Savannah, GA
FC steering rack in 84 GSL?
Can this be done, relatively easily? I just got an 84 GSL and the steering is horrible, but I have an rack from my 89 GTU thats just sitting in my garage not being used. Think it will fit?
Last edited by mazdaspeed7; Sep 30, 2001 at 06:55 PM.
Thread Starter
mad scientist
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,665
Likes: 2
From: Savannah, GA
Well, I am going check into it more this week. I can do all of the fabrication, so it wont cost too much. I really like the feel of the FC steering racks, esp since the steering rack on the GSL is very loose, and I think it needs to be replaced anyways.
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Old [Sch|F]ool
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 12,862
Likes: 568
From: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
I've heard of people swapping in the complete FC from crossmember... that way you not only get an R&P setup (woohoo!) but you also get 4x4.5" bolt circle big brakes (base model) or 5x4.5" bolt circle HUGE brakes (GXL/Turbo) which is the same pattern that most Fords have had, for when you have a Ford 9" or 8.8" rearend stuffed in the rear. 
It also has a true control arm suspension, as opposed to our strut rod type setup which has its upsides but the strut rod bushing has to be floppy or it will bind up when the suspension tries to move. (Of course there are plenty of nice expensive ways to prevent the binding)
One downside of the FC swap, again from what I've heard, is that although it's apparently not as hard as one would think, the stock FC springs and struts suspension really alter the ride height. I think it jacks the car up by a couple inches...
And then you have to figure out a way to mount the engine! Although I think that is remedied by using an FC engine with its center-housing mounted, uh, mounts. Oh Darn.
- PJ (Ain't done it but heard plenty 'bout it)
It also has a true control arm suspension, as opposed to our strut rod type setup which has its upsides but the strut rod bushing has to be floppy or it will bind up when the suspension tries to move. (Of course there are plenty of nice expensive ways to prevent the binding)One downside of the FC swap, again from what I've heard, is that although it's apparently not as hard as one would think, the stock FC springs and struts suspension really alter the ride height. I think it jacks the car up by a couple inches...
And then you have to figure out a way to mount the engine! Although I think that is remedied by using an FC engine with its center-housing mounted, uh, mounts. Oh Darn.
- PJ (Ain't done it but heard plenty 'bout it)
Old [Sch|F]ool
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 12,862
Likes: 568
From: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Oh yeah... forgot to add... (as usual)
You'd be better off "blueprinting" the steering system. What I mean is, first things first, make sure all the tie-rod ends don't have play, the ball-joints don't have play, the idler arm bushings (VERY common to go bad) are ok, even the control arm bushings will make a difference. And then there is the possibility of adjusting the gearbox, which I always advise against unless you are SURE that you know what you are doing... IE adjust the gearbox to spec, don't make it tighter until it "feels right" because "feels right" is usually on the FAR TOO TIGHT side of the spec range because the play is usually elsewhere from what the adjuster actually does! (Bad bushings, etc.)
When I got the '80 I thought the steering was WONDERFUL. Very direct, not overly heavy, not numb, and definitely not sloppy. My only complaint being that the wheel is too small and far away, so I have to drive straight-armed with little leverage against it. But that's an ergonomic fault not a steering fault. Anyway. Recently it started to feel.... different. I'd "shake down" the front end at least once a week, trying to find out what the problem was. I changed the rear link bushings. I screwed with shocks. I altered the tires and the pressures I run. I diddled with the alignment till I was blue in the face. Nothing. Finally a few weeks ago, we were able to detect some play in two specific places, the right inner tie rod end and the left control arm bushing. The play is minimal, but "minimal is significant" when it comes to steering and suspension. I can't find the parts anywhere locally though... !!!
You'd be better off "blueprinting" the steering system. What I mean is, first things first, make sure all the tie-rod ends don't have play, the ball-joints don't have play, the idler arm bushings (VERY common to go bad) are ok, even the control arm bushings will make a difference. And then there is the possibility of adjusting the gearbox, which I always advise against unless you are SURE that you know what you are doing... IE adjust the gearbox to spec, don't make it tighter until it "feels right" because "feels right" is usually on the FAR TOO TIGHT side of the spec range because the play is usually elsewhere from what the adjuster actually does! (Bad bushings, etc.)
When I got the '80 I thought the steering was WONDERFUL. Very direct, not overly heavy, not numb, and definitely not sloppy. My only complaint being that the wheel is too small and far away, so I have to drive straight-armed with little leverage against it. But that's an ergonomic fault not a steering fault. Anyway. Recently it started to feel.... different. I'd "shake down" the front end at least once a week, trying to find out what the problem was. I changed the rear link bushings. I screwed with shocks. I altered the tires and the pressures I run. I diddled with the alignment till I was blue in the face. Nothing. Finally a few weeks ago, we were able to detect some play in two specific places, the right inner tie rod end and the left control arm bushing. The play is minimal, but "minimal is significant" when it comes to steering and suspension. I can't find the parts anywhere locally though... !!!
8krpm is not enough
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 422
Likes: 2
From: Upstate NY
Originally posted by peejay
I've heard of people swapping in the complete FC from crossmember... that way you not only get an R&P setup (woohoo!) but you also get 4x4.5" bolt circle big brakes (base model) or 5x4.5" bolt circle HUGE brakes (GXL/Turbo) which is the same pattern that most Fords have had, for when you have a Ford 9" or 8.8" rearend stuffed in the rear. It also has a true control arm suspension, as opposed to our strut rod type setup which has its upsides but the strut rod bushing has to be floppy or it will bind up when the suspension tries to move. (Of course there are plenty of nice expensive ways to prevent the binding)
One downside of the FC swap, again from what I've heard, is that although it's apparently not as hard as one would think, the stock FC springs and struts suspension really alter the ride height. I think it jacks the car up by a couple inches...
And then you have to figure out a way to mount the engine! Although I think that is remedied by using an FC engine with its center-housing mounted, uh, mounts. Oh Darn.
- PJ (Ain't done it but heard plenty 'bout it)
I've heard of people swapping in the complete FC from crossmember... that way you not only get an R&P setup (woohoo!) but you also get 4x4.5" bolt circle big brakes (base model) or 5x4.5" bolt circle HUGE brakes (GXL/Turbo) which is the same pattern that most Fords have had, for when you have a Ford 9" or 8.8" rearend stuffed in the rear.
It also has a true control arm suspension, as opposed to our strut rod type setup which has its upsides but the strut rod bushing has to be floppy or it will bind up when the suspension tries to move. (Of course there are plenty of nice expensive ways to prevent the binding)One downside of the FC swap, again from what I've heard, is that although it's apparently not as hard as one would think, the stock FC springs and struts suspension really alter the ride height. I think it jacks the car up by a couple inches...
And then you have to figure out a way to mount the engine! Although I think that is remedied by using an FC engine with its center-housing mounted, uh, mounts. Oh Darn.
- PJ (Ain't done it but heard plenty 'bout it)
Plus the rack and peanut ( *grin* ) steering is a plus.--matt
Thread Starter
mad scientist
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,665
Likes: 2
From: Savannah, GA
Ive looked at the car, and I still plan on doing the swap. Heres what Im going to do: GSL-SE hubs and brakes/rotors in the back, 2nd gen 4 bolt hubs in the front, custom subframe for the steering rack. I am going to use a GSL-SE front cover so i can keep the front engine mount for my 13BT that will be going in. Not having the FC's middle engine mount will leave more room for the turbo there, and I might be able put the engine a little lower in the in the car. I dont think I will need the 4 POT brakes, this car will be very light. Its my toy, so I dont need to worry about every day creature comforts. As for the ride height in the front, I will have some new strut tops machined, which should drop the car about an inch. If I need any more, I will just get GC coilovers.
that will be going in. Not having the FC's middle engine mount will leave more room for the turbo there, and I might be able put the engine a little lower in the in the car. I dont think I will need the 4 POT brakes, this car will be very light. Its my toy, so I dont need to worry about every day creature comforts. As for the ride height in the front, I will have some new strut tops machined, which should drop the car about an inch. If I need any more, I will just get GC coilovers.
Thread Starter
mad scientist
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,665
Likes: 2
From: Savannah, GA
Thats what I said before. FC hubs in the front, GSL-SE hubs in the rear. They have the same bolt pattern(the 4 lug Fc's), and I will have to use FC struts with that.
Mounting the steering rack wont be that hard. Theres a crossmember right behind where the rack should go, so it would be easy to bolt on a custom subframe for the steering rack only.
Mounting the steering rack wont be that hard. Theres a crossmember right behind where the rack should go, so it would be easy to bolt on a custom subframe for the steering rack only.
Admitted Sevenaholic
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,910
Likes: 0
From: Ashland, OH
If you can get it to work, I think this would be a great upgrade.
In fact if you can get it to work, I'd do it in a heartbeat but I'd bolt the 5 lug version in and the 4 piston calipers, I don't mind having 5 lug up front and 4 in the rear
In fact if you can get it to work, I'd do it in a heartbeat but I'd bolt the 5 lug version in and the 4 piston calipers, I don't mind having 5 lug up front and 4 in the rear
8krpm is not enough
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 422
Likes: 2
From: Upstate NY
hell yeah dude. I'd bet that stick me straight into mod at auto-x tho... eeek, better find me a nice GSL I can turn into an ESP race car or I'll be trying to out corner that Triumph TR7 with a 13BT that shoots fire and gets into boost....in reverse....
<shudder>
--matt
<shudder>
--matt