saltyslug

Hey I have the 12a engine in my 66 vw baja. Well I am down to starting it and it just won't start. I have done all the deflooding procedures and the mmo also. It was freshly rebuilt before my friend wiped out the car(not even 3000 miles yet. The wiring is in check and sparks well. It turns over at 700rpm when its trying to start. This is using the stock vw starter. Do I need to get the 6volt starter to get it to turn faster? let me know what you guys think, thanks.

OneRotor

iTrader: (3)

if it turns over at 700rpm and won't fire, check the plugs for spark. you may have weak spark or extremely fouled plugs. normal starters turn at like 250rpm, which is about the recommended number of revs for compression tests.

saltyslug

It has a good spark, the plugs are the type that have 4 prongs so it does not need any gapping. I checked it and it fires on all four plug wires. The plugs as well. 250rpm??? that sounds low.

aussiesmg

iTrader: (1)

Are you getting fuel? Disconnect the incoming line at the carb and crank the engine, fuel should pour out the line.

Steve

OneRotor

iTrader: (3)

a-men to that one

saltyslug

yeah, even tried starting fluid. I have a seperate switch for my pump. Tried it both ways, with pump and no pump on. It is a side draft 45dcoe weber. I have heard people using 6volt vw starters and some not needing them. hmmmmmmm?????

aussiesmg

iTrader: (1)

If I am reading this right the engine is cranking so the starter shouldn't be the issue. You state you have spark at the plugs and fuel at the carb, is that right?

Steve

saltyslug

yeah, fuel and spark for sure. I have no exhaust bolted to the flang, and I am getting a couple flames poppin out the exhaust holes.

aussiesmg

iTrader: (1)

Remove the plugs and see if they are wet looking, if so dry them with brake cleaner, I suspect its flooded.

saltyslug

I have done that several times over the last few days.

aussiesmg

iTrader: (1)

Your spark may be weak, can you test the strength, it definately sounds like a flooding issue

saltyslug

I have a arch tester. I will find out tomorrow how wide the arch will jump. The spark plugs were arching a white thick spark across them. It was cool cause they would jump across all four of the prongs(not at the same time though), looks like it works like they say.

d0ntdreamit

are the plugs wet amd oily after a failed start attempt?

Any chance that the plugs are connected in the wrong order to the distribitor?

Is the carb getting gasoline? Is gasoline vapor getting into the firing chamber, check for gasoline smell on the plugs.

I like poring 1/8 cup of 100 % methanol, methyl alcohol, ethyl alcohol, isopropanol, or dry gas straiht down the carb and then try starting. This can be used to wash out a flooded chamber. To do so, remove plugs and crank.

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

I've had a problem trying to start fresh rebuilds, with untuned carbs and constantly foul/wet the plugs. More often than not, brake clean will not freshen the plugs enough. I give them a quick shot in the bead blast cabinet, then brake clean and compressed. They fire right up then. This happens on brand new plugs too.

skrewloose78

you mentioned 6 volt starter. is the entire system 6 volt?if so are you using stock rx7 coils or 6 volt coils? did you pull the distributor during installation? is the firing order and timing right?

bliffle

Just as with boingers, you need fuel, compression and spark. Sounds like fuel is OK. Make sure you have compression: should get some nice whooshes out the spark plug holes, like a boinger. Sometimes those apex seals might require a little encouragement by shooting some MMO or other oil in thru the plug holes. Most starting problems are ignition related. Start with good plugs (NGK BR9EQ14 are the old reliables, tho some guys swear by Autolite 2626, if anything else be sure they are right for the rotary so they don't stick out into the combustion chamber and clip the apex seals, in which case you get to do another rebuild). The rotary system is 12volt so you're asking for trouble with 6volt: sounds like your primary and secondary joltage will be halved. In that case the coil joltage isn't enough to fire over the big 0.60 pre-gap on those plugs, tho you might be able to use old points gapped plugs (0.30) for the old points system, like for the 79 RX-7 or the REPU, etc., I think they're NGK BR7 or something like that. Make sure your ignition is static timed at TDC and wires aren't crossed.

B

saltyslug

I am going to get another set of new plugs. these have been cleaned about twelve times now. The car is 12 volt. Guys that have put them in bugs say they use a 6 volt starter on 12 volts cause it will spin thestarter motor faster to help it start easier. I never took out the distributer, it worked great for my friends rx7(with a stock nikki). I did change the dist cap and rotor.

saltyslug

holy ****!!!!!! she fired!!!!!!!!!!! I just pupmed the **** outta her and held it wide open for a few seconds(10-15 and it popped off. So I pumped again and held and she fired. There is about 10 little kids in the neighborhood and they all freacked out and ran. Neighbors were slammin doors shut and my ears feel like they did the next day after a zombie concert. I have no exhaust at all. Now its time to fab some mufflers. Woot Woot, Yeaaaaaah. There was enough smoke that it filled up the whole neighborhood, hahaha.

saltyslug

blap

bliffle

Out of the dim recesses of my memory i seem to recall someone saying that the rotary needs a little backpressure in the exhaust to run right. Just a vague recollection.

Those plug gaps are 0.060 and 0.030, incidentally, not 0.60 (more than half an inch!) and 0.30. And that's the second time I've posted it off by a factor of ten!

B

saltyslug

no exhaust at all, just a flang. I need some bends to make my own pipes. What muffler is small and quiets well? I went out this morning and tapped the gas 3 times and fired it and she popped right off and held a 1000rpm idle. I need mufflers. They need to be small.

bliffle

I'd be tempted to use an after-market header like Racing Beat (I once got one on eBay for < $100) rather than fab it, and a stainless steel muffler.

B