ray green

iTrader: (14)

And I trusted you on this Ken, so I recommended to my friend Greg that he do it your way, without the resistor, because he didn't have room, with all his power this and that filling up the engine well, to fit it in with the base.

That was several months ago, it's worked perfectly from the moment we put the + and - wires on it, no problem with the ignitors.

Simple is better.

Ray

Ilum

Hey guys, I have to tell you I am feeling really sheepish this morning. I started the car and it sputtered out almost right away. I restarted it and it ran for a few minutes before stalling. I restarted it a 3rd time and held the rpms at 1500 for a few minutes and let it down and it was fine.

Similar experience when I went to lunch.

What have I learned from this today? That the engine was cold when it was having problems. Like last night, if the engine is already warm it works perfectly. Obviously something needs to be adjusted... I was joking with my coworkers about installing a manual choke to resolve the issue. Really, I am at a loss at what needs to be adjusted since it doesn't have this problem when it is cold and running on the dist. cap.

Anyone got ideas of what it might be or needs to be adjusted? The car is an 85 GSL-SE with a Pineapple Streetported 13B 6-port in it.

85 FB

Have you checked out the FSM link? It might give you a helping hand for that problem.

http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/rx7/manuals.html

FBsliderseven

iTrader: (2)

anyone know if i could do this w/ a msd setup?

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Depends. How do you have the MSD set up? If you are just firing a single stock leading coil through the dizzy cap, then no. If you are using the MSD to trigger a coil like the FC one or a pair of stockers (not firing through the cap), then yes, you can move all trailing wires over to leading on the cap.

FBsliderseven

iTrader: (2)

so if i have the msd firing 2 coils (to the spark plugs) and running the trailing off of the dizzy i can swap them.
sorry for thread jacking..

Ilum

Yup, it is only when the car is cold.

85 FB: Thanks, I just looked at the FSM briefly and there is alot of info there. I am thinking of buying a printed copy.

What I don't get is this is only a problem when I am using the 2nd Gen Coil. Does anyone have any ideas of why this would be? It might help me figure out where to begin looking...

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Did you try to switch back to stock to see if the problem really is only with the 2nd gen coil?

Ilum

I thought I did this past weekend. I will try it again tomorrow before starting up the car with the 2nd Gen just to be sure.

Ilum

I just tried the car, and it definately starts up fine on the distributer but not the 2nd gen coil when it is cold (about 10* F right now). I am really not sure of what to make of this. If it was both situations I would think it is the car, since it isn't could this be the 2nd gen coil?

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Few questions:
- Are you using 2nd gen wires or have you verified a good connection with the 1st gen wires?
- Have you verified that you are actually getting spark with the 2nd gen coil?

If those check out, perhaps it is that your ignitor is getting weak and is having trouble firing the 2nd gen coil, but is okay with the 1st gen one. It is fairly common for these ignitors to not work when cold and then start to work when the engine is warm. Usually you'll hear about this on the trailing side when people say that their tach is not working when it is cold. You could try to pull both ignitors off (the little black boxes on the distributor), clean the back of them, spread some heatsink compound on them (can get from RadioShack), and re-install. Perhaps your leading is not getting a good ground through the distributor. You can also swap the positions of the leading and trailing ignitors and see if the problem still occurs.

Kent

Ilum

Thanks Kent, I didn't think of swapping the ignitors. I'll try that when I get home from work. When I originally put the 2nd gen coil in I also cleaned up the back of the ignitors and used fresh heatsink compound I had left over from a computer build. I thought I was getting good spark, if I pull the cables out slowly I can hear what I thought was spark jumping to the cable, but I don't have a tester to check for spark. I did check that the cables are pushed in as far as they will go - fortunately I can move the boots on them. I am going to borrow a multimeter from a coworker to test the resistance of the wires as you previously mentioned. I am still thinking I may pick up some 2nd gen cables and try that as well.

If I remember correctly, the j-109's ground through the mounting screws correctly don't they? I don't remember on the trailing ignitor, but the leading one had one clean screw and the other looked, well for lack of a better term, nasty. Since the top screw looked clean I wasn't concerned that much, should I be?

I know I read a thread on using the GM HEI ignitors on 1st gens, is this something I should look at trying if swapping the ignitors doesn't yield better results?

Kentetsu

Just plug an old spark plug into the end of the cable, the other end connected to the coil. Crank it over and see if the plug fires or not. That will narrow the problem down a bit...

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

^ make sure that the body of the sparkplug is getting ground through the chassis (you can set it on the engine, inner fender, or whatever). Another option is to stick your finger in the coil post and have someone crank.

Ilum

Kentetsu: now that is a simple suggestion. I like simple, I will try that as soon as I get home. I wish I could say I had thought of that

Ilum

LOL. Kent, I think I will try the other methods before resorting to using my finger to test for spark.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

hehe. Well, you could get someone that you don't like very much to stick their finger in there. I'm sure you'll know right away if you have spark. Plus, no tools involved.

Ilum

hmmm... now I just need a volunteer to do this.

Kentetsu

Got a kid sister around?

Ilum

Kentetsu: Nope, I do have an older sister but she isn't that gullible.

Hey, I just wanted to take a minute and thank everyone that has contributed to helping me with this. It has been running steady for the last few days. It still fluctuates when it is really cold, but overall has been great. I am hoping that I will be able to do some testing tomorrow morning when it is really cold to see if I can narrow down what is happening with a cold startup.

Seems that most of my problems were the seating of the cables. So I am looking at getting some universal cables I can assemble my self and replace all of them and make sure they have a nice fit on the 2nd gen coil. I still don't get the cold start up problem but I have hopes that tomorrow will shed some light on this.

walken

iTrader: (6)

when I did this a couple months ago I couldn't get it to work at all with the resistor in place. so I removed it in a final desperation attempt and the car has been running flawless since.

Kentetsu

I have found that the most common failure on these units is a blown resistor. Since it appears that the resistor is not necessary for this mod, I would recommend taking that "weak link" right out of the system as I did.

When using the "transistor trick" unit, the resistor is (I believe) necessary. But I have blown both resistors and 2nd gen ignitors while using the TT unit.

Ilum

Kentetsu: is the TT worth building and putting in? Mine seems to be running great as is except when it is really cold outside... I have just been two busy to try and figure it out lately.

Kentetsu

The TT unit makes an incredible difference. Smooth idle, awesome power all the way to the redline (even with a worn out, low compression motor like I was running), and better gas mileage.

The version I have (not the newest, I believe) had a tendency to go through coil packs due to a) burning up the 2nd gen ignitor, or b) burning out the resistor. I had to revert to the standard 2nd gen coil mod mid summer due to a lack of replacement coil packs. I have since gone through my leftover parts, and since some of the coil packs had blown ignitors while others had just blown the resistor, I've been able to piece together enough parts to reinstall it (which will happen this spring).

Some members have had success adding another resistor to the circuit, which eliminates these issues. A little research, or a PM to GSL-SE ADDICT will probably tell you exactly what must be done.

I've always said that there is an incredible amount of power to be had by modifying the ignition system, and I really miss my TT...

If you have the time and ability to put one together, then I highly encourage you to do so. You won't regret it....

Ilum

I have read over the TT thread and another website that had info on it before I did this mod. I definitely tried to do my research first, I also read over the DLDFIS threads, Jeff20B's website, and a few threads on MSD and Jacob boxes prior to choosing the route I went. Actually it was because of the TT mod that I removed the ignitor the way I did. I just need to add a quick-disconnect to one wire and I can put the 2nd gen ignitor back in. I wanted to see how this mod worked out before doing anything more. If the TT is that good I may have to give it a go. My only concern is that the electronics course that I took was a very long time ago. Cars I can work on. Computers and networks I could probably do now in my sleep. I can even handle other people crises. Electronics... :shrug: I just wonder how many times I will have to try to get it right. A PM to GSL-SE ADDICT may be the easiest way for me to save money or parts. Thanks for the tip.