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I know it's cheaper and more powerful to turbo a 12A yourself, but does anyone have the j-spec 12AT engine in their cars? I was thinking about buying one from Corksport and having them put it in. Do I NEED an aftermarket ECU? I'm not the richest 20 year old, nor am I the most mechanically inclined, especially where forced induction is involved. I thought I read somewhere that the 12AT engine fits pretty easily into the SA22C engine bay. I figure a new fuel pump and regulator, and what else? I'm really interested in learning as much as I can about the 12AT motor and 12AT motor swaps into SA/FB cars. Thanks!
Well, you'll need a new pump and regulator. And if you plan on upgrading at all, you'll need a new fuel tank pickup. Check your fuel tank. If you have a drain plug, just put a fitting in it and use that as the fuel pickup, if not, then you gotta weld a new fitting in. You'll need a complete new custom exhaust. If you don't already have a gsl rearend, you'll really want one. Plus you'll need a new clutch. I got mine from southbendclutch.com If you get one from them, tell them you want a double sprung pressure plate and a full creamic disc, it'll keep the stock clutch pressure, but grip hard as hell, enough for 450-500ft/lbs. The 12aT engine should be a direct bolt in, but with a stock 12at, you won't make nearly as much power as a stock 12a motor with a custom TII turbo steup.
The 12aT is a good start, but if you want to run more than a 15/14, I'd plan on some serious upgrades right away. A stock 12a with a basic turbo setup rom a TII turbo should be in the high 13's withouth much extra work. So take your pick which one you want to do. But if I were you, I'd do a compression check on your stock 12a motor, and if it has good compression, I'l think about putting a turbo on that before you just drop in a 12aT motor.
Thanks a lot for the info. I have a GSL rear end and the clutch is less than 2000 miles old. Wouldn't it be a lot harder to just turbo the 12A? I have no idea how carbureted turbo engines work. Probably couldn't use the Nikki anymore.
from what i've seen most carbed turbos suck in their air threw the turbo just like any other turbo set up,and have a sealed hat that would replace your stock air cleaner so that the presurized air gets blown down threw the carb. some one corect me if i'm wrong but didn't the 12at from japan also have lighter weight lower compression rotors to handle boost. but this is comeing from a guy who has been a t2 owner for years and is just starting to get back into the first gen's after my dad brought 3 home a few weeks back.
12AT? Well i have a original 1.gen from Japan with that engine! The above statement is true, it has lower compression rotors than the standard 12A, so that it can handle the boost. Its also fuel injected, so you will need a ECU. The boost is originally really low, just 6psi. It hasnt got a intercooler either!
They were deciding between using a Haltech, not sure which model, or a Simple Digital Systems (SDS) EM-4 D based on price and availability. They were going to use a fuel only ECU and I think they said it would cost around $800. I believe they said Haltech discontinued their fuel only ECU so I think they went with SDS.
The 12A turbo engine is well engineered. Mine set up for everyday street use generates just over 210rwhp which gives a 1/4 mile time of 12.8-13 seconds but more importantly plenty of low down power starting from 1500rpm.
The critical improvements are:-
1. replace the ecu, I am using the Microtech LT4 as you only need a fuel only with the 12A Turbo boost controlled dizzy.
2. upgraded fuel pump, mine is Bosche
3. good exhaust system, a 2 1/2" pipe is sufficient
4. large front mounted intercooler.
There are numerous minor upgrades possible BOV, FMIC, High pressure clutch, Light steel flywheel etc depending on your budget.
With a large intercooler you can run 10-12psi without problems, this gives you 200rwhp on the stock turbo and porting with a very usable powerband from 1500-7000rpm with 750rpm idle.
I looked at options for more performance such as two more injectors, bigger turbo, porting etc, but came to the conclusion there are not worth while on a SA/FB. Fuel consumption would double and speeding fines triple. Top speed of 140mph is rarely usable as it is.
The 12A turbo engine is well engineered. Mine set up for everyday street use generates just over 210rwhp which gives a 1/4 mile time of 12.8-13 seconds but more importantly plenty of low down power starting from 1500rpm.
The critical improvements are:-
1. replace the ecu, I am using the Microtech LT4 as you only need a fuel only with the 12A Turbo boost controlled dizzy.
2. upgraded fuel pump, mine is Bosche
3. good exhaust system, a 2 1/2" pipe is sufficient
4. large front mounted intercooler.
There are numerous minor upgrades possible BOV, FMIC, High pressure clutch, Light steel flywheel etc depending on your budget.
With a large intercooler you can run 10-12psi without problems, this gives you 200rwhp on the stock turbo and porting with a very usable powerband from 1500-7000rpm with 750rpm idle.
I looked at options for more performance such as two more injectors, bigger turbo, porting etc, but came to the conclusion there are not worth while on a SA/FB. Fuel consumption would double and speeding fines triple. Top speed of 140mph is rarely usable as it is.
FBII- No, she is not gutted just a little lightning such as removing ac, airpump, rats nest, stock battery etc. The problem with comparing rwhp data is the difference in dynos used, which in this case were two different chassis dynos. The times however are accurate, and a better measurement of performance. Using a US power-1/4 time calculator gives nearer a theoritical 240rwhp. Acceleration is excellent to 100mph but falls off after that to the topspeed of 140mph due to the higher cd of a convertible. Might be faster with the roof on, but the low pressure is so great above 100 I am concerned the top will explode upwards.
Hondahater- have several photographs but still have not learnt to post them on the Forum. She is smooth rather than mean, that is a term which applies more to my Lotus 47 GT. a historic 2 door racing car from the late 60s.
A few months ago I purchased Matt McKinneys SA with the 12at above... It along with my SE are my daily drivers. The car sat over 5 years when I found it . who else here still has a a 12at
Hey, man - welcome aboard! That's a very unique SA22 you have there, and glad to see it's still burning up the roads. Take care, and I hope others chime in with various 12at rides,
I didn't read it as such; the new owner of this 12at car is chiming in that he bought it and its still going strong. Theyre rare enough that its interesting to hear that much,
I didn't read it as such; the new owner of this 12at car is chiming in that he bought it and its still going strong. Theyre rare enough that its interesting to hear that much,
Definitely not a newby I've been around along time just have not been on here in awhile. This car was on this thread above put together at Pineapple racing. Was just curious how many cars on this thread were still around. This thing sat over 5 years when I picked it up. This is my 7th 1st gen and I've had 2 verts. Currently have this and 85 GSLSE.
07-10-05, 01:18 PM
