Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

I'm always just spouting off

The boxster is fun but doesn't hold a candle to a moderately modded FD

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

370Z is only selling between 7k and 13k units these days. That's just a bit less than the last few years of Corvettes. These manufacturers have apparently figured out how to make low volume work.

If the FD had continued to sell 10k units each year like the first year instead of a few hundred, they'd have probably been fine. That was a user experience issue with shitty paint, shitty interior plastics, shitty dealers and shitty service. None of that is the rotary's fault.

Build your new RX7, EXPECT to sell 10k/year, and maybe amortize the costs a little better with an entry-level rotary/miata/hardtop/RX5, and offer a convertible too.

DriveFast7

iTrader: (1)

Exactly, make a new Rx-3. The Rx3-SP can have a turbo, stripe kit, and aero.

It just won't happen with this CEO though.

ZE Power MX6

iTrader: (157)

I think the brand matter more than performance to 90% of the buyer, doesn't matter how good of a sport car Mazda want to make, if the general public doesn't care about "Mazda" they are not going to look at it. I like Mazda and I had 4 at one point (3 now), but being a Mazda3 owner for 3 years I still don't know the power output of that car

When I talk to friends that are looking to buy a car, the top 2 things they list are # of door then brand name, they don't care for anything else. People that pick a car by performance/weight is far less than people that pick a car because of the brand.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

That Lemans car had an engine that was no-where near capable of being emissions legal to even consider something production based. The investment was to prove reliability under the most demanding conditions and nothing more. Also the Miata is what is what is. A light weight, cheap, reliable convertible sports car with a piston engine. That's it's foundation and that will never change. Just like you will NEVER see Mazda offer an Rx vehicle with a piston engine. Each vehicle has it's own design language.

neit_jnf

iTrader: (17)

and the 91 N/A was $18k which is nearly half the FD's starting price

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Fritz don't forget about the emissions standards the engine WILL have to deal with. We all keep talking about what Mazda could or should be doing right now. I'm sure Mazda can easily build what ptrhahn is suggesting. They could build the perfect chassis but, that means nothing if the engine wont meet the future standards.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

Those Audi LeMans diesel engines aren't exactly smog-legal either, but the way that Audi has been using their racing technology (and money) to develop those engines is the perfect, proven way to find the weak spot while squeezing every bit of potential out of them.

Now TDi is all over VW/Audi's lineup.

fmzambon

It just doesn't make sense.

The announcement that started this thread came from Nobuhiro Yamamoto, Mazda's sports car chief. A person in his position doesn't go around making unfounded statements like "the rotary is coming back in 2017". This, together with the fact that the announcement was repeated on Twitter as well (if I'm not mistaken), means that there's a very high chance that there really was the intention to do as stated. And that was before Mazda posted its first yearly profit since the beginning of the economic crisis.

But then, just as Mazda posted its first yearly profit with FY2012 and then revised its FY2013 net profit forecast from +70 to +100 billions of Yen, the new CEO comes ahead and says "no plans for now [for a new rotary]"?

I can only think of a single word to describe the CEO's announcement: BLUFF.

Besides, even if we have to take that statement literally, what does it mean? What does "for now" mean? No plans for the current year? for the current decade? What?

With the rotary 50th anniversary coming in 2017, the Rx-7 40th anniversary in 2018 and Mazda's 100th anniversary in 2020, I really think they WILL do something.

Andrea.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

True but to compete, Mazda had to run an engine in a port configuration that was no where near capable of passing a emissions test. That Lemans car would have gotten raped if it was an side port engine and not Full PP. You figure out a way to make a full PP rotary pass an emissions test, then you really got something unique to work with.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

I agree that this is a bluff. I feel they are just trying to take attention away from rotary development while they focus on the sky active vehicles they are developing. Their not trying to confuse the market. The rotary division is basically it's own division so who's to say they aren't secretly working in the background on the next rx? We all know the chassis will be shared with the next Miata. So when the Miata is finally introduced, the rotary division people will have what they need for a test mule. I know the Mazda 2 is next in line, then the Miata shortly afterwords, then the Cx9. That's 3 new vehicle releases over the next 3 years. That leaves the future Rx7 perfectly timmed for a 2017 release and more than enough time for me to start saving my pennies.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Well maybe it is rocket science but possibly over the last 20 years they've figured out a thing or two so here's to hoping mazda doesn't give up on the rotary and builds another RX7 that surpasses the last one and is a great car we will all be proud of

While they tinker with the rotary I recommend they STFU AND BUILD THE CAR and I will continue to enjoy the best sports car on the planet.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

I'm just gonna chime in because I've played with a Cayman or two at Laguna Seca.

Those things are fast. Put someone who can drive behind the wheel and a CaymanS is good for around 1:45 at LS, which is no slouch.
Definitely a car I'd drive someday.

RCCAZ 1

iTrader: (10)

Yes, and $63,800. If Mazda built a car at $45K that exceeded the Cayman S in performance, people would complain about the Mazda being too expensive and most on this board would "wait" for a used one instead of putting down our cash to support the brand. Just say'in....

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

A highly modded cayman is pretty fun car but again won't touch an RX7, GT3, GTR, ZO6 or any really fast car at any track.

A 1.45 at Laguna is slow. SSM track record is a 45 or 46

Fast is in the 30s.

Here I'm driving a track prepped Cayman S at summit point. Lap times are around 1.24 to 25s (I'm on old 888s). SSM lap record is a 28

My RX7 runs 18s.

Also wanted to add that any car you drive hard at the track will blow motors, having cooling issues, need better brakes etc...etc.... with 1 exception and that's the GT3 however you pay big money for that privilege. The cayman I was driving was leaking power steering badly because it easily overheats and damages the little plastic o rings and this car also had a PS cooler on it. The car needs about 10k in mods to really be worthy of a good pounding at the track.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Yep 65k for base model cayman S isn't cheap for the performance you get.

The camaro z28 is going to smoke it for 10k less.

As mentioned most of us, me included isn't going to buy a new RX7 that cost 60k unless it competes with the big block cars out of the box but if it does I'll buy two

fmzambon

Totally agree.

Besides, how many more piston engines does Mazda need? Currently they have a 1.5, a 2.0 and a 2.5 gas engines, plus the 2.2 diesel.
I heard they would introduce a smaller diesel (perhaps 1.6 liters or therabout) when the new cx-3 is announced, and maybe they could use a smaller gas engine for the Mazda 2, but that's about it.

And after that? Would they move straight to HCCI engines? I doubt it, which brings us back to the rotary. They could have part of their powertrain engineers working on the HCCI engines, while others could be moved to the rotary development team. When the next rotary is ready to go, they could switch back to piston engines, ready for the new generation of powerplants.

Going into the wild guess (or dream) territory, they could even use the rotary as an optional powerplant for other vehicles in the lineup: rather than having to make do with the 2.5 engine for the cx-9 and the speed 3 and 6 (or having to buy engines from some other maker for their "top" models), they could adapt the rotary for transverse mounting and offer it as an option in other models.
That way the rotary development costs get spread on a much larger number of engines, and Mazda could avoid the development cost of another high performance engine used by just a few models.
And they could even get to the mentioned 100000 units per year figure, which, by the way, sounds like bullshit to me.

P.S.: I'm already saving up for the new 7

Andrea.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

That was a bone stock CaymanS I was talking about and it was actually 1:41, but I hear you and agree. I like my FD better.

The 911GT3 did it in 1:38 or something. I wasn't really paying too much attention, but the CaymanS impressed me. It just seemed...planted compared to a lot of the other cars on the track.

Me: Butt dyno/not any kind of pro driver. My big huge experience is that I did Skip Barber a few years ago at Laguna. lol

RCCAZ 1

iTrader: (10)

I think that Mazda, combined with donations from this board, should sponsor Fritz on a U.S. Tour of all the best tracks driving his "lightly modded" FD. He could get a few practice sessions under his belt, than blast down some times on FRESH rubber just to see what a 20 year old car with 80 cubic inches could do !!!!

They could use the video of Fritz driving for their Ad Campaign just prior to their 2017 model year launch (i.e., Fall of 2016). Sounds exciting and I'm personally looking forward to the commercials. Aren't you Fritz???

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Yep Randy Pobst ran a 1.41 in a 2013. Typical good driver (instructor level) is likely running 1.43s to 45s on good rubber.

Put Randy in a nice track prepped FD and see what he can do

I like caymans they are cool sports cars but again if you want to go fast at the track it's not the right car. You can drop 50k in mods and still get blown away by a stock z06 or viper.

The FD I drive has really has basic mods. No more than 30k total invested and it can run with the big dogs in cars driven by semi pro level drivers.

HiWire

There must be someone at Mazda who remembers and appreciates the strengths of the FD. They did continue manufacturing it in declinining numbers until 2002 in Japan.

Now that the gentlemen's agreement on a maximum advertised horsepower of 276 is out the window, a lot of opportunities are open. After a few early missteps, Mazda's design language has been ironed out and the new Mazda 6 and Mazda 3 are good looking cars.

Ideally, the next RX-7 would be developed on its own no-compromise platform. I hope that they have listened to the market – the RX-7 needs to be a 2-door coupe, whether or not they'll try to fit baby seats in the back is up to them (I'd prefer storage bins).

Also on the plus side: most journalists have remarked on how well the RX-8 R3 handles. Obviously, someone at Mazda still knows their suspension design and tuning.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

LOL................I like the sponsorship idea

Seriously though there are still guys on this forum and many many more all over the place like fingerlock, shipnout etc.... out in CA running respectable laps in this 20 year old car against modern cars and guys like Pete, me, Brent and Eric c running around in the FD on the east coast. You don't see any other 20 year old cars on track with that kind of game on a consistent basis (especially with original engine). The only car that comes to mind for me is a really well prepped E30 m3 that runs around VIR (it has a v6 or possibly even a v8 in it and probably 100k invested) and it's a very quick car but outside of that I can't think of one.

Lets not forget about which car is still dominating autocrosses and mazda sits on the sidelines for 10 plus years leaking nonsense about the next RX7 it's trifling I tell you Takes the boy who cried wolf thing to whole new dimension. In the meantime guys in FDs go out each weekend and prove what a great car mazda built. If Mazda had given 1/2 the race support to the FD that the RX8 received it would be even more legendary........LOSERS!!!!!!!

PS Now that's some spouting off

HiWire

Let's not forget that the FD has a dominant place in its home territory as well... the RE Amemiya FD won the GT300 class in Japan's Super GT series in 2006 and they have won the Togue Monster trophy three times. FDs do a pretty good job in time attack and drifting everywhere, too, taking on the big-money AWD Evolution and WRX STI machines, among others.

Car Spotlight >> Re: Amemiya Rx-7 16 Years In Super Gt | Speedhunters

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

WTF is mazda waiting for. They won le mans w/ the rotary, the rx7/FC pretty much started the spec racing craze in the US, the FD dominated autocrossing for 10 years, today the FD is still competing on tracks all over the world 20 years following it's production date. Maybe I'm completely forgetting about some other car from the 90s that's still kicking *** as consistently as the FD but none come to mind.

BUILD THE DAMN car that you are capable of building and then send it to the track with full support and it will do more in the way of marketing/advertising than anything else you could possibly do.

There's no better marketing and advertising than introducing a proven product and it will do more for the entire line of cars than any zoom zoom slogan can.

Natey

iTrader: (19)

I sure had a lot of fun in my old 914.

A 914/6 is about the only other car that comes to MY mind that's really held it's edge over the (holy crap 40! ) years. I still see some quick ones. Like that guy in the E30, they're never anywhere near stock though.