Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Since the engine is blown in my 89 T2, I obviosly must rebuild. Ive heard to different stories here from two reputable engine rebuilders. The question is: What seals work best? 2mm or 3mm. Rick Rotary says yes do it because they are stronger and will last longer. The engine will be stronger in the end. Mazatriz says no. It wont make a difference. It only causes 50% more wear on the rotar housing. Also people dont mill the seal space properly. Who should I believe? What do you guys have in your engines?

rotary#10

iTrader: (38)

What are your goals for this car? Any increase over HP over the stock hp ?
Are you going to run a larger turbo? fuel injectors & or secondarys ? fuel pump? if you start opening up the exhaust or intake it would be highly recommended to have more fuel since you'll be making more boost. Im only asking since to protect your engine from leaning out.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Ya. I think I want to get it to a modest 300hp or so. I dont think Ill get a larger turbo. Ya. The exhaust will open up for sure. Also the intake. I guess this is the time to do all the home work. Mazdatrix was saying I can get that power with the 2mm. I dont know who believe. Haha. I think I would have to run larger injectors and a piggy back system cause I want to street port it too. May as well. Ive heard you cant get more power unless a street port is done. I was also thinking about boring the turbo out to avoid any turbo creap. It would be nice to get it track worthy as well as a daily driver.

ReZ311

iTrader: (4)

Stick with the stock 2mm apex seals. 3mm apex seals are known to cause chatter marks on the housings. High RPMs with 3mm apex seals destroys housings. Money would be better spent on ceramic apex seals, upgraded fuel system and a stand alone EMS.

minuteman7

EMS= Emergency Medical Services, in the case of an accident.


how much are apex seals btw?
the stock 2mm.

FD7KiD

iTrader: (8)

HAHAHAHAHAHAH........

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Ive heard that this is possible with the 3mm. Why would you say ceramic over steel? Is there some added benefit to ceramic?

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Thats funny. Oem at mazdatrix are $70. 30. They come in 2 piece and 3 piece. Aside from the obvious, What are the differences between the 3 piece and 2 piece anyone?

Ceramic are $300+. Im assuming thats for all 6 apex seals.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Ive thought of a stand alone system also. I kinda like the power fc from Apexi. Seems like you can do almost anything but turn your head light on with that thing. Haha. Ive gotta read up on it more though.

teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

The ceramic apex seals are $1800 for a complete set to do 2 rotors..

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

you got ripped off

DriveFast7

iTrader: (1)

3 piece is horrible and wear a groove in the rotors. And break more often.

2 piece stock Mazda is your best bet.

I make my own apex seals out of crushed Asahi beer cans.

ReZ311

iTrader: (4)

Just use pencil lead to replace the apex seal.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

I saw that. 1800 is a lot for seals. From what they tell me at maxdatrix they sound like they may be worth the price. They dont need to be replaced and they dont cause wear on the housing. Supposedly they are hard to break too. At least not as the steel does. Do you know where to get them for less than 1800? does anyone else for that matter?

stormshadow531

iTrader: (5)

+1 for 2mm seals. atkins sells cryo'd seal sets too. 3mm is overkill for 300hp.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE=stormshadow531;9997167]+1 for 2mm seals. atkins sells cryo'd seal sets too. 3mm is overkill for 300hp.[/

I think Ive heard heard of the cryod seal. What are they about?

-Crash-

Cryogenically treated apex seals, when you cryogenically treat metal it restructures the grain pattern and makes the metal denser, more uniform grain structure that allows heat to be dissipated more quickly and uniformly. This tighter molecular structure also increases strength, wear life, and fatigue life.

Mutaku

Just my 2 cents here. From my understanding 3 mm seals are used widely to help combat detonation. Running 3 mm over 2 mm seals for things like running high boost doesn't seem the common use, at least directly. In the end it all comes down to tuning and your setup. 3 mm wont stop your motor for getting blown due to a bad tune, but could help if you're tuning or have a fairly inexperienced tuner.

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

stop it!!! the more you worry about it, the more it will break. Just drive it like you stole it

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Hmmmmm. This sounds like an interesting option.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

This is what blew it up in the first place.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

So there is not much of a good reason to go with 3mm from what I can tell so far. What If e decide to get to more than 300hp later down the road? Will the 2mm ceramic or cryod hold up to say 350-380hp?(ust as an example)

Mutaku

Yes

Thats what I do. redline it 24/7.

stormshadow531

iTrader: (5)

i'm getting cryo'd seals for my build. crash and mutaku hit it on the button. getting the rotors milled correctly and the extra money for 3mm seals is not really logical for your application. if you're not trying to build a HP monster, you won't need it. it will be a good reliable upgrade as opposed to regular OEM seals. if you're anything like me, you just want it to last.

Linguo415

iTrader: (1)

Ya I want it to last and have fun mashing it too. I want a reliable Honda and Ford destrayer. Haha. I also want to get into some drift action. You dont exactly need a ton of power for that though.