Dynoed the new BNR Twins on Low Boost
08-23-04, 08:55 PM
#1
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Dynoed the new BNR Twins on Low Boost
Dynoed my R1 on a 100 degree day at Rotary Performance on August 9th. Chris was nice enough to squeeze me in for a last minute tune because I was driving the FD to NJ (a 1600 mile trip) the next day.
The car was on the dyno for the better part of 4 hours......the graph attached below is a 12 psi pull when the car was extremely heat soaked. Chris was confident that if we allowed the car to cool off and dynoed later in the day, 355 at 12 psi was doable.
Also, she put down 331 with the boost controller off, creeping to ~11 psi. These boost figures are as per the greddy peak/hold gauge; my PFC Commander typically shows 1 psi lower. Peak on the PFC commander was .75 on the dyno run attached, which equates to less than 11 psi.
I wanted to dyno for more boost, but Chris was exhausted from a hard weekend at Ennis and I didn't want to push things with a long trip the next day. Chris did a fantastic job tuning on short notice and with little sleep. As an aside, that night Ari rode with me back to Fort Worth, and he was impressed with the strong pull at such a low boost level.
Here are my relevant mods:
o Motor ported by yours truly, basically a Gotham Stage 2 streetport with a lot of ovrrlap and 2mm 2 piece OEM apex seals.
o BNR new turbos run in true parallel with all the stock seq stuff gone, to include cutting out the flapper door in the manifold. These are brand new CHRA's, along with the stock compressor and turbine housings extensively opened up to fit the larger wheels. As per Bryan at BNR, the shafts are 20% thicker (from 5mm to 6mm) and the compressor nuts are left-hand thread. Also, the exducer on the compressor wheels are a full 5mm larger than stock.
o Deleted Double Throttle, to include some serious porting and polishing of the UIM and LIM
o TB/UIM coolant bypass
o Gotham hardpipe kit with K&N filters
o Ceramiced downpipe, Gotham/Apneablue resonated midpipe, ancient PFS Catback
o M2/ASP Race Stock Mount Intercooler
o Deleted P/S and A/C, running only one of the stock main crank pulleys
o Jacobs FC1000 ignition amp with an FC leading coil and 9s all around
o 850s/1300s, Nippondenso fuel pump
o I am sure there is more, but I cannot think of it offhand
Looking to get some fine tuning and dyno at more boost sometime in the near future, it seems like a true uncorrected 400 to the ground on pump gas and street trim is a possibility (after I install my Aquamist 2d, hehe).
**Edit---a few more things: After about 3200 miles the turbos are not leaking a drop and are not smoking at all, which makes me very happy. I had a temporary oil smoke problem that was traced to improper crankcase ventilation, and it has since been resolved.
Other thing, on the dyno sheet the run was stopped at about 7500 rpms. On the street the cars pulls very hard right to the 8200 rpm rev limiter. When tuning for more boost I am going to make sure that the runs are made all the way to redline.
The car was on the dyno for the better part of 4 hours......the graph attached below is a 12 psi pull when the car was extremely heat soaked. Chris was confident that if we allowed the car to cool off and dynoed later in the day, 355 at 12 psi was doable.
Also, she put down 331 with the boost controller off, creeping to ~11 psi. These boost figures are as per the greddy peak/hold gauge; my PFC Commander typically shows 1 psi lower. Peak on the PFC commander was .75 on the dyno run attached, which equates to less than 11 psi.
I wanted to dyno for more boost, but Chris was exhausted from a hard weekend at Ennis and I didn't want to push things with a long trip the next day. Chris did a fantastic job tuning on short notice and with little sleep. As an aside, that night Ari rode with me back to Fort Worth, and he was impressed with the strong pull at such a low boost level.
Here are my relevant mods:
o Motor ported by yours truly, basically a Gotham Stage 2 streetport with a lot of ovrrlap and 2mm 2 piece OEM apex seals.
o BNR new turbos run in true parallel with all the stock seq stuff gone, to include cutting out the flapper door in the manifold. These are brand new CHRA's, along with the stock compressor and turbine housings extensively opened up to fit the larger wheels. As per Bryan at BNR, the shafts are 20% thicker (from 5mm to 6mm) and the compressor nuts are left-hand thread. Also, the exducer on the compressor wheels are a full 5mm larger than stock.
o Deleted Double Throttle, to include some serious porting and polishing of the UIM and LIM
o TB/UIM coolant bypass
o Gotham hardpipe kit with K&N filters
o Ceramiced downpipe, Gotham/Apneablue resonated midpipe, ancient PFS Catback
o M2/ASP Race Stock Mount Intercooler
o Deleted P/S and A/C, running only one of the stock main crank pulleys
o Jacobs FC1000 ignition amp with an FC leading coil and 9s all around
o 850s/1300s, Nippondenso fuel pump
o I am sure there is more, but I cannot think of it offhand
Looking to get some fine tuning and dyno at more boost sometime in the near future, it seems like a true uncorrected 400 to the ground on pump gas and street trim is a possibility (after I install my Aquamist 2d, hehe).
**Edit---a few more things: After about 3200 miles the turbos are not leaking a drop and are not smoking at all, which makes me very happy. I had a temporary oil smoke problem that was traced to improper crankcase ventilation, and it has since been resolved.
Other thing, on the dyno sheet the run was stopped at about 7500 rpms. On the street the cars pulls very hard right to the 8200 rpm rev limiter. When tuning for more boost I am going to make sure that the runs are made all the way to redline.
Last edited by GoodfellaFD3S; 08-23-04 at 09:03 PM.
08-23-04, 09:56 PM
#7
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08-23-04, 09:58 PM
#8
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Originally Posted by FD_Newb_1974
Well done Cap'n! What's up with the torque?
08-23-04, 10:13 PM
#9
Ahhhh...after much patience, the long-awaited results are in!!
Rich, I KNOW you're very happy w/ the results, considering the temps that day, and the low boost, and you're STILL making those kinds of #s!!! I can't wait to see what kind of hp you can make when you crank up the boost!
Bryan said the turbos don't hit their efficiency range UNTIL 17psi? How much psi are they good for???
Are these pretty much bolt on, or do they require any work to make them fit? And are these only available in parallel, or sequential as well? (Sorry for all the ?s lol)
~Ramy
Rich, I KNOW you're very happy w/ the results, considering the temps that day, and the low boost, and you're STILL making those kinds of #s!!! I can't wait to see what kind of hp you can make when you crank up the boost!
Bryan said the turbos don't hit their efficiency range UNTIL 17psi? How much psi are they good for???
Are these pretty much bolt on, or do they require any work to make them fit? And are these only available in parallel, or sequential as well? (Sorry for all the ?s lol)
~Ramy
08-23-04, 11:07 PM
#11
Weird Cat Man
08-24-04, 08:21 AM
#13
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
great numbers for that boost man. i would be friggen excited if i were you. Anyways...the torque curve looks strange...these are setup parallel right? how does spool time feel? any ideas on price? BnR must have some dyno runs under their belt before they start sellingn them...what are they seeing?
08-24-04, 09:54 AM
#14
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Originally Posted by matty
great numbers for that boost man. i would be friggen excited if i were you. Anyways...the torque curve looks strange...these are setup parallel right? how does spool time feel? any ideas on price? BnR must have some dyno runs under their belt before they start sellingn them...what are they seeing?
It's hard to compare them to the old stage 3s, b/c I almost always ran them at 15-18 psi.
Bryan doesnt have many sets out there; i may be the first with any kind of dyno #s. The actual CHRAs are a fairly known quantity, and have been making good power in a variety of applications for years now.
Rich
08-27-04, 03:55 AM
#15
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Good figures Rich 
have to confess mine didn't feel that powerful before my motor went pop, running 10psi it felt like a high 12 second car (12.7-12.8). Hopefully I'll get it back on the road before the end of the year and see how my numbers compare Should be good at 20psi 
have to confess mine didn't feel that powerful before my motor went pop, running 10psi it felt like a high 12 second car (12.7-12.8). Hopefully I'll get it back on the road before the end of the year and see how my numbers compare Should be good at 20psi
08-27-04, 09:33 AM
#18
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Originally Posted by Robertio
Good figures Rich have to confess mine didn't feel that powerful before my motor went pop, running 10psi it felt like a high 12 second car (12.7-12.8). Hopefully I'll get it back on the road before the end of the year and see how my numbers compare Should be good at 20psi
have to confess mine didn't feel that powerful before my motor went pop, running 10psi it felt like a high 12 second car (12.7-12.8). Hopefully I'll get it back on the road before the end of the year and see how my numbers compare Should be good at 20psi Rich
08-27-04, 09:35 AM
#19
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Originally Posted by FDNewbie
Robertio, you know Rich is talking about the brand new Stage III BNRs? There are very few sets out there...and I only know of Rich & Garfinkle as having them... so these are very diff than the old Stage IIIs...
08-27-04, 09:41 AM
#20
Originally Posted by GoodfellaFD3S
Bryan told me that there are about 10 sets out there, and I think one or two made their way outside the US, so it is possible he has the newer ones.
08-27-04, 11:02 AM
#21
Hey, where did my $$$ go?
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Yea, Robetio has the new style...as do I and a few other people but so far Rich is the only person to dyno them.
341rwhp @ .75 on the pfc is awesome...thats only 10.66psi of boost. I'd say on the same car, same boost level, same conditions these seem like they would make 40-50rwhp more than stock twins.....NICE!!!
Stephen
341rwhp @ .75 on the pfc is awesome...thats only 10.66psi of boost. I'd say on the same car, same boost level, same conditions these seem like they would make 40-50rwhp more than stock twins.....NICE!!!
Stephen
Last edited by SPOautos; 08-27-04 at 11:06 AM.
08-27-04, 05:15 PM
#23
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Originally Posted by FDNewbie
So Stephen/Rich, anyone lol...what #s do you think they're capable of making, based on Rich's dyno results? These twins are good for 20psi, right? This isn't something I'm gonna hold you to...just trying to get an idea.
08-27-04, 05:22 PM
#24
Originally Posted by GoodfellaFD3S
Bryan has told me in the past that the stock exhaust manifold limits power to the ~420 rwhp range. I think i can make that on the dyno on race gas, but for the street I honestly think I am going to stick to around one bar, which should be good for a solid 375. Just speculation at this point, of course......
08-27-04, 07:49 PM
#25
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Originally Posted by FDNewbie
375 is the magic "I can spank anyone on the road w/ this" #, eh?
.Let's make that, 375 is the magic "I can spank anyone on the road w/ this, and not crack apex seals like it's my job" #