dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

Right now a I have a set of street tires (Eagle F1) and autocross tires (v710s). I want to replace the F1s with a streetable tire that has more grip on the track than the F1s. I want something unshaved that can handle a little bit of rain safely through most of the tread life. Size is 245/45R16 or 225/50R16

Falken Azenis RT-615 - cheap, very streetable, track performance is ?? (I heard they grip best when cold, which is not good for track)

Bridgestone RE-01R - also cheap and streetable, again track performance is ??

Toyo RA-1 - great on track, but loses tread quickly. Not very cheap.

Yoko Advan A048 MH Compound - good on track, decent street wear, but not cheap.

Kumho V700 - good on track, loses tread quickly, not very cheap.

Ideally I'd get a tire like the v700 or A048 for the price of the Azenis or RE01Rs. If I'm going to spend $650 for a set of tires that barely last a year or two, I want a tangible difference.

Dave

GooRoo

iTrader: (4)

You may have seen my RA-1 experience elsewhere, but here it is:

I used them for 6-8 days before the large outer tread blocks wore away. I also used them 2000-3000 miles of street driving.

I used them for an additionaly 6-8 days before the secondary tread blocks wore away. I used them for ~1000 miles of street driving here as well.

About 6-8 additional days and they were down to near slicks. (No street driving them anymore)

Other notes:
They got faster the more they wore. (No noticeable heat-cycle fall-off)
Supposedly they are fastest shaved to 2/32 or 1/32
Mine were actually much cheaper than alot of other r-comps at the time ~$160 for 255/40/17's
I ran the RA-1s in the rain when they were nearly new, and was very surprised how much grip I had, full downpour/minor standing water at 110mph and the car still felt reasonably planted.

If I was going to run r-comps on the street for a street/track car (with stock wheel sizes) that's what I'd get. They are way more fun than street tires, even if you have to buy more of them.

(If you go to aftermarket wheels you have alot more options of course.)

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

I am daily driving and doing twice a month Auto-X on Toyo RA-1 and will go with R888 when they are out in our size 245/45-16.

This is my second set of them and it looks like I get about 10k miles on them total with ~3 to 4k miles on the legal tread pattern and 4- 5k miles on the race tread and the rest on slicks.

My last 3 sets of max performance street tires were lasting 3k miles because they were always spinning.

The RA-1 start of quite squirmy (but R888 will be great with the large tread blocks) but they do not seem to heat cycle out even with daily driving though of course breakaway is a little more abrupt the less tread they have.

They are the best tire in the rain I have been on as far as grip goes, but when the tread is gone they are prone to hydroplaning.

When the pavement is really cold (like wouldn't be raining, but rather snowing) you have to be careful as they only have normal tire grip since they can't warm up.

They will remove your paint though as they throw everything that is on the road up onto your car.

I endorse the RA-1.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

Well that's 2 good votes for the RA-1. More street miles that I expected, so I'll drop the RE-01R and RT-615 from the list.

I want to add another option: Hankook Z211 C50. The spec miata guys use them and say they're much like an RA-1 in longevity and consistent grip. Molded tread, and very cheap: http://www.frisbyracetire.com/z211sale.html

But the R888 sounds best of all. The toyo site shows 225/50/16 as a size, but it seems nobody can get it yet. BlueTII, where did you hear that 245/45/16 might be on the way?

Dave

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

Dave, I've spoken to some porsche guys at Lime Rock who had great things to say about the Nitto NT01s......

SPICcnmGT

I've heard the good things about them also. I plan on trying them early next year in place of my RA-1s.

I wouldn't count on any DOT competition tire to last very long if you drive them on the street much, or for street tires to last very long on the track. But, last year I had a set of unshaved RA-1s I used for 6 autoX's and probably 8 track days before they finally corded. Granted Barbers is VERY easy on tires, but I was impressed. I also drove to and from the events on them, but that was the only street drving they got.

For the most part I've come to the conclussion that it's probably cheaper to have a set of tires for the track and a set for the street, depending on how much street driving you do. That is unless you buy cheapo street tires for dual use, or expensive street tires to go with your track tires. JMO though I haven't done any real world price comparisons.

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

I'd be more worried about the heat cycling from street driving. However, as long as you aren't competing with them, it shouldn't be a problem. I would personally pick the Nitto NT01's if they have them in a size you can use.

Black91n/a

I bought some closeout Z211's and am using them as my track tires. They're my first R's, but they seem pretty good.

burtoncr

RE01Rs are the best compromise.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

I just found the NT01s in 235/40 and 255/40R17 for right around $700 for the set. I'll probably run them on the track wheels I just bought

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

http://www.racetire.com/products/toyo_r888.htm

Here is the list taken from the above link.

Proxes R888 Future Availability:
The following sizes are forthcoming in the new Toyo Proxes R888.

Size Expected Arrival
185/60R13 4TH QUARTER 2007
205/60R13 4TH QUARTER 2007
205/55R14 1ST QUARTER 2008
225/50R14 1ST QUARTER 2008
225/45R15 1ST QUARTER 2008
205/55R16 4TH QUARTER 2007
225/50R16 4TH QUARTER 2007
225/45R16 4TH QUARTER 2007
245/45R16 1ST QUARTER 2008
255/50R16 1ST QUARTER 2008
225/45R17 4TH QUARTER 2007
235/45R17 4TH QUARTER 2007
245/40R17 1ST QUARTER 2008
255/40R17 4TH QUARTER 2007
275/40R17 1ST QUARTER 2008
315/35R17 1ST QUARTER 2008
225/40R18 4TH QUARTER 2007
235/40R18 4TH QUARTER 2007
265/35R18 4TH QUARTER 2007
275/40R18 1ST QUARTER 2008
285/30R18 4TH QUARTER 2007
305/30R19 1ST QUARTER 2008

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

I'm not competing on these. Losing grip is fine, going greasy and dangerous is not. As long as they remain more predictable and grippy than a street I'm happy.

The NT01s look to be a great option, but aren't available in a stock FD size.

The R888s also look great, but usually 1st qtr 2008 slides well into 2nd quarter, and I don't want to wait that long. Won't be cheap either.

I'm leaning hard on the closeout Z211s. They're very similar to the RA-1, R888, and V700 but for $425 I won't cry in my soup if they harden or cord too quickly. I'm taking a risk with that - if I wanted to play safe I think the RE01Rs would be the better choice. While the 211s are not as much of a known quantity as the Toyos, I talked with a spec miata guy who used 211s extensively and by his description the heat cycling and unshaven performance is excellent.

Thanks for the input. It would be more fun (not as cheap, but more options) if I were on a 17" wheel. I'll try not to think about that.

Dave

turboeric

The Azenis 615 get greasy and overheat on the track on my Miata - on a heavier car like an RX-7, I expect it would be worse. Excellent for autocross, but not a first choice track tire.

saxyman990

Agreed. I would HIGHLY recommend the RT-615 if you were planning on doing street/autocross driving. But since you're planning on actual lapping events, stay away from the Azenis. The 615s are a heck of a lot better than the older Azenis, but they still tend to get greasy once they overheat.

For street/track use I would personally recommend the RA-1. I've had lots of personal use with this tire that virtually mimics what GooRoo and Blue TII have already stated.

Although, I've also heard a lot of good things about the NT01. To be honest, you probably won't be disappointed if you selected either the RA1 or the NT01.

-Rob

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

I've been told the NT01s are very similar to the RA-1s.....

Black91n/a

Similiar and faster.

With the cheapness of the Z211's it's hard to go wrong though.

Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

Alright, here's what I've heard from fellow autox and track guys.

Falken Azenis RT-615: Grips great at low temps, works ok on the track, might get a little greasy?

Bridgestone RE-01R: Grips even better than the RT-615, good in wet, dunno track

Advan A048: mediocre on track

Toyo RA-1: Great on track, run too cold at autox.

V700: No clue! Decent autox tire though.

You won't find the falkens or the bridgestones in your sizes though. They both only go up to 225 in width on a 16" wheel. My next tires (same size as yours) are going to be the bridgestones with 225 all around though. Should be good fun.

Eggie

That Frisby site has the Z212 in 245/45-16 for $111 each. See here.

primerGrey

iTrader: (13)

Another closeout option:

Avon's Tech RA R-compound in the stock size, $129.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes....model=Tech+R-A

These have worked very well for me, with even wear and good grip on the track (run hot at 36 PSI = cold about 29 PSI). As you'd expect with any closeout, the stock is getting a bit old though, with a MFG date of 2005.

Black91n/a

No tread = bad in the rain and the cops might hassle you for having "bald" tires.

primerGrey

iTrader: (13)

My bad. I guess I generalized the topic to "track tires cheap enough that I don't care that they are different from my streets..."

John Magnuson

I've tried all the tires you list except the Yokos.

If what you're concerned with is a tire that does not lose grip on the track when hot (consistant performance) but you don't care about the LEVEL of grip then go with the Bridgestone Potenza RE01-R

I've tracked them a few time and they stay consistant. More so than the falken azenis.

However they are not going to give you the kind of grip a true R compound does.

All this being said I have a brand new set of Falken Azenis 225/50-16 tires I'm not going to use that I'd make you a deal on.

burtoncr

When people say the RT-615s get greasy after a few laps. Do you mean their performance completely falls off or do they act more like a high performance street tire rather than a max performance?

John Magnuson

No, the performance of the Azenis tires does not completely fall off... but there is certainly a noticable decrease in grip after they get nice and hot. They are a good tire for autocross but not so great for extended trackday lapping or racing.

TRISPEEDFD3S

iTrader: (26)

Basically the tires heat up pass their efficiency range, and there is a loss of performance.