Trav

Okay, I think the time has finally come for me to select a turbo... I'm sure this has all been covered a thousand times, but I'm just looking for a fresh perspective and some reassurance to what I'm thinking. Pretty sure I know what I want, but feel free to shoot holes in it. (be gentle)

Here's what I have planned:
91 vert
13b RE (unported for now, but probably a big street port when it lets go)
Microtech LT8
4.33 LSD rear from GTUs
TechEdge WBO2
3" dual exhaust

Basically I'm looking for an all purpose car. Cruiser, regular good weather driver, street driven on a regular basis. The car will likely see the drag strip 2 or 3 times a year (for the import events and when I feel like scaring some Mustwangs). I don't currently autox but have done it in the past when I had an FD. I could see myself getting into that maybe 2 or 3 times a year also. No tracks around here unless I go to Topeka (Heartland Park). Maybe if I get really motivated it might see that track, but probably only once every couple of years. Essentially I'd like a good handling car but with a nice amount of power. I'd be thrilled w/ low 400s RWHP. My plan was to run mild boost on the street 12psi-14psi or so. Maybe bump it up to 16psi-18psi for the drags or "special occasions". At this point I still want the reliability more than the raw power so I'm not going to get crazy on the boost -- but then again, I'd like to have that power at my disposal. I'd really like to see the 12s (11s?) in the 1/4. The best pump gas I can buy here is 91 octane, so I really won't be able to crank the boost TOO much. I'd prefer a decent spool -- I don't need a crazy fast spool like a .84 AR would provide, but since it will be mostly street, I don't want to wait around until 5000rpm either before I start seeing it come on.

Based on that and the research I've done, it seems like the TO4R is a great fit for me. Every time I do research I keep coming back to advice that leads me to cheapturbo.com and their big kahuna TO4R. I'm looking at the 1.0 A/R divided hotside, .70 A/R coldside. P-trim wheel? (I don't think I need the Q wheel, do I?)
It seems to give me the a lot of potential but still allows me to start mild. I also like the looks of the few dynos I've seen wargasms site.

Since this is an RE motor, the exhaust is slightly more restrictive so that is why I'm thinking the 1.0 A/R divided would be the best and I don't think the Q wheel would spool as nicely as I'd like. Let me hear your thoughts on the Q trim wheel.

At the moment I actually have a TO4e on hand, but it's a 47. I spoke to cheapturbo a couple of months ago and they recommended against upgrading that turbo to a 60 mostly because by the time I spent the money on that and the rebuild I could have something better for a little more cash. (That and he wanted to sell me a turbo ).

What do you all think? For the price, it seems like the TO4R is a heck of a deal at cheapturbo. I realize for my power goals I probably could go a LITTLE smaller like their TO4s, but with the minor difference in price, I'd like to have the comfort of some room to grow.

Here's my other delimma, let's assume the TO4R is my choice. What about options/upgrades? The 360 degree thrust bearing is only $75, but from what I've read in other posts, it doesn't seem like people think it provides that much of an improvement in stability/reliability. Same question on the "wet" upgrade. Is it worth the hassle of running more coolant lines around? Am I really going to see the turbo last that much longer and run cooler? My opinion on this one is yes I should get it based on what I've seen in this forum. Finally I also think that the HPC coating of the turbine is a good upgrade for only $60 so I'll probably do that as well. I'll also probably opt for the V-band flange for my setup since I'll have to build the exhaust from scratch.

Sorry for the long rambling post, I've pretty much decided that this is the turbo of choice for me, but I'd like to hear some reassurance from knowledgeable resources on here. Ultimately I'm looking at a $1153 price tag for the big kahuna plus all of the options mentioned above. As far as I can tell, that seems to be a pretty competitive price for a comparable turbo.

Whew, if you made it this far in my post, congratulations.
Thanks for taking the time to read it...let me know your thoughts.

Trav

Wow 40 views already and no response? Looks like the guys who post "I want to buy a turbo, what should I get?" get a better response than I.

Try to put a little thought into my post and I scare everyone away. :P

Carl Byck

Big shaft, 360 degree thrust bearing, and water cooled are important. Coating is bling only. For the money it's a good choice. A 35R will spool faster, and for 300 more dollars is another nice option. The advantage of the TO4R is the T4 flange vs T3(35R). Manifold choice plays a big role as well, if you are getting a fully divided T4 manifold a divided hot side is the way to go. If you are thinking HKS cast, then save your money, go to a little smaller AR, and undivided. Later for now, I'll check this thread a little later. Carl

Trav

Where would be a good source for a reasonable but well made SS divided manifold? Or should I just go down to the local welder and have him try to build me one?

I think that a divided hotside will be essential for me. I want to keep the spool decent esp. since the RE will be slightly more restricted on the exhaust side than say an REW or 13BT. I would also prefer to stick to the T4 flange -- I may be wrong, but I think my options are greater with that.

So no HPC coating though? No benefits of reduced underhood heat or prolonged life or anything?

Mills

iTrader: (1)

I'd like to know about that, too, as I bought the big kahuna with the .84 hotside a/r and had it coated. Ken at cheapturbo/phoenixturbo.com hooked me up with a place called acosta motorsports for a custom divided FC manifold for $500.

I also paid more to have the manifold coated with the same HPC coating as the turbo-I wouldn't have done that if I hadn't been told it would keep underhood temps down

Trav

Mills, how do you like your manifold? Any pics or details you can give me?

Think I found the site, http://acostamotorsports.com ?

Mills

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, that's it. They deal mostly in FD stuff, but modified their manifold to fit FCs. They even put the correct WG flange on it for me. I'll get some pics up soon .

Carl Byck

Trav, what is "reasonable"? I have often thought about building the "ideal" FC manifold, but most FC owners disappear once the product actually is available. I think ~475-525 is a fair price for a tubular divided long runner manifold. Individual preference for placement is often an issue, most manifolds place the turbo so far forward that a proper CAI is difficult to execute. Ideally as noted above the WG tube(s) woul have no flange, or recieve a flange at the customers direction. I think a DP should be an option, so the customer can elect for an open WG, or one that dumps into the DP. Anyway, I'm off track now, but I'd like to see Acosta's manifold as well. How did they adapt it? how large a T4 hotside will it allow? I was looking at my T66(BIG compressor last night. It is on an HKS cast mani. The placement is pretty much ideal, it ssplits the difference between the LIM, and the body perfectly. Unfortunately, such placement does not allow for long runners. Anyway, some day I'll build one. it's always been a mystery to me why a shop already building manifolds does not do an optimized manifold. There always seems to be substantial compromise in the commercially available pieces. I'd take a hard look at a Precision PT67(TO4R) also. I have a .81, and a .68 I will be testing, along with my T66 .81 q trim. Should be interesting. Kabooski made ~520 w/a 67 .81(trim unknown), so you are on the right track, the AR may be a little large IMHO. I know everyone uses those large ARs, but look at Chris(CARX7)w/a .84, and Roger with a .81 on an HKS cast. Both made ~500 @ ~20psi. Later, Carl

Trav

hmm, I guess I haven't looked much at those lower ARs. That seems like a good deal of HP with probably a great spool... Seeing that makes me want to rethink my strategy a bit or at least continue research (dang I hate that ). It's funny though, that almost makes the fully divided SS manifold less of an issue doesn't it? I mean I was wanting the higher AR for a little more HP potential and knew that the fully divided would be important w/ that high of AR. But if I can run a smaller AR then the fully divided manifold would be less important I guess. I guess that's good news for me as I wouldn't have to spend as much on the manifold...

as far as your question what is reasonable? I guess that's personal taste... I don't know. Extremely reasonable would be $150 wouldn't it? But that's not realistic. I guess I was thinking somewhere in the $300 to $400 range for me, but probably not much more... This may be the wrong perspective, but since I'm not planning crazy boost or massive HP, I'm willing to settle for maybe a little simpler (albeit less efficient) design, as long as the reliability is still there. Then again, I probably don't need inch thick tubing either... tough to say... If I could get it free I guess that would be about right.

I'm going to look at some more dynos I guess and see what kind of HPs to expect on those smaller ARs. Thanks for your input, I appreciate your comments so far.