ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

my supporting mods
750 primaries
1600 secondaries
Rtek2.1
Walbro 255
Streetport
Greddy Fmic
Koyo rad
Evo bov
3in single drivers side exit exhaust


Now I have ordered the stage 4 BNR but if there's no way I'm going to make my 400whp goal then I really don't want to waste my money.

A friend of mine has a new P trim masterpower t61 that he will sell me for $400.

These are the parts I think I would need to run that turbo (please correct me if I'm wrong)

http://www.rx7store.net/product_p/st...-91%20rx-7.htm

http://www.rx7store.net/product_p/hk...0wastegate.htm
or
http://www.rx7store.net/product_p/ti...0wastegate.htm

or would I get away with a 38 mm


Then what do I do for a downpipe?

The turbo would come with the vband clamp

and where do I get gaskets?

I really don't know too much about upgraded turbo setups, and I will read through the single turbo section more. I have searched and I can only get little pieces of the picture and I cant seem to find a straight answer.

Any help would be appreciated.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

Also what does "on" mean exactly when referring to a turbo housing?

hondahater

iTrader: (2)

I would stick with the bnr stage 4 if I were you. Get a little experiance with that turbo and see what you think. It's an easy 350+hp to just bolt on. Otherwise a single turbo setup is a pretty big task to take on if you don't even know what you're doing.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

I'm pretty sure, I can do this other turbo. Although I am relatively new to Rx7s I have a lot of experience with other older performance piston engines. I am half way through a complete frame off on my street truck, that I have built a roughly 400hp 400 ft/ib torque ( so says desktop dyno) 350 for. I have also bult a 500+ hp 468 big block for my friends chevelle, a mild 302 for a mustang I converted to a V8 from a 4cyl for my brother. And this is just what I have done in the past year. I built and installed a 350 in a friends Monty Carlo as a token of appreciation for his service to our country. Also before that I was a personal mechanic for a man with nearly 100 classic cars. Not to mention the six cars I own that I have done all the repairs, maintenance and upgrades on myself.

I have a plethora of tools to complete any task.

My competence, that is not an issue.

As for the BNR stage 4 ( I don't really think I'll learn anything form that)

Honestly if I could find my copy Of Corky Bell I probably wouldn't be asking so many questions.

Also just because I have humbled myself to ask the advice of people with experience does not mean I have no idea what I am doing.

Hell I have enough engineering background so far to figure out what size waste gate I need, but it would take me a while to calculate, and as we all know it could still be wrong as experience is many times more valuable.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

And hondahater, I would think of all people you would help me. I have followed your setup and progress since before I even thought about this turbo. You are running a t70 at 18 psi (because its not doweled) on a 13bt, basically just the next step up from what I want to do.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

You can't go over 1 bar of boost on the Rtek. You're really pushing the limits of the stock AFM, but I would like to see what it can do, so good luck.

And do not even attempt a single 38mm wastegate, they don't flow enough for a rotary.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

I'm pretty sure that the rtek guys said there was some way to run more than 15psi but I'm not sure what it was. If that's not true than i think i can run my safc in conjunction to make sure I maintain safe AFRs since it is only rpm based. Hopefully pocket logger will come out with the AFM delete for Rtek soon.

I guess those links stopped working but they were a 40mm hks wastegate or a 44mm tial wastegate and the rx7 store fc turbo manifold.

Will that 44 work?

RacerXtreme7

iTrader: (2)

Trying to shoot for over 350+ at the wheels using a big turbo and Rtek is like trying to guide an Atom bomb with cables. It can be done... sometimes..... but when you miss, BOOM lotsa collateral damage.

~Mike............

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

I agree but until I can afford a haltech, I'm going to do the best I can with what I have.

RacerXtreme7

iTrader: (2)

Your sig sums it up (haha, that was a pun). Gotta pay if you wanna play. Have you looked for used ones in the for sale section on this forum and the many other RX forums? Maybe eBay as well?

~Mike................

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

Ok, I know i should get a stand alone.

Who sells a down pipe for a t61 application? I know the turbo uses a V-band clamp for the exhaust.

and the wategate? what size should I have ?

as for the turbo manifold I imagine they all put the turbo in a different spot. So that would affect my downpipe selection.

Maybe I'll make my own downpipe or some sort of adapter.

RacerXtreme7

iTrader: (2)

There is no downpipe for it. It will have to be custom made and your manifold will determine its dimentions. Personally I'd go with a Tial 44mm WG. HKS 40mm should suffice as well and will be cheaper. Buy all the parts then mock it up. Like I said your mani will determine your DP, and your WG will determine were your WG will get plumbed back into the DP (atmosphere dumb is rediculously loud!). There is no temp EMS situation with a turbo this size. You have to have it tuned properly, there is no "this will get me by till I can afford something better". Do it once right, or half assed a couple times, which do you think is cheaper? Your going to also need more fuel pump if you go close to or over 1 bar (14 psi).

~Mike............

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

The dp will have to be made. V-band does't use a gasket to seal it. Stainless steel is probably the best way to go for the dp. I would heat wrap it also. I personally like the sound of atmospheric wastegate. Its really not that terribly loud and its only when you're really getting on it too. You can always try it fist and if you don't like it plumb it in later. There is a little power to be gained by the wastegate being dumped. Now when you asked what "on" was you probably meant a/r. Which is basically the side of the housing in comparison to the turbo wheels. A larger exhaust housing ar will make more hp especially in the higher rpms but you trade off a little spool speed. A smaller ar will spool quicker but can choke it on the topend. A good general size is about .96 ar, i wouldn't go smaller then .84 or larger then about 1.15. And if you're running pump gas i wouldn't go higher then around 16 psi without water/meth injection. I don't know much at all about the rtek. Does it allow timing adjustments? Cause the timing will need adjusted. You should really have a wideband and a stand alone computer with dataloging ability. tuning is one of the most important areas and should not be overlooked.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

The dp will have to be made. V-band does't use a gasket to seal it. Stainless steel is probably the best way to go for the dp. Prob 3 in unless the outlet is larger. I would heat wrap it also. I personally like the sound of atmospheric wastegate. Its really not that terribly loud and its only when you're really getting on it too. You can always try it fist and if you don't like it plumb it in later. There is a little power to be gained by the wastegate being dumped. Now when you asked what "on" was you probably meant a/r. Which is basically the side of the housing in comparison to the turbo wheels. A larger exhaust housing ar will make more hp especially in the higher rpms but you trade off a little spool speed. A smaller ar will spool quicker but can choke it on the topend. A good general size is about .96 ar, i wouldn't go smaller then .84 or larger then about 1.15. And if you're running pump gas i wouldn't go higher then around 16 psi without water/meth injection. I don't know much at all about the rtek. Does it allow timing adjustments? Cause the timing will need adjusted. You should really have a wideband and a stand alone computer with dataloging ability. tuning is one of the most important areas and should not be overlooked.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

a/r was not what I was talking about but thank you for the explanation, that was probably the most straight forward explanation of that I have got so far.

I think "on" had something to do with the offset of the housings or something, I'm honestly not sure but I saw a recent post where a guy's turbo didn't fit because he had the "on" turbo or maybe it was "off".

I think I will go with the Tial 44 wastegate it's not much more expensive.

As for the wastegate, I hear you when you say it isn't that loud, but I really want it to be as quiet as possible so I will make a return into the downpipe.

As for the rtek,2.1 you can control timing and it logs quite a bit of info.

RacerXtreme7, do you have any experience with the 2.1, I'm not trying to doubt you since you really seem to know what you are talking about, but it is all too often people have developed these opinions with out any firsthand experience.

If it is definitely not going work then I will sell it tomorrow as I would love to have a reason to get a standalone. The only thing is I have about $400 bucks into this rtek with the pda and communication cable. Eh maybe I can sell it for $300 or something.

I have a wide band now and will getting an egt setup soon as well.

Now, if the 255 isnt going to cut it what would you recommend?

I really appreciate your input guys.

Azcamel

iTrader: (1)

whats your budget?

hondahater

iTrader: (2)

Well I wouldn't go with anything less than a standalone engine management system, as pin point precision when tuning a full turbo upgraded rotary is key to having it last. I've seen all sorts of piston guys slap a turbo on a motor and have it last with just a piggy back but the same is not true for rotaries. When I have more time I'll write some more info down. Good luck with the build!

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

^^
good point thank for pointing out that difference

RacerXtreme7

iTrader: (2)

Your thinking about "on-center" turbines verses tangical. The on-center turbines were developed to save space in some situations and they put a pretty big kink in the turbine flow, were the standard tang looks like a snail shell or compressor housings were the inlet is offset from the center of the turbine outlet. Stay away from the on-center turbines, as they offer no benefits, only drawbacks both in spool up and top end flow.

Q:"RacerXtreme7, do you have any experience with the 2.1, I'm not trying to doubt you since you really seem to know what you are talking about, but it is all too often people have developed these opinions with out any firsthand experience."

Yes, my good buddy Matt is running one on his ported N/A right now is it ok for that. But boosted applications its at best a small band aid for a gaping hatchet gash. Theres several reasons to go standalone, two of the biggest is the MAF is highly restrictive with T4 sized turbos and they will max out way before your turbo really starts to zing. Another big reason is the factory MAP sensor maxes out before 12 psi, YES this was just tested roughly by another friend of mine last week doing some camparative testing. So either save up and get it all before you start your build, or shoot for lower goals (like a hybrid and say 310~350 RWHP which btw is a fast fun car that will still get you in a world of trouble and beat 90% of the cars you'll come across while driving on the streets).

Fueling needs, run dual Walbros, or get a single Nippon Denso Supra pump or even the Bosch 044. All will fit in your tank. I'd avoid running pumps not in the tank, I did this and the noise they make is annoying.

~Mike...........

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

I guess I don' t really budget, I just try to do what I want as cost effective as possible. If I can't afford to do what I want right away I do things piece by piece.

RacerXtreme7

iTrader: (2)

Yes, piece by piece is fine, granted you do them in the corrct order, 1st and most is EMS, then fuel, then upgraded turbos. For what its worth, every thing you currenty have now will work great with a hybrid (BNR) turbo and net yo u close to 320~350 at the wheels. No to mention you wont have to buy another manifold, DP, WG, and all the fab work that goes with it.

~Mike...............

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

Ok standalone it is. Any recommendations?

I'm guessing dual 255s would be the cheapest since I already have one. I like the redundancy as well seems less likely to completely fail.

And where do I get a gm 3bar map sensor?

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

The manifold I have now is cracked anyway and I have never really liked my down pipe since it has 3 o2 bungs in it and a screw for some reason.

Winter will be here soon and I won't be able to enjoy the turbo for very long anyway so I guess I'll just start collecting parts and have it ready first thing this spring.