t04b and e differences
11-16-05, 03:40 AM
#2
Savanna Rx-7
Originally Posted by slpin
i cant seem to find anything about it...
other than the 6 blade/8 blade differences and the much bigger t04e compressor housing... what exactly are their differences?
other than the 6 blade/8 blade differences and the much bigger t04e compressor housing... what exactly are their differences?
I have been doing some research for the last 8 months or so, and from what I can determine from the compressor maps (factual) is this the b variant makes more hp at lower boost levels while the same size "E" variant makes more HP at higher boost levels, hence the popularity of the 60-1 (its technically a "B" variant)
and from what I gather from the other forum members it has something to do with the height, and pitch of the compressor blades, IIRC it seems that the "B" variant has a taller blade (correct me if I am mistaken)
the right people to address this to are rice racing and racer extreme7 (thanks to both for the amount of CORRECT info they have floating in there skulls)
kenn
11-16-05, 01:48 PM
#3
Kenn pretty much nailed it (and thanks for the props).
The B variants are an older design. There geared more towards flow at low pressure ratios were the E variants are a newer and more efficient design that work more efficiently at higher pressure ratios (can be compared with maps like stated).
The blade count has more to do with a more efficient design, along with other design features within the compressors such as back sweep, B-tip height (B-tip height is the height of the exducers tips) and inducer blade angle of attack. Thinner blades are more efficient then thicker. SIDE NOTE:{Really expensive and VERY efficient compressors are milled from billet rather then cast which offers more strength for the blades so they can be made thinner (and more accurate due to machining instead of a casting)}. So you see these features in the newer and more recent compressors (GT series as well which have their efficiencies typically in the 78~83 %). You'll notice less thinner blades with more back sweep and the angle of attack along with B-tip height determine how they behave as far as flow and pressure ratios along with many many other factors such as inducer and exducer sizes and the trims (trim is a ratio of inducer and exducer). The older B variants typically run in the 73% peak efficiency whilst the E's run in the 78%.
The E variants do have larger compressor housings as well, though both the E and B typically use the same .6 A/R value. The larger housings are because, the E flow more typically when comparing close to equal physical sizes between the two families and the larger diffuser area (area between were the exducer ends and the snail scroll begins) is found to work more efficiently as well (newer technology).
Both the b and e are considered small to medium sized.
The 60-1, 62-1 is listed under the B family even though they share more design features with the E family. These comps have 7 paired inducer blades were the B have 8 and E have 6. These comps have a better effeciency then the B's (76%) do but not as high as the E's. The 60-1 and 62-1 are geared toward big flow numbers at low-pressure ratios (1.8:1~2:1 roughly is in the fat part of the map). The 60-1, 62-1 does have the E family back sweep, but runs a very aggressive inducer blade angle (hence the high flow numbers). These comps are the beginig or the intermiate players to the large frame "T series" turbos who run big shafts. The 60-1 or 62-1 can come in standard or big shaft. The comp housings for these wheels are the T04S comp housings which are built for these larger compressor. With its smooth belled mouthed 4" inlet and 2.5" disscharge, large difuser area and .7 A/R these comp housings are designed to move some air. Several turbos use this housing. Infact pretty much anything bigger then the 60-1 all the way to the T6 sized frames will typically use a T04S housing except some specialty turbos used for diesels. They usually run a ported shroud comp housing. Even the new GT series turbos still uses the T04S comp housings, like the GT30, GT35 and their varients. the 60-1 can also be built using the older and smaller T04B comp cover. This combo is usually refered to as the 60-1 HiFi. Expect a 5 to 10% loss in flow. This compressor and comp housings combo ("HiFi") should only really be used in space contraints situations.
~Mike...............
The B variants are an older design. There geared more towards flow at low pressure ratios were the E variants are a newer and more efficient design that work more efficiently at higher pressure ratios (can be compared with maps like stated).
The blade count has more to do with a more efficient design, along with other design features within the compressors such as back sweep, B-tip height (B-tip height is the height of the exducers tips) and inducer blade angle of attack. Thinner blades are more efficient then thicker. SIDE NOTE:{Really expensive and VERY efficient compressors are milled from billet rather then cast which offers more strength for the blades so they can be made thinner (and more accurate due to machining instead of a casting)}. So you see these features in the newer and more recent compressors (GT series as well which have their efficiencies typically in the 78~83 %). You'll notice less thinner blades with more back sweep and the angle of attack along with B-tip height determine how they behave as far as flow and pressure ratios along with many many other factors such as inducer and exducer sizes and the trims (trim is a ratio of inducer and exducer). The older B variants typically run in the 73% peak efficiency whilst the E's run in the 78%.
The E variants do have larger compressor housings as well, though both the E and B typically use the same .6 A/R value. The larger housings are because, the E flow more typically when comparing close to equal physical sizes between the two families and the larger diffuser area (area between were the exducer ends and the snail scroll begins) is found to work more efficiently as well (newer technology).
Both the b and e are considered small to medium sized.
The 60-1, 62-1 is listed under the B family even though they share more design features with the E family. These comps have 7 paired inducer blades were the B have 8 and E have 6. These comps have a better effeciency then the B's (76%) do but not as high as the E's. The 60-1 and 62-1 are geared toward big flow numbers at low-pressure ratios (1.8:1~2:1 roughly is in the fat part of the map). The 60-1, 62-1 does have the E family back sweep, but runs a very aggressive inducer blade angle (hence the high flow numbers). These comps are the beginig or the intermiate players to the large frame "T series" turbos who run big shafts. The 60-1 or 62-1 can come in standard or big shaft. The comp housings for these wheels are the T04S comp housings which are built for these larger compressor. With its smooth belled mouthed 4" inlet and 2.5" disscharge, large difuser area and .7 A/R these comp housings are designed to move some air. Several turbos use this housing. Infact pretty much anything bigger then the 60-1 all the way to the T6 sized frames will typically use a T04S housing except some specialty turbos used for diesels. They usually run a ported shroud comp housing. Even the new GT series turbos still uses the T04S comp housings, like the GT30, GT35 and their varients. the 60-1 can also be built using the older and smaller T04B comp cover. This combo is usually refered to as the 60-1 HiFi. Expect a 5 to 10% loss in flow. This compressor and comp housings combo ("HiFi") should only really be used in space contraints situations.
~Mike...............
Last edited by RacerXtreme7; 11-16-05 at 01:52 PM.
11-16-05, 11:23 PM
#5
Wow, thanks! this is VERY helpful...
Originally Posted by RacerXtreme7
Kenn pretty much nailed it (and thanks for the props).
The B variants are an older design. There geared more towards flow at low pressure ratios were the E variants are a newer and more efficient design that work more efficiently at higher pressure ratios (can be compared with maps like stated).
The blade count has more to do with a more efficient design, along with other design features within the compressors such as back sweep, B-tip height (B-tip height is the height of the exducers tips) and inducer blade angle of attack. Thinner blades are more efficient then thicker. SIDE NOTE:{Really expensive and VERY efficient compressors are milled from billet rather then cast which offers more strength for the blades so they can be made thinner (and more accurate due to machining instead of a casting)}. So you see these features in the newer and more recent compressors (GT series as well which have their efficiencies typically in the 78~83 %). You'll notice less thinner blades with more back sweep and the angle of attack along with B-tip height determine how they behave as far as flow and pressure ratios along with many many other factors such as inducer and exducer sizes and the trims (trim is a ratio of inducer and exducer). The older B variants typically run in the 73% peak efficiency whilst the E's run in the 78%.
The E variants do have larger compressor housings as well, though both the E and B typically use the same .6 A/R value. The larger housings are because, the E flow more typically when comparing close to equal physical sizes between the two families and the larger diffuser area (area between were the exducer ends and the snail scroll begins) is found to work more efficiently as well (newer technology).
Both the b and e are considered small to medium sized.
The 60-1, 62-1 is listed under the B family even though they share more design features with the E family. These comps have 7 paired inducer blades were the B have 8 and E have 6. These comps have a better effeciency then the B's (76%) do but not as high as the E's. The 60-1 and 62-1 are geared toward big flow numbers at low-pressure ratios (1.8:1~2:1 roughly is in the fat part of the map). The 60-1, 62-1 does have the E family back sweep, but runs a very aggressive inducer blade angle (hence the high flow numbers). These comps are the beginig or the intermiate players to the large frame "T series" turbos who run big shafts. The 60-1 or 62-1 can come in standard or big shaft. The comp housings for these wheels are the T04S comp housings which are built for these larger compressor. With its smooth belled mouthed 4" inlet and 2.5" disscharge, large difuser area and .7 A/R these comp housings are designed to move some air. Several turbos use this housing. Infact pretty much anything bigger then the 60-1 all the way to the T6 sized frames will typically use a T04S housing except some specialty turbos used for diesels. They usually run a ported shroud comp housing. Even the new GT series turbos still uses the T04S comp housings, like the GT30, GT35 and their varients. the 60-1 can also be built using the older and smaller T04B comp cover. This combo is usually refered to as the 60-1 HiFi. Expect a 5 to 10% loss in flow. This compressor and comp housings combo ("HiFi") should only really be used in space contraints situations.
~Mike...............
The B variants are an older design. There geared more towards flow at low pressure ratios were the E variants are a newer and more efficient design that work more efficiently at higher pressure ratios (can be compared with maps like stated).
The blade count has more to do with a more efficient design, along with other design features within the compressors such as back sweep, B-tip height (B-tip height is the height of the exducers tips) and inducer blade angle of attack. Thinner blades are more efficient then thicker. SIDE NOTE:{Really expensive and VERY efficient compressors are milled from billet rather then cast which offers more strength for the blades so they can be made thinner (and more accurate due to machining instead of a casting)}. So you see these features in the newer and more recent compressors (GT series as well which have their efficiencies typically in the 78~83 %). You'll notice less thinner blades with more back sweep and the angle of attack along with B-tip height determine how they behave as far as flow and pressure ratios along with many many other factors such as inducer and exducer sizes and the trims (trim is a ratio of inducer and exducer). The older B variants typically run in the 73% peak efficiency whilst the E's run in the 78%.
The E variants do have larger compressor housings as well, though both the E and B typically use the same .6 A/R value. The larger housings are because, the E flow more typically when comparing close to equal physical sizes between the two families and the larger diffuser area (area between were the exducer ends and the snail scroll begins) is found to work more efficiently as well (newer technology).
Both the b and e are considered small to medium sized.
The 60-1, 62-1 is listed under the B family even though they share more design features with the E family. These comps have 7 paired inducer blades were the B have 8 and E have 6. These comps have a better effeciency then the B's (76%) do but not as high as the E's. The 60-1 and 62-1 are geared toward big flow numbers at low-pressure ratios (1.8:1~2:1 roughly is in the fat part of the map). The 60-1, 62-1 does have the E family back sweep, but runs a very aggressive inducer blade angle (hence the high flow numbers). These comps are the beginig or the intermiate players to the large frame "T series" turbos who run big shafts. The 60-1 or 62-1 can come in standard or big shaft. The comp housings for these wheels are the T04S comp housings which are built for these larger compressor. With its smooth belled mouthed 4" inlet and 2.5" disscharge, large difuser area and .7 A/R these comp housings are designed to move some air. Several turbos use this housing. Infact pretty much anything bigger then the 60-1 all the way to the T6 sized frames will typically use a T04S housing except some specialty turbos used for diesels. They usually run a ported shroud comp housing. Even the new GT series turbos still uses the T04S comp housings, like the GT30, GT35 and their varients. the 60-1 can also be built using the older and smaller T04B comp cover. This combo is usually refered to as the 60-1 HiFi. Expect a 5 to 10% loss in flow. This compressor and comp housings combo ("HiFi") should only really be used in space contraints situations.
~Mike...............
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Shainiac
Single Turbo RX-7's
12
07-17-19 02:20 PM
