BLKTOPTRVL

I run my car in peaceful and easy mode most of the time. It is only occasionally that I tip into the turbo.

It seems to me that if this is how most performace cars are opperated, then most of the high octane fuel is wasted.

Once the car is rolling at a steady state, I would think that the octane used to support the turbo operation is not needed.

If we can inject oil directly into the engine, and if we can inject water to tame the flame, and further, we inject NO2, then why can't we run low or medium grade fuel in the tank with on demand (depending on the boost pounds and engine needs) octane injected as needed?

Any thoughts from the engineers?

mwatson184

Octane is not something that you can inject. It is not something that is added to the fuel in your tank, it is a property of the fuel in your tank.

If antidetonation is what you are after, many have had success running lower octane with water and/or methanol ijection.

Marques

BLKTOPTRVL

Thanks for the input, but when I say injecting "Octane", I am refering to the fact that the difference between 89 Octane gas and 93 octane is the formulation.

I realize that 89 RON is formulated differently from 93, but concidering that most gas stations only have two tanks - high and low octane - yet they sell three grades of gas, this means that they are achieving 91 octane by blending the 89 and the 93.

So, if this is the case, is it possible to get a super concentrate of incredible octane gas that can be injected when needed to blend inside the combustion chamber instead of in the tank?

How much high octane av gas would have to be mixed with 89 o to achieve a 93,94,95 rating? And if not av gas, is there some fuel that is more potent that can blend with gas?

Not that I am trying to build anything? Just curious at this point.

SPOautos

Where have you heard this??? The tanks and octane out of the pump is tested every year by inspectors. They arent blending them. Even if they are on the same pump that doesnt mean the fuel is coming form the same tank. You can have one pump attached to two tanks.

Stephen

Quadulus

I just saw another thread like this a couple days ago. He was thinking of running a separate fuel system to the secondary injectors. Primarys would run on 87 and the secondarys on race gas or something like that.

For what you are describing it would be much more efficient to just put on water/methanol injection and run the lower grade of gas.

Aviation gas doesn't have the same lubrication properties as the gas we all run in our DD's. I do not know specifically if this would cause any problems in our beloved rotaries.

BLKTOPTRVL

Steven, I am not sure what your point is... "Even if they are on the same pump that doesnt mean the fuel is coming form the same tank. You can have one pump attached to two tanks." One pump attached to two tanks is what I was saying. That is how it is blended.

I don't know where I learned about the mixing. I think it may have been a discovery channel show from years ago. But I did go to the web today to try to find something that supported the statement.

http://www.babcox.com/editorial/us/us10325.htm

http://www.fueltracker.com/NewsStori...CTimes_net.htm

Side Issue BTW, inspections were being done once a year - or worse once every two years, the shame is that some station owners are cheating and selling you regular at premium prices. Another reason to try to take control of your own octain mixing.

Whizbang

any fuel geniuses here?

i am wanting to run 89 octant in my TII becaue i get it for free....but i have a 3" DP and a 3" TID and some other mods and might be boosting 9 - 10psi without choice. any idea of what i could do? is there like, a boost step down controller?

13btnos

iTrader: (1)

Man just run water injection! You are doing twice the work if you want to put in a separate tank and associated plumbing to have a separate injection system just to have a higher octane fuel and not to mention the added cost. A water injection system is realitively inexpensive and properly tuned you can run above 20psi boost pressures and the added fact that it keeps your internals clean. You can get a basic water injection system for under $300 and water is cheap. LOL. If your just boosting 9-10psi water injection is more cost effective for you. Think about it you can run low octane all day long and still boost to your engines potential without worrying about detonation. Makes sense to me. To each his/her own if you want to reinvent the wheel and try something different but I'd rather go with something that is tried and true and proven to work.

zyounker

Look into propane injection using a haabs switch.

BLKTOPTRVL

You are right about the water injection. That is another way to inject 'knock resistance.' I was inquiring about this because it seems to me that having the entire infrastructure for two/three types of fuel throughout the country itself seems wastful. Exspecially if there is some other method available to supply that knock resistance on demand.

BLKTOPTRVL

Got any links? Google found nothing apropos on 'haab's switch'

surfpac

He meant Hobbs pressure switch. I personally prefer to us a Keyence or Sunx digital pressure switch. These can switch on 2 independent outputs at different setpoints.

13btnos

iTrader: (1)

That's exactly what water injection will do for you. You can run the lowest octane fuel and still get no knock. To me it is the cheapest, safest and most simple setup out there. Nothing fancy simply adding water at the appropriate time and mixture and you not only run safer but also can raise your boost as if you were running high octane race fuel on a street driven car. There are people running water injection and running the same boost levels 20+psi that they would normally run with 100+octane race fuel but they are doing it with pump gas. Sorry to beat a dead horse but water injection is best for turbo cars. Just my 2 cents.

yelwoci

As already stated Water Injection search for AquaMist http://www.aquamist.co.uk/

zyounker

If you want a pre-built vapor system check out the bulldog propane injection systems.. Not the best but about the only thing i've seen on the market as far as systems you can buy.


And yeah, i meant hobbs switch. It is a very common pressure switch.

BLKTOPTRVL

Thanks for the info... Last year, before I put the 94 away, I was getting ready to make this purchase. It is still on my shopping list.

SPOautos

Just because there is a small amout of left over fuel in the line doesnt mean anything unless your only going to buy 1 gallon of gas. If the person before you bought 89 and your getting 93 and its the type pump where there is only one take nozzle then you might get a tiny big of 89 in with your 93 but its not enough to dilute it down to 91. When inspections are make they are made from the pump just like if you were putting it in your car. The pumps ratings are based on those inspections.

Now if could be that YEARS and YEARS ago the setup might have been different, maybe that tv show was based on ancient old information, I dont know.

Anyway, thats all besides the point. There is no reason to reinvent the wheel, water injection is super cheap since water is free. You would be better off to run water injection. I've heard that the cooling effects of water injection are equal to 100-110octant race fuel depending on how much water you spray.

Stephen

Whizbang

hmm...i wonder if i could use my now blocked off oil injector ports for it...

ronbros3

THEN comes the method of tune up, adding parts is easy, making them all work together is the hard part, you are at 20lbs. boost and the book says now lean it out and add timing also . takes big nuts and a lot of money. but you do learn a lot. RON