RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Am I wrong or does this $5000 trannie come as a kit that has to be installed in your present case ($5000 I think, If I'm wrong then this whole thread is for nought).
http://www.gurumotorsports.com/
Using the stock case is a plus because their are no fitment issues, unless you want to relocate the engine down and back. Can the stock case with their shifter be relocated via some linkage? Also, its limits are with "cars up to 600 hp". What about torque rating? Thats what really matters. Is it safe to assume that it can only handle the amount of torque that roughly corresponds to 600hp (550 ft.lbs tops with a 20B...maybe). Their site has a 20b 2nd gen running their tranny, but is "only" dynoed at 500 rwhp. My 20B will/should be way over this. Seems to me their are more attractive options for roughly the same amount of money.
I'm only interested in road racing transmissions , so HKS and GReddy need not apply.
http://www.jericoperformance.com/products/rr5spd.html
http://www.g-forcetransmissions.com/tran_gf5r.asp
I have e-mailed them pretty much the same questions and will post their response.

Red-Rx7

I will give you first hand results with this box.

The car will be done in the end of Feb timeframe.

It will produce over 1k at the wheels, (just a few test dyno's). But on a more realistic experience with the transmission, it will be about 850 rwhp to 600 RWHP.

I highly doubt I would run anything more than 850 rwhp.

The parts look extremely strong, and they have guys running 1.0's 60' foots in Austrialia on them. They are in the 7's / 8's. So, I think it would be more than strong to handle MY use.

My car is NOT a drag car. It is a street / weekend warrior / occasional drag / road race.

What is the purpose of your car? Remember, the more gears you stroke through the less worries about breakage.

Mike

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

since the turbo 2/fd style transmission (r box) has been used in several different cars and trucks since 1970, they also have several different bellhousing and tailshaft housings for it. the 87-93 b2600's have an r box with the shifter a couple inches forward

mike

12aTurbo510

I have a Jerico DR4 (the 4 speed) I have the downshiftable type (dog ring) although it allows shifting w/o the clutch (if you lift a little or hit the rev-limiter) With the mazda Adapter you can bolt up any mazda bellhousing (in my case the rx-4) or you can bolt up a turbo tranny bellhousing. This tranny will withstand 1100HP of 900ft-lbs of torque...and the beauty is that it is only $3600 shipped to my door. With your choice of gear ratios, and shifter arm length. I am EXTREMELY pleased with this tranny. If you'd like to see pics out of the car with the Mazda adapter w/o the bell housing....here they are www.ammarsgallery.com/tranny

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Any dog-ring tranny will allow shifting without the clutch. For that matter, any manual will also. Dog-rings just allow to do it better and easier more reliably. I'm all about left foot braking. For me, it iis easier to modulate the gas/brake pedals than with the heel toe method demanded from synchro trannies.
I just talked to Jerico about their 5-speed rail-shift. They also have an internal shifter tranny avalable soon for a little more money, but didn't want to talk about it at the time. Jerico as well as G-Force are well known for being about the best tranny options out there, as well they should be for the price.
Did you have to go wth a clutch setup that was 18 spline Chrysler compatible. If so, (probably a stupid question) does the input shaft just slip into the pilot bearing like stock?
Very interesting, I knew they used them in the trucks, but did not know about the different lengths and shifter positions. This presents an attractive option with the Guru kit. But will it still work? The 20B rear housing is a bit different than the TII as far as where the bellhousing bolts up (missing a few). Is there a Mazda bellhousing that is closer to the auto tranny these engines came with? Of course it would need a spot for the clutch slave, anywhere really. How compatible are theses B2600 parts or other bellhousing combos with the existing TII tranny? C'mon j9, start cross refencing that extensive parts inventory in your head and help me out.

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Have you driven a car with one or are you waiting for your car to get done. I'm not questioning the quality of the tranny, I'm curious about the limits of it. I would rather spend more now to insure the future than spend a little less more often eventually amounting to more.
I've put together too many VW transaxles with dog-rings for Star Mazdas to think they are strong because they look strong, they 'look' stong (hardened straight cut gears etc.) but are pieces of ****. Looks mean nothing...unless your working on a Hewland = looks indestructible, is indestructible. Got $15,000 I can borrow?
Road racing is more demanding on trannies than drag racing. Yeah, I'm aware of the initial launch, but drag racing is over in two or three shifts with the blink of an eye. It doesn't have to withstand hundreds of hard shifts, down not just up, for long durations of time.
My car will be producing the same power range as yours. However my car will be primarily a road race car with occasional streeet duty (it does have an interior ) .
Why?
btw we are all waiting for your car to get done. Also, drill Marcos about these billet inatake manifolds he mentioned and let us know. He doesn't seem to keen on responding to peoples inquiries from within this forum. I'm dying to know more about these.

TYSON

Do you know something we don't?

12aTurbo510

I realize that you can shift any dog ring tranny w/o clutch....my implication was that I did not have the clutchless (non downshiftable type)

Yes I went with the 18 spline chrysler version, and yes the pilot shaft fit, BUT I had to grind the end of the input splines to match dimentinally that of a turbo tranny, because the jerico splines ate NOT tapered and they interfered with the clutch hub.

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Apparently not, because the HKS site says it can. Can't find anything about the GReddy unit. Guess thats what I get for not looking into it myself in the first place, which lead me to rule out a couple viable options to quick based on someone elses opinion. A big no-no.
However I still haven't seen any info about either GReddy or HKS trannies competing in circuit racing. I'm sure they must, but who and where? The only one I have heard running the HKS dogmission was Soul Assasin (see car of the month in this forum). I can remeber him talking about how it was intended for drag racing, so it upshifted nice, but requires some effort to shift down. Not what you want on a road course. Looking at the HKS site, which sucks, there is hardly any info on it. They offer kits for 5 & 6-speed dog-ring conversions and complete trannies for the FC that are "capable of circuit racing", all very expensive for what you get. I cannot Imagine they are that much better than Jerico or G-Force transmissions, or even as good for that matter. Again I may be wrong but I need to see some more info now. Do you know any one running either an HKS or GReddy Tranny?

10sec rx7

Which cars are running 1.0 60's on these boxes here in australia?? as far as im aware they have only been used in 9sec street cars, no 8sec or 7sec runs, with 1.3 60's

Dale

TYSON

Yes. The HKS. This car is street driven all the time.Jeffrilito

AJC13B

Yup, what he said.

I hope you didn't buy the box based on those figures that someone told you. Where did you get those times from?

AJC13B

Damn double posting biznatch!

Red-Rx7

I could have miss heard....

I thought thats what Rohan had said. But, it could have been a bad "hearing" on my part. You aussies are hard enough to understand.

I thought he mentioned the cars were running 1.0 in the 60's. Ignore me if I am wrong. But thats what I thought I heard.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

the cosmo motors share the bellhousing bolt pattern with the automatic fd, and thats it.

with the r box there are only a few things that have shanged over the years.
bell housings:
1. 74-78 rx4-5, takes the 215mm na style clutch, gearbox is tilted.
2. 86-92 turbo t2 style, well its like the t2
3. fd, deeper than the fc by about 1-2" for the pull type clutch
tail housings:
fd: has power plant frame mounts, i think its longer too
87-93 b2600: shifter moved forward (compared to fc) about 2" has pre 86 style mount, may use smaller driveshaft yoke?

thats the only three ive looked at in detail. the bolt patterns on the actual center case have not changed, so all of the bell housings and tail housings will bolt up.
these trannies came in the 70-74 rx2, 73-78 rx3, rx4, rx5, repu, 86-02 rx7 turbo, 88-89 929, 89-91? mpv, 87-93 b2600. so there are plenty of different ones to choose from.

mike

Mazderati

iTrader: (3)

I'm not sure as to how far along you might be or how much of a monetary investment you want to make, but another option is the 6spd. kit offered by Quaife.

http://www.quaifeamerica.com/gears/rx7.htm

I'd be interested to know what kind of warranty and power rating this kit comes with as Quaife warrants their differentials for life...even when raced. Not to mention the fact that it would be nice to have an extra gear. Good luck.

Kyle

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

I know abour their trannies and they are superb, but very expensive. They have trannies that can handle upwards of 1000 hp AND ft/ilbs of torque.
Their 6-speed for the RX-7 is not a 5 to 6 speed conversion kit. You already need to have the Japanese 6-speed trannie to use their kit. If I wanted one of their tranniesw, I would need $13,000. That is really more than twice my budget.
I need a trannie yesterday so I can figure out about relocating this engine today.
btw, no such luck with a warranty on trannies, unless there is a manufacturing flaw.

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the info Mike. Does this also include the B2000?
The smaller driveshaft yoke of the B2600 worries me a bit, but I'll have to look into that some more. I'm still waiting to hear back from Guru to see if this parts interchanging would work still.
I guess I'm going to have to go see my Mom and remove the transmission from her B2600. I wonder if she'll notice...

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

mazda has had 5 rwd trannies:

split case: found in the r100 and 1200 super rare wierd bolt patterns etc etc

m box: new for the 79 rx7, used in 4 cyl, 2wd non turbo cars, 79-92 na rx7's, miata, b2000, b2200

y box: new for the 99 miata, 6 speed, and the rx8

p box: its a bad xerox copy of the r box, they make it for ford, because ford cant make a tranny

r box: the t2 tranny, found in v6, 4wd, turbo cars

mike

Evil Aviator

In that case, you can forget about the sprague clutch transmissions made by Geforce and Lenco because they will not downshift. They will work great for drag racing and occasional street use, but I don't see how you could get around a road race track with something like that.

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Thats what I heard about the HKS and GReddy transmissions also. Emphasis on the word "heard".
Was never intersted in Lenco, but this G-Force tranny could be used for road racing, at least thats what they say. I don't know anyone running it.

RX-Heven

iTrader: (1)

Here's info on the HKS and GReddy trannies. HKS-USA has sold only one of these in the states. $11,000 msrp. Recomended max power range 700-800 hp & 650 ft/lbs torque. Comes with a flywhell and triple-disc clutch setup. They are primarily drag race setups, but only require a gear ratio change to accomodate a road course, the ONLY other set of gear ratios avaliable. Took the guy a couple of minutes to think of one car that is using it on a circuit. HKS will not sell parts for it and requires you to send them (in %$#%^$ Japan) the entire tranny for an overhaul. 6-speed for the fd. 5 or 6-speed for the fc. Not a good deal in my mind, but then again I'm only a rational person.

GReddy doesn't even make a transmission they told me and laughed. Made me feel like a real jackass.

So, uh, like I said earlier, HKS and GReddy need not apply

TYSON

Don't you just wish a public bitch-slapping was a more socially acceptable method of communication? I've heard the Greddy USA guys are ******, but this takes the cake. Greddy Transmission

Yeah, it says GREX, but they are the same company.

Node

iTrader: (1)

If you don't want to put effort into downshifting then you don't want a straight cut tranny. The problem with downshifting is you have to rev match or you'll grind.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

dude, if he called greddy and they laughed at him i doubt he's gonna want to spend, what 4? 5? 6? thousand on a transmission, no matter how good it is

mike