FEARED7

My gold Turbo 2 went to the dyno Thursday afternoon.

-first run at 6 psi put down 225 RWHP.
-second, and 3rd run at 9 psi it put down 280 RWHP
-then we started having ignition problems at 6500 RPM, we tried pulling/adding timing, adding fuel and pressure, it kept on popping really hard at 6500 rpm.
-we then added fuel and remade the timing curve and put down 323 @ wheels at 11 psi of boost. The engine misfired at 6500 and we let out of it.
-about a minute goes by and the oil buzzer starts going off. My heart dropped, and I suddenly looked under the car... All oil was on the floor .... The rear housing was cracked in 3 places.
-it really sucked knowing my engine had to be pulled because of a 20 dollar ignition coil.
-had to wait all night for someone to pick me and my car up. That really sucked, but my father pulled through for me. He drove 3 hours with a trailor and stayed up all night just to get me home.
-Steven (SPOautos) and I spent many hours in the past 2 days taking my engine out, repairing it, and putting it back in... And thank God I had some spare rear casings at my shop.

Now I have to build me a pinned engine! This crap of the rear housings not holding up is getting very old! I did make some power though! I was impressed with what that turbo got at 11 psi of boost! I was hoping to turn it up to 16-18, but didn't get a chance! Oh well, time to build me an engine that wont twist and break!

later all,
Bryan

87t2
extend port hurley 3mm race seals/springs
lower compression rotors
wolf 3d
malpassi RR regulator
4 720s
RP comp pump
Elec. cooling fan
spearco FMIC
HKS racing bypass valve
T62 Garrett w/ .81 tang style turbine housing/ .50 TO4e comp/hou
HKS t04 manifold
Turbonetics race gate
3" full exhaust
4" ram intake
SPEC 4 puck clutch and PP
bla bla bla....

AJC13B

Damn dude....sorry to hear that.

pluto

What plugs were you running? making high hp and high boost does not create twist on the motor. The only way the motor twist is when it was detonating. I know many 2nd gen making 500+rwhp w/o adding extra dole pins. sounds like you have some major tuning issue other than just the coil.

Greg

man, trust me, you wont need dowl pins on your motor. All you need it for someone who knows what they are doing to tune your car. Honestly, after the second ping, you should have called ron foreman or talked to someone who knows some good maps for the wolf 3d

FEARED7

Whats up. The car had problems right around 6500. I don't believe it was detonation. What happenen was when the engine misfired, fuel smoke just poured out the pipes. And also when it popped the car whould freakin tremble like no other... I am suprized the engine mounts are still there! lol. I put another coil on the car, but haven't yet chanced the popping yet. The plugs that are in the car are 4 stock NGK trailing plugs with accel 8.8 plug wires. I have a Jacobs pro pac that I thought was defective, but now I think it was just the coil. So hopefully that will resolve the situation. The tuner had all the numbers right. A/F ratio was anywhere between 11.8 and 12.2, The EGT's never got above 1400F. The probe is mounted close to the turbine housing on the DP. The Trailing plugs fired 15 degrees after the leading. at full boost the timing droppes down below 18 or so degrees at 6K + RPM. The tuner said everything looks right, but something else was wrong. We just didn't figure it out in time.

Another thing, I have heard a lot of bad things about the end casings cracking. I can't see how people make that kind of HP with them. If you have time, Drop me a line... EXCESboost@aol.com. I need to find the solution to my problem!

Thanks a bunch,
Bryan

RICE RACING

exactly !

ignition misfires do not crack end plates, when an ignition gets blown out you see a masive decrease in combustion chamber pressure not an uncontrolable increase as is the case with preignition causing detonation.

If your theory or your tunners theory on the misfire causing the cracking is wrong, if it was right then every time a car hit it's rev limiter and the ignition cut out (ie: misfire) then I would have cracked my end plate 500 times by now as would everyone else !

It is hard to analyse general failure like this when there are many variables to examine, however you can rule out an ignition breakdown as the cause I would say.

crispeed

I personaly think that at 10 psi an 11.8:1 A/F ratio would be right on the edge of lean! Anything leaner than that especially above 6000 rpm is cutting it real close to detonation. If your egt was approaching 1400 deg. in the DP at only 6500 rpm then it would have most likely be way above that at redline!
Which gear were you tuning the car with on the dyno?
What A/F ratio monitor were you using?
When tuning on the dyno load and A/F monitor response plays a very important role.

crispeed
87TII
9.20@150mph
651RWHP/520RWTQ

crispeed

I also have to agree!
Just imagine what would have happened to my motor when on the two step at 9500 rpm or when it bounces off the rev limiter at 10.5K!
Extra dowels might help when something might be slightly off but I've seen motors with extra dowels do more damage than good if you run into heavy detonation or pre ignition!
The key is not to DETONATE!

crispeed
87TII
9.20@150mph
651RWHP/520RWTQ

HWO

hate to say it buddy, but that is what happens when you detonate bad enough with 3mm seals in it, you crack the plate cause it's the next weekest link in the strength chain.

Seals
Plates
Rotor Combustion Face

the strength chain when you ping ping ping.

Dont ping and you wont break anything.

crispeed

crispeed
87TII
9.20@150mph
651RWHP/520RWTQ

waynespeed

Upgrade your injectors to be on the safe side. Double check your timing on ALL coils just to play it safe.

HWO

Chris - opps forgot about that one aye, slipped my mind

Steve_Cappelli

FWIW, I ran the hp numbers against the equation at
http://www.rceng.com/technical.htm.

I took the 323 rwhp multiplied it by 1.15 to get a bhp of 371. Using: [list=1][*]a BSFC of .62 (.65 is probably closer) and [*]an apparent fuel pressure of 45psi (adjusted 1:1 for boost), and[*] a max duty cycle of 80%, [/list=1]
you need ~71 lb/hour of fuel, or 4, 743cc injectors. By the numbers, you're about 80cc short (total) on the injectors. Though I'm sure there are other factors to consider...

Thx,
Steve Cappelli

FEARED7

Hey Fellas, thanks for the replys. I have put another leading coil on the car. I have yet to run it over 7K. But it doesn't pop at 6500 like it did at the dyno. If I didn't have a customers car in my shop I would take my chances and run it on up. Chris, we didn't get a chance to put a boost controller on the car. We were tuning by load percentages and since it was only running 11 psi of boost, it would only go to 62-75% load. Once I turn up the boost, I can start tuning the higher load %ages. Right now the wolf 3d is set on 21 psi mode, if you do not already know, that means it doesn't reach 100% load until it reaches or supasses that 21 psi setting. So what do you guys reccomend for EGT's while tuning at wide open throttle, and at higher RPMs? I am right there to getting it complete.

PS. I am sending some injectors to RC. I may put 2 more 550s in line for protection!

thanks for your help everyone!
Bryan