SLOASFK

iTrader: (5)

The dealer markup on the GT can't be blamed on Ford. MSRP was $135k, not $250k. And whether or not you like them, vipers or S7s, they are american supercars which prove the point you were making. I sure as hell don't like the Viper, but it's a good American car.

Also, you realize Ford was in partial control from the time the 7 was first created, right? The 8 isn't the first "Ford" rotary, it's the second(or 4th, if you break up the generations). And besides that, the 8 is a great car for what it is, and it sells really well...so...ya...Ford isn't doing a bad job at all. You do realize that Mazda was on the verge of bankruptcy before Ford stepped in, right?

spot_skater

It was my understanding that Mazda kept the rotary, and everything about it, STRICTLY under Mazda's control...basically having nothing to do with ford. Also, doesn't Ford own like 65% of Mazda?

adrock3217

Spotskater speaks the truth, except, I think Ford only owns closer to 50%. I know when they first got into Mazda, it was a clean-cut 33%, but Mazda kept tanking.

And no, Ford has absolutely nothing to do with rotary building, they never ever tried to make one, etc. Chevrolet successfully made 2, 3, and 4 rotor variants of the Corvette, all of which made VERY high horsepower numbers (I think the 4 rotor was rumored to be 600-700 hp?). The die-hard Chevy fans said NO and that project was closed for the more conventional V8.

Mercedes had their fair share of rotary building, all of which was unsuccessful, to my understanding.

Ford determines how much money Mazda spends on R&D, how many cars they make, sets quotas for how many they must sell, etc. Ford does not do any of the R&D for the rotary, the sequential system in the FD, any of its styling, or the 8's, for that matter. They PROBABLY gave the "ok" on its styling and its amenities, but they did not design any of it.

Mis-information is bad for the soul, and should require ban-age.

spot_skater

Or at least a carrot, courtesy of RedR1.

SLOASFK

iTrader: (5)

my point is that Ford kept Mazda alive. If not for Ford, there would be no 7.

Thus I said "Ford" rotaries, not Ford rotaries.

I think we're all on the same page with this, just conveying what we're saying in different ways.

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

A little back to radar detectors.... No they are not illegal in CA. They are only illegal in two states in the US. BUT they also are not very usefull unless you are lucky. Just like one guys friend found out. Most cops use laser technology now and if that lil buzzer goes off on your radar/laser detector it is basically telling you that you are screwed... And a lot of cops that still use radar will flip it on and clock someone lickity split (why one guys' friend's detector went nuts only a few moments before seeing the cop). They CAN save you in some situations.....but those are getting fewer and farther between.

Rotary Noob

I never reffered to mazdas financial condition. Ford did attempt to make a rotary engine, for Ford motor co. They did fail. GM however spent 50 million on making a rotary, and were planning on using it in vettes, and other high performance high horse power vehicles. They didnt however know how to muffle it effectively enough, and die hard enthusiasts werent liking the idea much.

93VR, i wasnt trying to not include them. I did forget those vehicles when i typed up that list, and thanks for the correction on the GT price. Its still too much, but its lower than 250 at least.

Anyways, at least I didnt get flamed as much as i did in previous threads! Thanks guys! (Honestly, not sarcastic)

DCrosby

a GPS system that tells you where cops are !

Maybe the ones that are so fat they can't move for 6mo.

GPS technology works like you did when you were a kind and couldn't read street signs... you knew where you were by seeing familiar things, one house wouldn't neccisarily do it, but with two or three and maybe a playground where you knew which way the swings pointed... BINGO you knew how to get home...

GPS is nothing but a bunch of atomic clocks in a static orbit, spewing out GMT onto the globe and since you know the distance that that orbit sits in, and you can compare one clock's "Idea" of time to another and you know how fast that signal can travel through space, you know how far away that particular sattelite is from you...

This alone won't tell you where you're at, but once you compare one disatnce to another you start gettng converging lines. Enough of those lines and you have a cross... and that's all you need for X & Y Position plus you get altitude as a bonus... and if you compare where you are, and where you were 2 seconds ago, if you've moved you can get a bearing N. E. S. W. etc...

cool_as_crap

ford owns 33% of mazda.

cool_as_crap

radar jammers are illegal in cali, that might be what your thinking. radar detectors are only illegal here in big rigs. not sure why

SLOASFK

iTrader: (5)

34.5%

Rotary Noob

LOL, now youre just going after the small ****. If ford owns 33 or 34.5 or 98234593475908374987%, it doesnt matter either way.

Theyre actually illegal in most if not all trucks, reason being they are considered commerical vehicles. There are different laws governing commercial and personal vehicles, thats why. I dont remember the specific thing.

Richter12x2

iTrader: (1)

That's alright, back when I was a dumb kid, I had a $20 Walmart radar detector save me a trip to jail. It was about 3 in the morning, and a friend of mine and I were trying to cover 200 miles through Texas and Louisiana before class in the morning at 8am - I was doing 110mph in a 55 when I hit Ruston, Louisiana. The radar detector went *chirp* and that was it. I looked on the onramp and here comes a Police Jeep Cherokee down the onramp. I stood up on the brakes and got down to 70 before he pulled me over.

He was going to write me a ticket for 70 in a 55, but when I pulled my driver's license he saw my student ID. Thank God for Alumni!

Rotary Noob

Nice!

Ive never had a cop pull me over and not get a ticket though...

Richter12x2

iTrader: (1)

I had it happen 3 times in one week. :P I was driving my wife's candy apple red mustang convertible with a body kit, 17" Cobra R wheels and Saleen covers on it. It seems like every cop who saw me pulled me over, even though I wasn't speeding, although I do tend to lay on the gas from a stop (but not to the point of squealing the tires or anything).

One said "I know it's a fast car and you want to drive it like it was meant to be driven" - and I'm thinking - "Well, it's a 140hp v6, I'm just trying to to get it to GO"

Rexpelagi

It wouldn't be easy but I'm sure it could be done. Besides most cops probably use GPS anyway, so if their location is known by the satellites then it could be known by you.

Granted this is more of an NSA level project than your average joe project, since GPS is probably one of the top secure systems we use, but it is possible.

Richter12x2

iTrader: (1)

It's not a GPS technology explicitly but it's tied into GPS for location purposes. A lot of companies with company vehicles use a locator so that they can tell where the vehicles are going. So the taxi company knows that the cab driver's not parked in front of the titty bar for 5 hours during lunch - or that "sales trip to wyoming" was actually a "ski trip to Colorado".

TheAbsence

iTrader: (19)

I'm not calling you BS, but can you cite your sources, simple because I've never heard of this, and want to read up on it.

Rotary Noob

History
First Wankel Engine DKM54 (Drehkolbenmotor), at the Deutsches Museum in Bonn, Germany
First Wankel Engine DKM54 (Drehkolbenmotor), at the Deutsches Museum in Bonn, Germany
Wankel Engine NSU KKM 57P (Kreiskolbenmotor), at Autovision und Forum, Germany
Wankel Engine NSU KKM 57P (Kreiskolbenmotor), at Autovision und Forum, Germany

In 1951, Wankel began development of the engine at NSU (NSU Motorenwerke AG), where he first conceived his rotary engine in 1954 (DKM 54, Drehkolbenmotor) and later the KKM 57 (the Wankel rotary engine, Kreiskolbenmotor) in the year 1957. The first working prototype DKM 54 was running on February 1, 1957 at the NSU research and development department Versuchsabteilung TX.[1]

Considerable effort went into designing rotary engines in the 1950s and 1960s. They were of particular interest because they were smooth and very quiet running, and because of the reliability resulting from their simplicity.

In the United States, in 1959 under license from NSU, Curtiss Wright Corp. pioneered minor improvements in the basic engine design. Curtis-Wright takes 50% of the license income made in the USA and limited its development activity to a minimum.

In Britain, in the 1960s, Rolls Royce Motor Car Division at Crewe, Cheshire, pioneered a two-stage Diesel version of the Wankel engine.

Also in Britain Norton Motorcycles developed a Wankel rotary engine for motorcycles, which was included in their Commander and F1; Suzuki also produced a production motorcycle with a Wankel engine, the RE-5. Arctic Cat produced snowmobiles powered by 303cc Wankel rotary engines in 1971 and 1972. John Deere Inc, in the US, had a major research effort in rotary engines and designed a version which was capable of using a variety of fuels without changing the engine. The design was proposed as the power source for several US Marine combat vehicles in the late 1980s.
NSU Wankel Spider, the first line of cars sold with Wankels
NSU Wankel Spider, the first line of cars sold with Wankels

After occasional use in automobiles, for instance by NSU with their Ro 80 model, Citroën with the M35 and GS Birotor using engines produced by Comotor, and abortive attempts by General Motors and Mercedes-Benz to design Wankel-engine automobiles, the most extensive automotive use of the Wankel engine has been by the Japanese company Mazda.

After years of development, Mazda's first Wankel engined car was the 1967 Mazda Cosmo. The company followed with a number of Wankel ("rotary" in the company's terminology) vehicles, including a bus and a pickup truck. Customers often cited the cars' smoothness of operation. However, Mazda chose a method to comply with hydrocarbon emission standards that while less expensive to produce increased fuel consumption just before a sharp rise in fuel prices. Mazda later abandoned the Wankel in most of their automotive designs, but continued using it in their RX-7 sports car until August of 2002 (RX-7 importation for North America ceased with the 1995 model year). The company normally used two-rotor designs, but received considerable attention with their 1991 Eunos Cosmo, which used a twin-turbo three-rotor engine. In 2003, Mazda introduced the RENESIS engine with the new RX-8. The RENESIS engine relocated the ports for exhaust and intake from the periphery of the rotary housing to the sides, allowing for larger overall ports, better airflow, and further power gains. The RENESIS is capable of delivering 250 hp from its minute 1.3 L displacement at better fuel economy, reliability, and environmental friendliness than any other Mazda rotary engine in history.
3-Rotor Eunos Cosmo engine
3-Rotor Eunos Cosmo engine

Although VAZ, the Soviet automobile manufacturer, is known to have produced Wankel-engine automobiles, and Aviadvigatel, the Soviet aircraft engine design bureau, is known to have produced Wankel engines for aircraft and helicopters, little specific information has surfaced in the outside world; what has been seen indicates a general similarity to Wankel designs by NSU, Comotor, and Mazda, therefore it is likely that many Western patents were infringed[citation needed] upon by these designs, the probable reason for their being hidden.

The People's Republic of China is also known to have experimented with Wankel engines, but even less is known in the West about the work done there, other than one paper, #880628, delivered to the SAE in 1988 by Chen Teluan of the South China Institute of Technology at Guangzhou.

Although many manufacturers licensed the design, and Mercedes-Benz used it for their C111 concept car, only Mazda has produced Wankel engines in large numbers. As of 2006, the engine is only available new in the Mazda RX-8.

Thats from Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wankel_engine is the full link.

That article doesnt mention however that GM was developing a 4 rotor (much like mercedes did with the C-111) for the Corvette, but couldnt find a way to properly muffle the exhaust note, and make it fuel efficient, so they sold their works to Mazda.

The rotary motor was also scheduled to debut in the 1975 Pacer. Since it didnt comply with emissions at the time however, they threw in an inline 6.

Hope you enjoy the article.

TheAbsence

iTrader: (19)

Thanks!

Rotary Noob

Welcome anytime.

Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

It's called the K40 Undetectable System.

brouli

thread is old but i suppose after you guys start racing some Rx-7 fly by you thats why you posting that here
good job on the race bro