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Upgrading our road course Rx7 with a proper fuel cell

Old 01-06-15, 11:57 AM
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Upgrading our road course Rx7 with a proper fuel cell

Last season we used a fuel cell with no internal baffling, just foam. We used an external fuel pump with the pickup at the back bottom. I assumed this would be enough for anything above 1/4 tank, but I was wrong. Anything below 1/2 would starve the fuel system completely dry. The car would lose all power, and the datalogs showed fuel pressure dropping off completely. Keeping the tank above 1/2 would prevent most of this.

We were going to cut the tank in half and baffle it, but I learned there is a lot more to it that just adding trap doors here and there, drilling holes etc.

We are installing one of Aftermarket Industries Fuel cells instead. These are a proven unit in Australia, and it makes sense as we carry them now. They spent a lot of time studying F1, Nasa, and the Oil industries published studies in addition to their own in house work. They have spent near 1 million in R & D on their products.

They also offer a bunch of surge tanks for guys using their stock tanks.

You can read more about them in my signature link to our inline blog.

Here is also a cool link showing how much a fuel really sloshes inside a tank;

Attached Thumbnails Upgrading our road course Rx7 with a proper fuel cell-aftermarket-industries-fuel-cell-internals.jpg   Upgrading our road course Rx7 with a proper fuel cell-aifuelcell.jpg   Upgrading our road course Rx7 with a proper fuel cell-sp1200-internals.jpg  
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Old 01-06-15, 01:24 PM
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this is a great topic and something people have been trying to overcome for ever in fuel cells....interesting to see the baffles.

i have seen everything from secondary pumps feeding a chamber with a primary pump to the snow mobile pick up screens like below.



and a REALLY cool new product from Holley that works using magic and unicorn blood.

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Old 01-06-15, 03:54 PM
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I forgot to mention these fuel cells have their built in SP1200 5 litre surge tank. The single walbro 460lph is the lifter pump, and the SP1200 fits inside the arrangement above it.

I have played with Holley unit at the PRI show. If all the possible problems are worked out with them, then we might add them to the fuel cells too.
Attached Thumbnails Upgrading our road course Rx7 with a proper fuel cell-internal-surge-tank.jpg  
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Old 01-06-15, 04:05 PM
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How the hell do you spend a million on R&D and not have any certs?
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Old 01-06-15, 06:59 PM
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In my track only FD I run a 25 gal Fuel Safe Enduro fuel cell and their in-tank collector (surge tank) with a Bosch 044 inside the collector. My return line from the pressure regulator dumps back into the collector. I have never had a problem with this setup and have run the tank down to a gallon or two during events.

Before I installed the fuel cell, I used an external (1/2 gallon) surge tank in addition to the OEM tank. I used the OEM pump as a lift pump and an external Bosch 044 as the pressure pump. This setup was goofy looking with all the fuel lines, but it also worked very well.

In both setups, I used the OEM hard fuel lines to bring the fuel to the regulator. From the front and rear of the OEM fuel lines I use Earls hard line to AN 6 adapters. This delivers plenty of fuel for 415 RWHP.


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Old 01-07-15, 05:15 AM
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^

What he said. There are plenty of proven solutions from ATL and Fuelsafe. When we had the road race car, we ran a Fuelsafe in tank surge tank along with an external one quart tank. Foam alone isn't going to cut it. Return line ran through the external into the internal. Ran out of fuel twice on track in practice sessions after forgetting to gas up. Both times I got about 1 mile warning from the first lean hiccup until we were bone dry. Really no reason to reinvent the wheel.
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Old 01-07-15, 08:25 AM
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^

While I agree there are other options, how is it a bad thing to have more options out there? What I see is a company trying to improve upon a already good design... That's progress. If we didn't want to improve on current designs we are all driving the wrong platform cars to start with, I mean really we already know the rotary works... Why mess with it?.... Cause we can always make it better. I don't see why you guys are trying to be negative about progress...

Turblown. Good job bringing new products to the table and introducing us to other options.
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Old 01-07-15, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by 3rdgensleeper View Post
^

While I agree there are other options, how is it a bad thing to have more options out there?
I certainly am not trying to stifle creativity. My post is more directed toward individuals who may not know of the solutions that already exist.

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Old 01-11-15, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by finger lock View Post
I certainly am not trying to stifle creativity. My post is more directed toward individuals who may not know of the solutions that already exist.

Guy

+1 to that.


An important item to consider in the purchase price and install costs associated with a fuel cell is whether you'll be able to use it in. Race organizers like NHRA, SCCA, NASA have requirements on certification and such so do consider that when selecting a fuel cell.
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Old 01-20-15, 09:30 PM
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We are switching gears to the new for 2015 fia approved fuel cell inserts by AI. We are using an ATl fuel cell.
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Old 02-17-15, 09:07 AM
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Cell

Old cell for sale?
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Old 02-19-15, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Georgethefierce View Post
this is a great topic and something people have been trying to overcome for ever in fuel cells....interesting to see the baffles.

i have seen everything from secondary pumps feeding a chamber with a primary pump to the snow mobile pick up screens like below.



and a REALLY cool new product from Holley that works using magic and unicorn blood.

Holley HydraMat BangShift Sneak Peek PRI 2014 - YouTube
I just did a search on the Holley Hydramat because I thought it was an awesome idea. Then I read the bottom and it said " not compatible with Diesel fuel, Methanol or oils". Darnnit
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Old 02-21-15, 08:31 PM
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Wow! Hydramat sounds great!
$699.95 sounds like a bust!
https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/hydramat/
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Old 02-22-15, 08:56 AM
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Wow. .... not paying that
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Old 03-03-15, 02:30 PM
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https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/hydramat/

Holley has introduced some more affordable configurations.

Cheers, Philip
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Old 03-04-15, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by RX7M5GUY View Post
https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/hydramat/

Holley has introduced some more affordable configurations.

Cheers, Philip
That's more like it, I think that's a pretty doable price point.
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