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Starting my own racing organization need input

Old 07-19-02, 11:28 AM
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Red face Starting my own racing organization need input

I'm not happy with either NASA or SCCA.

I've been thinking about starting my own racing organization so those of us with turbo cars can race against ourselves, or against each other, body panel-to-body panel...

Let's get a brainstorm session started.

My idea for classing cars, would be based on laptimes and skill, not equipment...

This scheme would eliminate all the scrutineering and protests that goes on with SCCA/NASA...

Sounds simplistic, I know, but I believe this can work!

I alread have a name for the organization...Motorsports Driving Club, or MDC for short.

Currently my club is an open-track club, but I think there's potential for competitive road racing too, if there's sufficient interest in the midwest...

Didn't NASA start with ONE GUY...HSR started with TWO GUYS...

There's really nothing here in the midwest.

We have other open track clubs and high speed Solo II (Midwestern Council, but they're still affiliated with SCCA), and NASA has had NO IMPACT in the midwest...their Putnam Park HPDE was cancelled last Friday due to lack of interest!

Marque clubs require you to have a BMW, Porsche, etc., so those are somewhat restrictive as well...

Thoughts, opinions, criticisms?

Last edited by SleepR1; 07-19-02 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 07-19-02, 12:57 PM
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The good thing about that is it would make for more competitive competition, in other words if everyone is classed by time there shouldnt be someone slow holding up traffic, ect.

That is partly my prob, when I start racing I'm going to be thrown into a highly modified class with cars much faster than me due to my lack of experience. Under your systems I'll be racing with other slow people haha Thats a good thing cause that way I wont be a danger or annoyance to the fast cars.

Then again the downfall is some people might not have the "drive" to push thier car as hard if they are doing good in thier lower class cause then they would get kicked into the next class and be at the bottom. Does that make sence??? Its kinda like having fast cars sandbaging so that they can dominate a certain class without pushing thier cars that hard.

STEPHEN

Last edited by SPOautos; 07-19-02 at 12:59 PM.
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Old 07-19-02, 01:04 PM
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What are the major goals your trying to achieve with this new organization? More even playing field? Not running with slower drivers? Being able to run a moded rx7s with a close to stock z06?

What are you trying to get out of it?

STEPHEN
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Old 07-19-02, 01:09 PM
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Hmm... class people by qualifying lap time and you get bumped up a class (or otherwise penalized) for every 2-3 seconds faster than qualifying you actually run in the race. To prevent sandbagging.

Will need tweaked here and there, but how's that for a loose guide?
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Old 07-19-02, 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by peejay
Hmm... class people by qualifying lap time and you get bumped up a class (or otherwise penalized) for every 2-3 seconds faster than qualifying you actually run in the race. To prevent sandbagging.

Will need tweaked here and there, but how's that for a loose guide?

The only problem with that is it doesnt encourage people to better thier times and try harder. That is the only prob I can see, if your penalized for bettering your skills no matter if its by losing rank by moving to a higher class or by getting penalized with points its going to keep people from trying to driving harder.

It really depends on what goal you have for the winner to achieve, max speed, fastest time, most consistant, combination of all, ect... Thats kinda what I was thinking, something loosely similar to braket racing (in drag racing) might be interesting but your really racing your own time eventhoug you racing with other people. Lets say you could have some qualifying runs for a dial in time/mph similar to braket racing. Then for the race whoever's average time/mph (over a given number of laps) is closest to thier dial in time without going over wins. The problem with bracket racing is its easiest for easy cars, you take some slow *** auto Honda that just drives like Miss Daisy is in the back seat and he'll be super consistant. Thats why you break it up into categories of performace on top of the braket racing. I wish drag did that (they might some places but not here). You'll have some guy with a 40K dragster loose the pot to some guy in am auto pickup truck cause he's too consistant. Well see everyone knows the dragster is much harder to drive so its not fair. Thats where the performance classification steps in.

Damn, sorry that turned out so long....

STEPHEN

Last edited by SPOautos; 07-19-02 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 07-19-02, 06:02 PM
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Stephen,
I agree with peejay in that you would have to bump better drivers to the next class. That way you start out in a slow group but as your skills increase you move up classes so its more competitive. Sandbagging was the first thing I thought of when this was mentioned. I could drive my rx at 8/10 during qualifying and then push 10/10 and run away with it. Let people do this once is fine but next time they get bumbed to a mroe competitve class. Kind of like golf handicapping.

-Mark
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Old 07-19-02, 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by peejay
Hmm... class people by qualifying lap time and you get bumped up a class (or otherwise penalized) for every 2-3 seconds faster than qualifying you actually run in the race. To prevent sandbagging.

Will need tweaked here and there, but how's that for a loose guide?
The car is running like **** during qualifing. You fix the problem before the race and your 5 seconds faster.

You have a problem with the car that doesn't allow you to qualify. You fix it before the race. Wich class do you go out with?

Both of these things have happened to us. It's not uncommon for race cars to break. As a matter of fact I can't remember 1 race weekend that I didn't have to fix something on the car.

I think you have to have more structure. Turbo cars are very hard to class because you can basicly do things to them on the track to give them more power. It is very easy to cheat in a turbo car.
The problem is you will have to rely on people being honest about their car and mods. This is not going to happen. People will always cheat to win. It sucks but it's true.

Mike
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Old 07-19-02, 06:21 PM
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two words: Umbrella Girls
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Old 07-19-02, 06:23 PM
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The hard part to all this is getting the track, If you get the track they will race and all will be good. Format and rules are a very small part of this, you'll have to get a track owners interest to pull it off. You'll need a big pot of money up front and hope that membership dues will pay you back but if you can round up 200 of your closest friends who knows...
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Old 07-19-02, 06:25 PM
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unfortunately racing is never fair or good for everyone. every car or class has its good and bad points. NASA doesn't restrict turbo cars, they are just required to run in the unlimited class. this is the class for all types of race cars with extensive modifications that doesn't meet the specific rules of another class(kind of the run what ya brung class). I have raced with FD'd, 996 porsche's, turbo and PP FC's, tube chassis stock cars and trans am cars, as well as hondas and vintage cars. I have won races and have been blown away at times, but the classification allows me to do anything I want to my car. I sometimes wish there were more cars in our group but most races I am fighting for position the whole race, and this is what racing is all about at the club level. Pro racers and people who want to be pro drivers should be racing in the spec and high profile series and not bother with IT type classes. showroom stock and spec miata will get more exposure for future pro drivers.
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Old 07-19-02, 08:41 PM
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Like it was said earlier racing will never be fair and you will never make everyone happy. The problems are that you need rules and you need to think of saftey for everyone because you will be responsible for what happens. Lets say you have a guy running a GT-5 style mini who is running times faster than vetts and what not on certian tracks. You can not put a mini out on the track with a vett or other large cars. This happend once and the person in the mini was killed in an impact with a large GT car. The class by time could work to an extent but the cars them self would have to be limited. You would make classes that cover a wider range of cars then further devide the groups by times. But this may not work agian due to problems with qualifying, if someone breaks who is a fast driver they will be put in the slow bracket and waste everyone in that bracket. You will have to classify cars by mods and performance no matter what to make things even. You also don't want to run any formula style cars with closed wheel cars for saftey reasons. Starting a series on your own will be a very involved process to make it safe and sucessful. It may be easier to start a series under an exsisting governing body. If you get enought intrest the SCCA will help you run a new series. I know you some of you guys don't like the SCCA but they do everything possible to make things safe, fun, and fair for everyone. Even if it doesn't seem like it all the time. But the same thing will happen in your series or any other series no matter what. But good luck to you if you do start your own series!
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Old 07-20-02, 06:40 AM
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Thumbs up Thanks for the thoughts, Gentlemen

Very good ideas...I have much to consider...the largest hurdle is money and sponsorship support...

The points about safety (light small cars running with heavy cars), and parity are good ones...

Perhaps I'll start with time trials and see how that goes.

As more people get interested, perhaps the door-to-door racing will evolve from the time trials.

The other big factor is INTEREST. There must be enough INTEREST from enough RACERS to merit the effort and sponsorhip...if the demand isn't there for a special series for cars that don't fit into existing categories (NASA/SCCA), then the competition arm of Motorsports Driving Club will not be viable...
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Old 07-20-02, 06:43 AM
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Damon,

Yes, "cheesecake" is a major requirement for a successful motorsports series
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