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MT600 brake fluid

Old 01-06-05, 03:07 AM
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MT600 brake fluid

What's the brake fluid of choice for those tracking the car? I was about to swap out some old Motul fluid and just wanted to see what people were using.
Also are all compatible with our ABS? Seems the chain store (autozone, pep boys, etc) that sell dot 5 brake fluid for ordinary fluid changes aren't compatible with ABS.

Tim

Last edited by Tim Benton; 01-06-05 at 03:10 AM.
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Old 01-06-05, 09:33 AM
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I use the AP Super 600 stuff.
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Old 01-06-05, 09:39 AM
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There is no such thing as brake fluid that is incompatible with ABS to my knowledge. There is only one exception and that are the DOT 5 silicone fluids which are not compatible with DOT 3 and DOT 4 glycol based fluids. DOT 5 absolutely cannot be added to a system that contains any traces of DOT 3 or 4.

Some info on DOT 5

More info on DOT 5

Last edited by DamonB; 01-06-05 at 09:42 AM.
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Old 01-06-05, 11:44 AM
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I use ATE Super Blue Racing
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Old 01-06-05, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by DamonB
There is no such thing as brake fluid that is incompatible with ABS to my knowledge. There is only one exception and that are the DOT 5 silicone fluids which are not compatible with DOT 3 and DOT 4 glycol based fluids. DOT 5 absolutely cannot be added to a system that contains any traces of DOT 3 or 4.

Some info on DOT 5

More info on DOT 5
Agree.

I use Motul 600 exclusively. Best prices I've found is here: http://www.motodepot.com/accessories...l_service.html.

Gene
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Old 01-06-05, 02:43 PM
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I use Motul 600 on my race bikes and it is awesome. I buy it a Marietta Motorsports. 1-888-FAST-LAP.
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Old 01-08-05, 09:34 AM
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Tim, I have used Motul 600 for a few years now while tracking the car, I have a bigger brake upgrade from Pettit and have very little fade after a hard 20 minute session( I also use Hoosier R3S03 tires). I find that I don't need to bleed the brakes but maybe 2 times a season with Motul versus the Synthetic Valvoline I used to use. I am interested in trying a new Brake fluid I saw a couple of months ago in Grasssroots MS mag, but I don't recall the name(its supposed to have a lower affinity for capturing moisture and a slightly higher boiling point)
Art
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Old 01-13-05, 02:07 PM
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Careful there, too low an affinity for water means water pools instead, and water boils easily. As long as you bleed before every event it should be fine though.
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Old 01-15-05, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Gene
Careful there, too low an affinity for water means water pools instead, and water boils easily. As long as you bleed before every event it should be fine though.
Yep, Art does bleed before every event (as well as if needed before sessions).

For the record, I used ATE Super Blue. I run the stock brakes with N-Tech Lapping pads (and Victoracers). My car isn't a dedicated track car so that is the reason I picked Super Blue over Motul.
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Old 01-17-05, 01:28 AM
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dont they make a 5.1 for compatiblity with dot3/4 ??
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Old 01-17-05, 03:47 PM
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In general the whole moisture in your brake fluid is a myth.

Dow, who is the worlds largest manufacturer of brake fluid did testing on brand new cars and cars that had been out of service for 2+ years sitting on dealer lots. The result was the cars on dealer lots had less than 0.01% more moisture in the fluid than the brand new fluid. It's just a myth to sell more fluid.
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Old 01-17-05, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by M's
In general the whole moisture in your brake fluid is a myth.
It's not a myth, it's fact. Water absorption is the biggest reason that silicone DOT 5 fluid was invented. Anybody who spends much time on the track at all can tell you that the fluid absorbs moisture. Since water boils at a much lower temp than any brake fluid the pedal can get soft quickly when pushed hard if the fluid is not kept fresh. Flushing once a year is normally fine but some track junkies may need it more often.

Often times you can spot a car with lots of moisture in the brake fluid when you flush it. If the old fluid comes out sort of "foggy" and with lots of tiny, tiny bubbles that is water, not air.

A normal street car doesn't notice the problem as much because it never gets the brakes hot enough to cause the water in the fluid to boil. You don't notice a problem until the fluid gets hot and the water boils. This makes the fluid compressable and gives a spongy pedal that will appear to have fixed itself when everything cools off.

Last edited by DamonB; 01-17-05 at 04:20 PM.
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Old 01-17-05, 05:11 PM
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I know most racers bleed before (and during ) every event. While I think that's overkill in our light cars I do bleed my race car every 3 months. Motul has a reputation as being prone to moisture absorption.

Last edited by cpa7man; 01-17-05 at 05:13 PM.
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Old 01-17-05, 06:19 PM
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Go with super blue. Most other high temp brake fluids will absorb water over time but the ATE won't become contaminated as quickly. Basically you can track the car all year with this stuff if you only go to a few events.

If your an advanced driver really pushing the limits I would bleed just a bit quarterly

I've only had a pedal go soft once on an FD and I was using fresh AP 600. I was using a wilwood BBK that did not have thermlock pistons and they would boil the fluid about every other session giving me a soft pedal. It's not a good feeling but I still had brakes. What I'm trying to say is the fluid is important and keeping the brakes bled etc....but the most important thing is having good brakes, ducting, and pads to start with.
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Old 01-18-05, 08:10 AM
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I personally alternate between ATE Super Blue and Motul 600......that way when you're flushing the system you can tell when the old stuff is all out. I think they're both superb, and plenty good for the normal open track weekend (true pure racing maybe different).

Though I have to say it's fun when you're autocrossing and some uninformed tech inspector thinks you've poured windshield washer fluid in your brake reservoir....
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Old 01-18-05, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by TailHappy
I personally alternate between ATE Super Blue and Motul 600......that way when you're flushing the system you can tell when the old stuff is all out.
Super Blue has a GOLD color fluid of the exact same stuff, just for that purpose.
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Old 01-19-05, 08:28 AM
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Good deal. I usually just buy it off the shelf and had never seen that anywhere.
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Old 01-19-05, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Mahjik
Super Blue has a GOLD color
Now if that isn't confusing
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Old 01-19-05, 10:56 AM
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ATE Type 200 = amber color
ATE Superblue = blue color

otherwise same specs: 536 dF dry boiling point, 392 dF wet boiling point, moderately hygroscopic

http://www.cohttp://www.conti-online..._fluid_en.html

ATE is the brand name (from the Alfred Teves Company, founded 1906).
Manufacturer's current corporate name is Continental Teves AG & Co.
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Old 01-19-05, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by TailHappy
Good deal. I usually just buy it off the shelf and had never seen that anywhere.
Yep, I typically order mine from here: http://www.motiveproducts.com/04fluids.html
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Old 01-19-05, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Rx_treme
dont they make a 5.1 for compatiblity with dot3/4 ??
according to the link gfelber yes

DOT 5.1
Polyglycol based brake fluid, exceeds the highest DOT specs. For use in all systems that require a DOT 3, DOT 4 or DOT 5.1 fluid. The container is filled with nitrogen gas to increase shelf life and eliminate contamination while factory sealed. DO NOT MIX THIS PRODUCT WITH SILICONE BRAKE FLUIDS.
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