1revn3rdgen

iTrader: (27)

I have heard that you could use just apexi solenoid with the power fc to control boost.Is this true?If so how do i wire the solenoid to the power fc so i could run it without buying the whole boost controller kit?Has anybody done it before?i tryed searching but i didn't find anything.

Thanks,
Tom

DaleClark

iTrader: (55)

The boost control kit comes with a higher-resolution MAP sensor than the stocker and the boost control solenoid. Really, the PFC's boost control is pretty basic - the main reason people have bought the kit is for the better MAP sensor, and there's other alterantives out there.

You'd be far better off with a good electronic boost controller, IMHO.

Dale

rotorbrain

im running the power fc boost control kit. dale is right. . . the kit comes with a "larger" map sensor. you can use the apexi solenoid by plugging it into the cars boost control harness connector. basically, all youre doing is replacing the stock sensor with a higher end unit. if you are still in sequential mode, i would suggest going with something else. the power fc boost control solenoid (which is just an avcr solenoid) is evidently "over par" when it comes to controlling stock sequentials.

books

iTrader: (8)

When I had sequential twins I had good results just using the PFC to control boost.

I now have a single turbo and initially attempted to control boost with Apexi boost control kit solenoid (used the stock map sensor). The boost would oscillate quite a bit. I later switch to a Profec Spec II which resolved the oscillation issue.

There is another individual who posted in this section a while ago who had success using the boost kit solenoid with his Apexi RX6 turbo kit.

1revn3rdgen

iTrader: (27)

Thanks, for the input.I wanted to use the solenoid for a single turbo application. im running a greddy t78 but i guess i will go another route.

rotorbrain

for the record, i dont have any trouble setting boost with the kit. maybe it was the duty cycle that was off, books? basically, you set the boost to your max. . . then play with the duty cycle until it reaches that max boost level smoothly, this can be done by viewing boost in the scale mode on the commander. . . just watch it. . . and make sure it has a smooth curve. if its off, youll know. . . the curve will spike, and youll have bad responce. i always start with a low duty cycle and gradually move it up until i feel its good and smooth. its very much like setting boost with the avcr.

books

iTrader: (8)

When using the PFC to control boost; I use the same method you do start low and incrementally increase the duty cycle. That is how I did it with the twins and that is how I attempted with the single turbo and boost kit solenoid. With the twins boost control was very good. Others indicated they had problems controlling boost with the twins and I often thought it was possible their settings were incorrect.

Because of how successful the PFC controlled boost on my twins is why I opted to try the boost control kit solenoid on my single. And of course, money was another factor. As I stated previously I know of at least one individual who had used this setup with success. Since most electronic boost kits consist of a solenoid and some electronics to control the solenoid, I reasoned that the PFC’s electronics would perform an adequate job. However, based on my (not at all conclusive experience) the electronics is what seems to differentiate one controller from the next. In fact I switched the Apexi and Profec solenoids several times in an attempt to isolate the oscillation problem.

I have at least twenty-something Excel spreadsheets of logs containing different duty cycle and boost settings; nearly all of them oscillate. While driving one may not notice the oscillation but it is quite evident in the logs especially when graphed. In at least one log containing 4 consecutive wot boost runs you can see the PFC learning. The boost curve is almost smooth by the fourth wot. The difference in rpms between when target boost is reached from the 1st vs. the 4th run is an increase in 1,000 rpms. Using the Profec Spec II, I reach target boost 1,000 rpms sooner than the 1st run using the PFC.

For a target boost of 0.9 kg/cm^2 I have used duty cycles of 32,36,38,40,44, and 54. I believe all the settings oscillated. As you are aware a low duty cycle should not cause an overshoot and thus no oscillation. I also varied the target boost while keeping the duty cycles fixed again this is from recollection but I believe they all oscillated. I am puzzled as to why no settings worked. However, once the Profec was installed no oscillations occurred


If you are interested, I can send you a few logs, just pm me your email address.

beaumondt

other than the solenoid what else do you need to get the pfc boost controller working ?

I was told you cant just wire up a solenoid and away you go, is this correct ?



Thanks

Terry

Cubes

The PFC boost controller is I feel better than what I call manual elec. boost controllers.

The Manual elec boost controllers are ones that only allow a fixed adjustment of duty cycle and gain. In other words the ebc doesn't vary the duty cycle to hold the boost you wish, its fixed throughout the rev range.

The smarter elec ebc's such as the Apexi PFC/AVCR, Blitz SBC-iD, and Greedy EO-1 I believe its called has you enter a target boost pressure you wish to obtain, it then 'learns' what duty cycle is required at various parts of the rpm in order to hold that boost level accurately.

In the past I've had issues with 'learning ebc's' and spiking, this is due to teaching the ebc in second and third gear, it really should be loaded up from a low rpm in fourth if you don't want spiking to occur.

If your pushing your turbo to its limits the 'learning' ebc's are a much better option as in most circumstances they eliminate boost tailing off at high rpm.

books

iTrader: (8)

I assume you have the PFC and commander. If that's the case then all you need is the solenoid. The solenoid just plugs into the existing harness.

However if you are running high levels of boost, you'll need a different map sensor.

rotarypower101

iTrader: (1)

Great post books. Thank you

So am I to assume you are now using the profec II exclusively?

And are you inferring that once the PFC does learn, that it will respond as fast as the profec? Or am I reading your statement incorrectly, can you please clarify?

“In at least one log containing 4 consecutive wot boost runs you can see the PFC learning. The boost curve is almost smooth by the fourth wot. The difference in rpms between when target boost is reached from the 1st vs. the 4th run is an increase in 1,000 rpms. Using the Profec Spec II, I reach target boost 1,000 rpms sooner than the 1st run using the PFC.”

books

iTrader: (8)

thanks

I am using the Profec exclusively now. I may revisit the Apexi solenoid option again, primarily because I just prefer the stealth, stock look. However I am fairly certain I tested it sufficiently.

My remark about the PFC learning was to simply state that the learning characteristic of the PFC actually does work. I was mildly surprised to see it represented in my graphs of the logs so quickly. The boost graph of each run is progressively smoother than the previous run. But it seemed as I changed from one level of boost to another, the controller would have to go through the learning cycle again, even if the boost level was used previously.

At one time I posted in the 3rd gen section graphs comparing boost control of the Apexi solenoid vs. the Profec. I believe the Profec responds better, it certainly holds boost solid.

One last comment, I have noticed as the temp drops even the Profec needs some slight adjustment to keep the boost level at your target.