Check out this website. You can tune your car by using your wide band and data logging. I use it on my FD and it works great, I just put in my target AFR's and drive around logging then run it through the program and Poof, I have a new tune. You just need a wide band with data logging capabilities and a programmable EMS. Lots of good information on the site and plenty of help.

http://ppo2performance.com/docs/

 

wow.

not trying to knock but that sounds like a horrible idea, simply because the majority of the human population is not smart enough. i know there's a disclaimer and stuff but.. every car is different.

i'd like to see a dyno sheet and the fuel/timing maps off a car tuned with that program.

 

I totally agree with a majority of the population not being able to figure it out but for that matter most of the population does not know how to change a flat tire. If you have a wide band O2 sensor in your car and an after market EMS you are not a majority of the population. If you modify your car and are willing to read a learn a little about it and would like use the "science" of tuning instead of handing over your keys to someone tuning by "feel" it is well worth doing it yourself.

I don't have a dyno sheet, but my car did go from un-drivable to all my target AFR's where I want them!

 

Sounds interesting, + 1 for a visual reference of the changes thatd back up the claim but again not everyones car is the same

 

This is for any car with a programmable EMS that can log data. When you data log it takes all the readings from the sensors in YOUR car. The program runs through all that data and is able to give you a new fuel map for YOUR car. It is not car specific. We have used it on multiple stand alone and piggy back systems. I would recommend reading the material on the website to understand, and if you have questions feel free to ask them.

 

Chris, I think what tatakai is trying to hit on is the fact that sure your afr's are in line, but as far as the actual performance of the car there is no real telling sign of how good the tune is. Hitting afr's is one thing, having the car perform well with those afr's is another. But definitely a good concept and there could definitely be a good market for your program you've developed if you are able to provide more documentation to back it up. I would suggest some dyno sessions and other guinea pig cars to build some strength in the product

 

if all else fails would at least be a great way to get a nice base map in, and then fine tune on the dyno later by a pro. the less time they spend on your car fine tuning it the cheaper it is

 

Well if this works as stated I think it's a great tool to create base maps and possibly better than base maps w/o wasting tons of bucks on a shitty local tuner or mega bucks on a good out of town tuner.

Will this make the tightest and most reliable/powerful map out of thin air?? Most likely not since there are just wayyyy too many variables involved with a really profession tune.

I've read the FAQ/Help section and the process to creating a "tune" seems like any other EMS
setup software although there is no "tune" adjustment till the very end. This is really the only aspect that bothers me. It's not real time. It's drive drive drive log log log and then create a tune. This assumes that the initial basemap is correct enough to not wash out rings in a new build or that you drive differently while you break a motor in.

For a seasoned motor probably not an issue but for somethign with zero miles this could have horrible results. Too rich on a new motor is just as bad as too lean.

I guess that there just isn't a safety net with this sort of setup. Just do a base and log data then hope that the base map was good enough to begin with.

The other thing is timing looks to be left out of this system?? I'd like clarification on this.
Can the software incorporate EGT/Knock data?

Without timing I just don't see a really good tune ever happening, especially since most users are bound to be force inducted in one way or another.

Good luck with the program though, any progress in making EMS systems easier to use is a great benefit to the industry.

 

We have the timing calculations done (I just need to write the software); but bad news.... the twin plugs on the Rotaries do not have an existing physics model like a piston motor does. So given the science that exists today - us rotary guys are kinda SOL on timing. What I am going to do is use the timing calcs on my leading plugs; and run my normal trailing split timing to see if it has a power benifit and how "safe" it is.

* The software can easily utilize a knock sensor the same way that it get the stats on AFR, Fueling etc.... so that is not a big deal to add. I'll put it in the next release.

* As for the Basemap issue - it is an issue; and no one has really ever been able to overcome it - grab a book by Jeff Hartmen, Mark Warner etc... and it will say as a Step One: Go get a Basemap from the closest engine set-up that you can find... LOL. If you read up on the site - you can see how the tune warehouse might help out new users with a Basemap.

* The current issue as far as investment of both time and capitol is stifled by the fact that moving forward - it becomes super difficult to go back and change some of the core programming. So we have released the Beta to try to get as much feedback as possible prior to moving to the next step in the process. So if your curious or interested; you can run the software and see the tunes - but don't load them on your car if anything seems wierd.

* Next weekend I am looking to do 4-5 Evo's and an Sti; I have a Skyline, Integra, a few RX8's, Faille's FD that have been tuned; so more info and dyno results will be coming soon. The video on the home page has two before and after dyno comparisons we did... my car had an ignition issue; but you can still see the changes to the curve.

Well - anyway; I love the feedback so far - if anyone has any other questions check out the site and let me know where we are falling down and I'll try to get them corrected.

 

exactly. it'd be like tuning all afr's to 14.7, and telling people that is the best possible tune because it's stoic.

also the lack of ignition timing is an issue. the reason why s-afc and piggy backs are bandaids and not a replacement for standalone, is because they do not compensate ignition timing. turbo-ing an n/a motor and running it off just a piggy back is a horrible idea, asking for detonation due to advanced timing. you can only do so much with a knock sensor.



don't get me wrong, i think it's a great idea, but in it's beta form there's no way i'd run my motor with it.

 

Again; the method to best use this software is to think "I know what I want; but not sure how to get there..." If you know enough about tuning to say to yourself that running 11.5 on a boosted Rotary is a pretty safe bet - now how much duration do you need to hit that Target? The software will give you that information.

 

Any updates?

 

IMOP, A/F tuning is the easy part. Timing is the part that either makes a engine last, or numbers the days a motor has yet to live. CJ

 

Kane will be coming into Seattle on the 10-11 of September. I'm having a BBQ at my place the evening of the 10th.

If you are interested in stopping by, please check out the website and download the latest version of the Beta and read up on how to do your own tuning. We are looking for all the feedback you can give. PM me if you would like to stop by.

http://ppo2performance.com/docs/