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Are these 'carb jets" in the eshaft ("crank") something new? I've never heard of doing that. Is there some real or theoretical advantage on changing them out?
And I recommend you stop thinking in terms of numbers. Don't set a number goal, set a fun, reliable car goal.
I'm not to sure on the car jets the previous owner had the car built and I would love to keep my car as reliable as it is now I was just trying to get a ball park on what the car is capable of pushing as is or with a slightly bigger turbo and injectors?
Are these 'carb jets" in the eshaft ("crank") something new?
No, that mod has been around for decades, and it is completely legitimate for racing engines.
Originally Posted by Sgtblue
And I recommend you stop thinking in terms of numbers. Don't set a number goal, set a fun, reliable car goal.
I agree. Peak horsepower numbers really don't matter unless you are a vendor trying to use the number to sell your product to the ignorant masses. Even in a full-race application what matters is how the car performs on the track. In respect to the engine, the torque band is typically the more important factor in this case.
Originally Posted by Coleton
pushing as is or with a slightly bigger turbo and injectors?
Is your primary purpose drag racing or road racing? The turbo is sized pretty well for road racing, but that turbo is about 3 generations behind the times. For road racing, you would be much better off with a modern ball-bearing water-cooled turbo, which would allow the engine to generate power faster and more efficiently. Were it my car, I would just leave the engine components as-is and replace the turbo when it needs servicing. The power system component list looks good, it's the rest of the car that needs work.
Originally Posted by Coleton
It's what's already in the car what would I have to do to get it to 450 wheel?
If you are obsessed with a RWHP number then just put the damn thing on a dyno and see where it is right now for Christ's sake, lol. Typically, that setup will reliably produce about 400rwhp at 15psi boost, depending on tuning, environmental conditions, the type of dyno used, and other factors. Personally, I think RWHP numbers are bullshit unless you are comparing drivetrain efficiencies, but to each his own.
You will need to have a good rotary engine mechanic modify the engine to get it much over 450hp at the flywheel. I wouldn't recommend this unless it is absolutely necessary because it isn't going to be cheap. Also, many of the high-hp modifications would include things like more boost, lower-compression rotors, and larger porting, which may increase the peak hp but will reduce the low-end torque making the car more sluggish when driving in daily traffic or autocross events. This website link has a good generic breakdown of hp and mods, but it is a little outdated so be sure to check with this forum prior to following the guidance. FC3S Pro v2.0: From Mild 2 Wild - Power
Your biggest problem right now is those crappy stock springs. You could have a 3,000 hp engine, but it would do you no good if the car does nothing but slip and slide all over the road, especially when trying to take a turn. In fact, your car is rather dangerous the way it is right now because it probably has over twice the power that the stock suspension was designed to handle. Also, there is no mention of any safety equipment. The OEM brake system on these cars is pretty good, so a nice set of performance street pads is all you really need for street driving and autocross events.
If you still have contact with the previous owner, I recommend asking:
- What kind of brake pads are on the car?
- When were the oil filter pedestal o-rings last replaced?
- When were the differential clutch plates last replaced?
- How many miles are on the driveshaft?
- When were the fluids last changed? (engine oil, transmission, differential, brake fluid)
- Is there synthetic oil in the transmission and differential?
- Exactly which type of ACT clutch and pressure plate is in the car?
- What kind of flywheel?
- Can he give you a back-up copy of the Haltech map being used, or show you how to make a copy? (It will cost you about $1,500 to have somebody retune the engine if something bad happens to the current map)
Do not perform the carburetor jet mod to the eccentric oil jets unless you are building a race engine that won't see under 4000 RPM.
For a street engine not only is it unnecessary, but it lowers your oil pressure at idle to about 8 - 10 PSI.
The mod increases cooling oil flow to the rotors which only needs to be done when the engine is operated at high RPM under high load for extended periods.
You should also upgrade to a water cooled turbo. That way you don't have to deal with silliness of turbo timers, cool down idle periods, etc.
I do daily it on nice days and i would lije to have a car thats good in autox and strip. The brake pads are after market. The trans fluid was changed when the motor was built. The oil filter o rings was changed during motor rebuild the rear diff was changed 2k ago the gab shocks are 2 years old. What shocks do you guys recommend? It's a act street/strip. Idk what the fly wheel is. Yeah first and second are a little squirrelly
Are these 'carb jets" in the eshaft ("crank") something new? I've never heard of doing that. Is there some real or theoretical advantage on changing them out?
Mazda Motorsports sells direct screw-in replacement oil jets that are the same thing as stock jets with check *****/springs removed and carb jets added.
Aaron Cake
Do not perform the carburetor jet mod to the eccentric oil jets unless you are building a race engine that won't see under 4000 RPM.
For a street engine not only is it unnecessary, but it lowers your oil pressure at idle to about 8 - 10 PSI.
Can you think of any downside besides slower warm up/emissions to having the rotor oil jets? You don't need any more oil pressure at idle, there is comparatively little load on the bearings.
I believe the OP said he has all this stuff installed from the previous owner. I say, no problem- no need to rebuild the engine due to rotor oil jet mod.
I did the rotor oil jet mod along with all the other wet sump mods so my oil pressure was more like 15-20psi at idle and the bearings remain in great shape 40,000miles, 15 years and many engine builds later.
I actually originally did the mod for the lower oil pressure at idle because my turbos always smoked at idle with the higher than stock idle oil pressure from the other oil system mods.
Coleton
I'm not to sure on the car jets the previous owner had the car built and I would love to keep my car as reliable as it is now I was just trying to get a ball park on what the car is capable of pushing as is or with a slightly bigger turbo and injectors?
It looks like a good mod list from the previous owner if everything is working well and installed correctly.
You don't have the model of fuel pump listed as far as I can see- ie, Walbro makes several pumps- this is a critical component, so you need to check that out/get a good pump in there before trying to make some power.
Walbro 255lph high pressure isn't really great if you are trying to push the limits of the turbo as you imply asking how much the set-up is good for. I had to switch to the tried and proven Bosch '044. There are other cheaper alternatives now that are as good (and lots of knock offs of all pumps that are worse- buy from a well established/proven dealer).
Once you get the fuel pump sorted the set-up should be good for about the limit of the turbo, but an easy nice upgrade would be to ditch the old 1600cc injectors for ID2000s (and re-tune) for more headroom on the injectors, a better transition into 2ndaries than the 1600s and a pretty easy/safe tune change.
Go to a good tuner and he will look over the set-up carefully and decide if you are ready to tune it and how hard he wants to push it.
Turbo should be good for 450+ rwhp, but you will have to crank the boost up. Water meth can cover you to ~18psi, but if you want to be safe run unleaded race gas as well.
The S4 based engine will crack the rear dowel with any little/slight detonation at this power level. They are not suitable for a turbo engine, but it took Mazda a couple years to figure that out. Boost at your own risk. If you keep hp below 300rwhp it will last longer, but it sounds like you don't want to do that, so prepare yourself for it to crack (start shopping for good S5 TII front and rear side housings).
I'm not trying to push anything over 475 ever in this car if I do I would go ls I was asking what I could push cuz I would like to be at 400-450 wheel on one tune and 350 on a second street tune. I could imagine that 600 wheel hp would be quite a hand full in a 2900 lbs street car with small tires in the back. I have 275 rears right now and I rub on big dips
I would like to be at 400-450 wheel on one tune and 350 on a second street tune.
No, you just get one tune and adjust the power with the gas pedal. The only exception to this is if you want a separate tune for race fuel or with/without ADI.
No, you just get one tune and adjust the power with the gas pedal. The only exception to this is if you want a separate tune for race fuel or with/without ADI.
Well if you had different tunes on a computer couldn't you load them on and have a number of tunes on hand for different fuel or driving conditions. See I'm a diesel guy I have 18 tunes on hand for my 6.4 powerstroke just on my tuner.
Well if you had different tunes on a computer couldn't you load them on and have a number of tunes on hand for different fuel or driving conditions. See I'm a diesel guy I have 18 tunes on hand for my 6.4 powerstroke just on my tuner.
There is no point in doing that because the Haltech EMS is usually tuned in speed-density mode, which means the engine is tuned primarily on a grid of rpm vs. MAP. Just as long as you use the same fuel and ADI, there would be no difference in optimal tuning of the map grid. Low-load conditions will only exist when driving in a mild manner, so you can tune accordingly for maximum economy. If you want to fine-tune the transients then use an aftermarket TPS because the stock TPS is really coarse and nearly worthless. You can use other sensors to trim the fuel and ignition as desired. When you don't want to drive aggressively then just don't mash down the gas pedal to spool up the turbo to max boost as I indicated earlier, or if for some reason you need a 'valet mode' then do what DC5Daniel suggested in the previous post and simply turn down the boost so the engine does not operate at higher load values.
Why in the holy hell would you need 18 tunes for an engine?
Ok now I understand thanks for explaining that. They have that many tunes for different power levels with the dpf on and off they go up in 25hp increments and you have to include tow tunes
No, that mod has been around for decades, and it is completely legitimate for racing engines.
Originally Posted by BLUE TII
[I]
Mazda Motorsports sells direct screw-in replacement oil jets that are the same thing as stock jets with check *****/springs removed and carb jets added.
^Thanks guys. And sorry if I side-tracked the thread.
OP...even though I'm an old fart I run into guys all the time who only want to talk hp power numbers. These are the guys who have a car that runs a month and then it sits on jackstands for another 6 months because they blew it up or something else in the drivetrain let go. Like the "slow" kid who keeps getting burned after touching the stove to see if it's still hot. While most of us snicker behind their backs, they keep adding performance mods in search of hp numbers that will impress the others at the BK parking lot. Which keeps breaking ****, which keeps them rebuilding. And the dirty little secret is (as has been explained above) their car isn't that fast even when it's running.
It looks like you have a pretty nice car. Don't be THAT guy.
I do daily it on nice days and i would lije to have a car thats good in autox and strip. The brake pads are after market. The trans fluid was changed when the motor was built. The oil filter o rings was changed during motor rebuild the rear diff was changed 2k ago the gab shocks are 2 years old. What shocks do you guys recommend? It's a act street/strip. Idk what the fly wheel is. Yeah first and second are a little squirrelly
Autocross and drag are different setups, so you should decide which has priority. Once you decide, see the Race Car Tech sub-forum on this site for tips on what is currently competitive. Keep in mind that class rules and technology change constantly. Race Car Tech - RX7Club.com
I'm not a drag racer, so this is for autocross and road racing:
The GAB shocks are fine for spirited driving such as autocross, but there is no way the stock springs are still good at this age. You can replace them with a set of Racing Beat springs for mild use, or if you want to get the full potential out of your car for road racing then you would want to replace the entire setup with a good coilover system, such as Eibach ERS springs with good dampers (Koni, Bilstein, and JRZ are the most popular), camber/caster plates, and other aftermarket suspension components depending on the type of racing that you choose. You should also check to see if the mounts and bushings are old and crusty, as this will not only cause stability problems but it will also damage your suspension components. Once again, check the Race Car Tech subforum before you buy anything.
You may want to consider joining the Mazda Motorsports Team Support Program. It is totally free, and allows you to get good pricing on parts. Unlike 99% of the other so-called sponsorship programs on the internet, this one is not a scam. https://www.mazdamotorsports.com
Originally Posted by Coleton
They have that many tunes for different power levels with the dpf on and off they go up in 25hp increments and you have to include tow tunes
Oh, I see, it's jury-rigged. You shouldn't have that problem with a modern standalone EMS if it is tuned by a professional. Do you know which Haltech model is in the car?
Originally Posted by Aaron Cake
For a street engine not only is it unnecessary, but it lowers your oil pressure at idle to about 8 - 10 PSI.
It should be fine with the other oil mods listed. The oil pump is going to have a short life, but that is the price to pay for this setup.
Originally Posted by Sgtblue
It looks like you have a pretty nice car.
The engine system setup was obviously put together by somebody who knows what he is doing. I'm surprised that the OP is asking about changing any of it.
I was only thinking of doing bigger secondaries and new bb turbo the motor I want to keep it as is I was thinking of getting new shocks or coil overs if I find some at the right price
And the tunes being rigged I was stating how they are on my diesel they are by spartan diesel a very well know tuning company for diesels
The tuning quality may be good, but any technology that requires 18 separate tuning maps is totally ghetto. It sounds like they are in dire need of a new supplier for their firmware.
Look up how diesel tuning works and spartan diesel. it's way different then how you tune a gas motor there is more things to change for different results
04-07-17, 07:56 PM
