Carb to f.i.
09-21-16, 03:30 PM
#1
SAVE FOR EFI
Thread Starter
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Newton,KS.
Posts: 486
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Carb to f.i.
Looking for help on what is needed to go from my polished Weber 50 to E.F.I Hardware set up...or something similar.
I have all OEM wires/harness in tact still....but need someone to help out with ECU and sensors needed to get this done. Open to all options...but want something simple and something Rotary Performance will be able to tune.
Also means my Weber will be up for sale...will post in classifieds shortly...
Car is S4 5speed base, engine is old 13b housings with aggressive street port, running full RB exhaust, any help is appreciated ...just don't know much about Rtek, Megasquirt, AEM...etc.
I have all OEM wires/harness in tact still....but need someone to help out with ECU and sensors needed to get this done. Open to all options...but want something simple and something Rotary Performance will be able to tune.
Also means my Weber will be up for sale...will post in classifieds shortly...
Car is S4 5speed base, engine is old 13b housings with aggressive street port, running full RB exhaust, any help is appreciated ...just don't know much about Rtek, Megasquirt, AEM...etc.
09-22-16, 09:16 AM
#3
Any throttle bodies that are the same style as your Webers (IDA I assume) will be direct replacements and you can use your current intake manifold. I've not seen any detailed info on anyone running a Jenvey setup but EFIhardware and Borla Induction are also options for you. In general you will need a Throttle Position Sensor (make sure to get one with the ITB kit so you know it fits) and that's about it if you plan to tune using Alpha-N. However, Speed Density tuning is another option that is more common but can sometimes be difficult with ITB setups because of the low amounts of vacuum produced. If you want to go this route you will still need a TPS but on top of that you need a MAP (manifold absolute pressure, usually a 3-bar GM type) sensor, and an IAT (intake air temp) sensor.
Did you change the ignition setup when you added the carb? If you're running a distributor I'm not sure if this would work with FI but otherwise you would need a CAS (crank angle sensor) and stock FI coils.
Obviously you also need to get some fuel injectors. A lot of the guys in this NA performance section are switching to just running 2 ID1000 injectors in the primary injector location in the keg and not running any secondaries. Injector tech has come a long way since our cars were designed so large injectors are now able to get good idle characteristics at low duty cycles. Plus not needing to run staged injection certainly simplifies things.
What kind of fuel pump/regulator setup are you using? If you already have an aftermarket FPR you will need to bump the fuel pressure up to at least 43 PSI and make sure you are running return style fuel hose routing. If you aren't sure what fuel pump is installed, a Walbro 255 is a cheap replacement that will out perform a stock fuel pump and has tons of information about how to install since they are popular in the aftermarket world.
I am personally running a large bridgeport t2 keg converted to NA with s5 na rotors. However, I am still running the t2 intake but port matched all the runner joints and ported the TB. I plan to go ITB in the next year or so and I'm running an Apexi PowerFC stand alone using Speed Density tune. When I switch to ITBs I am going to try and continue using a Speed Density tune but if the vacuum signal isn't strong enough I will wire the TPS in to the MAP sensor so I can trick the PowerFC into Alpha-N tuning since it is not capable of that out of the box. I got my PowerFC in a package deal when I bought the engine and it's relatively easy to install on an s4 car. However, if I were going to do a from scratch build I would probably use a Megasquirt v3 and run a new harness. If you jump over to the Megasquirt section in the Engine Management forums you will see a plethora of information to help you out. Have you asked Rotary Performance what they prefer to tune? I would suggest just buying whatever ECU they are most comfortable with since they will be doing the tune.
Hopefully others who have first hand experience with your situation can also chime in and make sure all my statements are correct but I'm fairly confident I covered all the major points. Let us know more details on what all you purchase and all the steps you take to get your car running on FI. Good luck!
Did you change the ignition setup when you added the carb? If you're running a distributor I'm not sure if this would work with FI but otherwise you would need a CAS (crank angle sensor) and stock FI coils.
Obviously you also need to get some fuel injectors. A lot of the guys in this NA performance section are switching to just running 2 ID1000 injectors in the primary injector location in the keg and not running any secondaries. Injector tech has come a long way since our cars were designed so large injectors are now able to get good idle characteristics at low duty cycles. Plus not needing to run staged injection certainly simplifies things.
What kind of fuel pump/regulator setup are you using? If you already have an aftermarket FPR you will need to bump the fuel pressure up to at least 43 PSI and make sure you are running return style fuel hose routing. If you aren't sure what fuel pump is installed, a Walbro 255 is a cheap replacement that will out perform a stock fuel pump and has tons of information about how to install since they are popular in the aftermarket world.
I am personally running a large bridgeport t2 keg converted to NA with s5 na rotors. However, I am still running the t2 intake but port matched all the runner joints and ported the TB. I plan to go ITB in the next year or so and I'm running an Apexi PowerFC stand alone using Speed Density tune. When I switch to ITBs I am going to try and continue using a Speed Density tune but if the vacuum signal isn't strong enough I will wire the TPS in to the MAP sensor so I can trick the PowerFC into Alpha-N tuning since it is not capable of that out of the box. I got my PowerFC in a package deal when I bought the engine and it's relatively easy to install on an s4 car. However, if I were going to do a from scratch build I would probably use a Megasquirt v3 and run a new harness. If you jump over to the Megasquirt section in the Engine Management forums you will see a plethora of information to help you out. Have you asked Rotary Performance what they prefer to tune? I would suggest just buying whatever ECU they are most comfortable with since they will be doing the tune.
Hopefully others who have first hand experience with your situation can also chime in and make sure all my statements are correct but I'm fairly confident I covered all the major points. Let us know more details on what all you purchase and all the steps you take to get your car running on FI. Good luck!
09-22-16, 09:11 PM
#4
SAVE FOR EFI
Thread Starter
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Newton,KS.
Posts: 486
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am running a distributor from 12A, aftermarket coils, the keg itself doesn't have bungs for injectors as it has old 13B housings.
I'm new to converting back to F.I., but I will list the parts I end up getting.
I am running an aftermarket regulator, but its a low pressure one for carb. It has oem pump so might upgrade that and regulator at same time. I have no idea what you were referring to in regards to the tunes. I will be letting Rotary Perf. give me advice on that. They did an awesome job on my FD a year ago to tune from scratch from a non running car to 300 hp.
I'm new to converting back to F.I., but I will list the parts I end up getting.
I am running an aftermarket regulator, but its a low pressure one for carb. It has oem pump so might upgrade that and regulator at same time. I have no idea what you were referring to in regards to the tunes. I will be letting Rotary Perf. give me advice on that. They did an awesome job on my FD a year ago to tune from scratch from a non running car to 300 hp.
09-23-16, 11:04 AM
#5
I was just saying ask them what ECU they prefer to tune on (megasquirt, Haltech, PowerFC, Adaptronic, etc.) and buy that one. In general builds work out better if you buy the ECU that your tuner is very comfortable with.
Your fuel injector choices are now going to be a little interesting... You will have to get ITBs that have provisions for installing injectors on the them but I'm thinking your low RPM cruise and low load throttle response will not be as crisp as if you had the locations in the housings. But that is kind of a moot point since your engine is what it is. Another option would be to get a new Holley style intake like Racing Beat sells and use a 4150 style throttle body. These usually have spots for injectors and would probably simplify things a bit but I have not personally seen anyone using one. But if you want to keep your weber manifold I believe most ITB choices have options available for getting injector holes machined in them. Just call up Borla Induction or EFIhardware or Jenvey and let them know you want a 2 ITB setup to replace Webers and that you need 2 spots for injectors and they will hook you up.
As far as the distributor goes, I believe you can leave that and use a Megasquirt ECU set up to control fuel only. There are multiple first gen guys doing just this on the forums. This is probably the easiest route but make sure Rotary Performance are ok with tuning a Megasquirt.
Get a Walbro 255 and an Aeromotive FPR and you should be good to go fuel wise. I believe 43.5 PSI is stock fuel pressure.
It's too bad you didn't start this project about 2 years ago. I was living down near Coffeyville and would have gladly popped over your way to throw in a helping hand. However, there are a few guys in the Wichita area on here that you might hit up for some helping hands.
Your fuel injector choices are now going to be a little interesting... You will have to get ITBs that have provisions for installing injectors on the them but I'm thinking your low RPM cruise and low load throttle response will not be as crisp as if you had the locations in the housings. But that is kind of a moot point since your engine is what it is. Another option would be to get a new Holley style intake like Racing Beat sells and use a 4150 style throttle body. These usually have spots for injectors and would probably simplify things a bit but I have not personally seen anyone using one. But if you want to keep your weber manifold I believe most ITB choices have options available for getting injector holes machined in them. Just call up Borla Induction or EFIhardware or Jenvey and let them know you want a 2 ITB setup to replace Webers and that you need 2 spots for injectors and they will hook you up.
As far as the distributor goes, I believe you can leave that and use a Megasquirt ECU set up to control fuel only. There are multiple first gen guys doing just this on the forums. This is probably the easiest route but make sure Rotary Performance are ok with tuning a Megasquirt.
Get a Walbro 255 and an Aeromotive FPR and you should be good to go fuel wise. I believe 43.5 PSI is stock fuel pressure.
It's too bad you didn't start this project about 2 years ago. I was living down near Coffeyville and would have gladly popped over your way to throw in a helping hand. However, there are a few guys in the Wichita area on here that you might hit up for some helping hands.
Last edited by Lavitzlegend; 09-23-16 at 11:08 AM.
09-23-16, 11:47 AM
#6
SAVE FOR EFI
Thread Starter
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Newton,KS.
Posts: 486
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Your help would of been greatly appreciated!
I did and can do all the install work, its just the tuning part I don't care to mess with and ruin a good engine. This engine doesn't like to cruise or coast at all!! Have to be ALL in...or off the throttle...but its not a DD, so it does what we need it to do.
I do like the Weber manifold for its looks so I'll stick with that. The Jenvey throttle bottle comes ready to accept 2 injectors. I will be getting the Walbro and FPR to manage the fuel.
I did and can do all the install work, its just the tuning part I don't care to mess with and ruin a good engine. This engine doesn't like to cruise or coast at all!! Have to be ALL in...or off the throttle...but its not a DD, so it does what we need it to do.
I do like the Weber manifold for its looks so I'll stick with that. The Jenvey throttle bottle comes ready to accept 2 injectors. I will be getting the Walbro and FPR to manage the fuel.
Trending Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
FB_MItch
1st Generation Specific (1979-1985)
4
08-18-16 10:37 AM